Cheesecake Factory- a few facts

[KateW]

Perhaps I should first ask if you're complaining about people's rudeness, or asking for an explanation of why they laugh.

I know you are a culinary student and have expressed interest in cooking at a place such as Tru someday. Why is that more interesting than cooking in a Ruby Tuesday or a Olive Garden? I really hope you were asking for insight into more interesting food and that you find some of that here, if not in school.

I'm looking for an explanation. I've asked a couple times what's so bad about Olive Garden, and haven't gotten an answer. So it's not serious food, but honestly, don't any of you ever eat just because you're hungry? Not because you want to tell stories about the food you ate?

I've also said before that each time I go out to eat doesn't have to be an experience to remember. Sometimes I don't want anything more than for the food to fill me up and not make me sick. (no small feat, as I've mentioned. being filling and not making me sick is almost a contradiction.) It would take a major toll on my time, health, weight and wallet to eat at an exceptional place every day, especially in the area where I live. I would probably have to go to Boston (about 2 hours north) to see anything BUT chain restaurants. Or maybe the Cape. But heck, I just want lunch, not an all day excursion.

Cooking in a place like Tru is more interesting to me because I hope it involves more creativity. Dumping food in a fryolater, taking it out when it floats and putting it on a plate is not creative. Making food look and taste beautiful is.

Maybe I'm not as serious about food as most of you. I want the food I eat to be good, but it doesn't have to be creative or unique.

And now I have to go order Chinese food for the SO and me. Anyone got a problem with that?

[hollywood]

i had lunch at applebee's today.

You're fired.

Did you have riblets? What exactly are riblets?

[rickster]

FWIW, in this past Sunday's New York Times Connecticut section, Mark Bittman praises a meal he had at The Olive Garden as being better and more enjoyable than one he had at one of Connecticut's more noteworthy and expensive Italian restaurants (not named), particularly when cost was taken into account.

[hollywood]

Let's say we were in an English class, -- maybe the better comparison is made with an honors class in English -- and the teacher started a discussion with the students about the books they may have read over the summer. The first person who mentions reading a Reader's Digest version of a novel is going to illicit a giggle or two.

So, you're OK with the Classics Illustrated comic?

[sammy]

Another downside to eating (and spending money) at chains is that it will lead to having no choice but to eat at chains. Same reason not to by fish at the supermarket, the local fishmonger will be a thing of the past. Not good.

[MatthewB]

Kate,

Let me put it this way . . .

It's not about going out to eat at wonderful restaurants all the time. (I don't eat out often & when I do it's usually local ethic places or during a trip to Chicago.)

What it's about is this: A weeknight, I'm tired & blah blah blah, I want something eat. Do I go to OG or CF? No, I reach in the pantry for some linguine, canned anchovies, EVVO, & some fresh garlic. I made a simple sauce with the anchovies, EVVO, & garlic and I boil some pasta. Mix together. Pour a glass of wine. Cut off a big slice of bread. I have a meal for about $2.50.

I don't do this often as I don't eat a lot of pasta. But--given a *choice*--this trumps a chain everytime.

[KateW]

I love pasta and that sounds excellent. But when I go out to eat it's because I don't feel like cooking. Tiny, hot kitchen, nothing decent in the cupboard, tired, whatever the reason.

I see your point, though.

[tommy]

So it's not serious food, but honestly, don't any of you ever eat just because you're hungry?  Not because you want to tell stories about the food you ate?

I've also said before that each time I go out to eat doesn't have to be an experience to remember.  Sometimes I don't want anything more than for the food to fill me up and not make me sick. (no small feat, as I've mentioned.  being filling and not making me sick is almost a contradiction.)

i rarely eat only to get filled up. it's like having sex just to have sex...going trhough the motions so to speak. what's the point? (unless you're simply trying to make babies)

i stared at the menu at Applebee's for about 10 minutes. nothing looked appetizing. everything was turning my stomach. i commented to my friend "does *everything* have cheese on it?" i didn't know what to order. the only thing that didn't seem gross was the blackened chicken salad. i think i only ordered it because my friend ordered the same.

i'm not sure, but i hope the Cheesecake Factory is a bit of a step up from applebee's.

Edited July 14, 2003 by tommy (log)

[rdailey]

I've been thinking for a while that people on egullet 'turn up their noses' a lot but I didn't know how to word it or where to post it.  When I say I like Olive Garden and people laugh, I still wonder why.

Let's say we were in an English class, -- maybe the better comparison is made with an honors class in English -- and the teacher started a discussion with the students about the books they may have read over the summer. The first person who mentions reading a Reader's Digest version of a novel is going to illicit a giggle or two. People who take food seriously, are not likely to take the Olive Garden food seriously in culinary terms. That's not to say it's wrong to enjoy eating there, but it's hard to make a good argument that the standards are high there.

Please don't tell me that eGullet is some sort of honors class, where you will be laughed at if you like Olive Garden? It hasn't reached that level of elitism, has it?

To use your example, reading classic literature is certainly a wonderful endevor, but picking up a good trashy novel is very refreshing as well.

I'm not a fan of chains like Applebees, OG, etc, but they are growing like crazy and here to stay, whether you spend your dollar at the little local Thai place or not. Just take a look at what happend to all of the small booksellers thoughout the country.

[hollywood]

i rarely eat only to get filled up.  it's like having sex just to have sex...going trhough the motions so to speak.  what's the point?   

Interesting analogy. Would you rather eat at Uma's or Divine's?

[MatthewB]

it's like having sex just to have sex...going trhough the motions so to speak.  what's the point?   

Have you ever wondered about the person who originated the following . . . ?

"Sex is like pizza. When it's good, it's really really good. When it's bad, it's still good."

[KateW]

i rarely eat only to get filled up.  it's like having sex just to have sex...going trhough the motions so to speak.  what's the point?   

i stared at the menu at Applebee's for about 10 minutes.  nothing looked appetizing.  everything was turning my stomach.  i commented to my friend "does *everything* have cheese on it?" i'm not sure, but i hope the Cheesecake Factory is a bit of a step up from applebee's.

CF is more complex than Applebee's. It might not have cheese on it, but it'll have 9 other things on it. Check out the menu here. As for the sex comment, that's another can of worms you don't want to get into with me.

And you can order stuff and "86 the cheese";)

Edited July 14, 2003 by KateW (log)

[MatthewB]

I'm not a fan of chains like Applebees, OG, etc, but they are growing like crazy and here to stay, whether you spend your dollar at the little local Thai place or not.  Just take a look at what happend to all of the small booksellers thoughout the country.

Is this the eGullet version of fatalism?

[hollywood]

As for the sex comment, that's another can of worms you don't want to get into with me. 

Dr. Freud, paging Dr. Freud?

[MatthewB]

Interesting analogy.  Would you rather eat at Uma's or Divine's?

So many posts in so little time . . .

As for me, do you have to ask?

[KateW]

You have no idea Hollywood

Edited July 14, 2003 by KateW (log)

[MatthewB]

As for the sex comment, that's another can of worms you don't want to get into with me. 

And you can order stuff and "86 the cheese";)

Speaking of sex & a can of worms . . .

Remember Melville's chapter in Moby Dick where the sailors are kneading whale sperm?

It was always interesting to lead a class discussion on that chapter.

[rdailey]

I'm not a fan of chains like Applebees, OG, etc, but they are growing like crazy and here to stay, whether you spend your dollar at the little local Thai place or not.  Just take a look at what happend to all of the small booksellers thoughout the country.

Is this the eGullet version of fatalism?

Sadly, it does seem inevitable in many consumer based industries.

[hollywood]

Interesting analogy.  Would you rather eat at Uma's or Divine's?

So many posts in so little time . . .

As for me, do you have to ask?

Given the pizza metaphor, if Uma's were closed would you eat at Divine's or cook at home?

[KateW]

As for the sex comment, that's another can of worms you don't want to get into with me. 

And you can order stuff and "86 the cheese";)

Speaking of sex & a can of worms . . .

Remember Melville's chapter in Moby Dick where the sailors are kneading whale sperm?

It was always interesting to lead a class discussion on that chapter.

Oh dear...shall we start a new thread so you can explain this one? Or has this topic gone off-topic enough that we can just talk about it here?

[mcdowell]

I'm looking for an explanation.  I've asked a couple times what's so bad about Olive Garden, and haven't gotten an answer.  So it's not serious food, but honestly, don't any of you ever eat just because you're hungry? 

Food as fuel : if that's your goal, then there's nothing wrong with chains.

I'm curious though: if you don't apply taste as one of the primary factors in making decisions about what goes into your body, then what are your criteria?

Predictability/Convenience : when I spend at chains, that's the primary reason. The kids love to go to Chili's, know what they're going to order, and chat in the car on the way over about which desert they're going to get. Try as we might to train them to be more adventurous, there are still times when they want the comfortable predictability that Chili's or Applebees will bring them. The deal we make is that we'll eat their way for a meal, then they have to come with us and eat our way. Works well.

Why do I think Olive Garden is bad? I don't. I find it mediocre, at best. It's frustrating to me to spend forty or fifty dollars on a meal that's not as good as one that would come out of my kitchen with just two hours work for thirty dollars less (and I'm a good cook, but not a great cook). I can eat a lot better for the same money at other places. Comes down to taste and values.

Meals don't have to be adventures. Most aren't, really. But I've made the personal value-based decision (one shared by many on eGullet, it appears) that what I eat and what I drink must satisfy me on a number of levels, and these levels are defined by personal metrics all revolving around what makes me happy when I eat. That doesn't make me inflexible or snobbish. It's where my head (and my palate) are, that's all.

When someone says that they "don't like" chains, you shouldn't take offense. Not everyone's values align, nor should they. Be secure in your opinions, stand by your tastes and your decisions, and don't let people of differing opinions put you on the defensive. There's a lot of asses out there (and a few here) who will tell you that you're wrong in your opinion or your taste, when all of these things are subjective. There simply is not right and wrong in this arena. So do what you want, eat where you want - it's the great benefit of living in a free society.

As counter-point to all this, I took some friends to a very authentic Thai place about six months ago, thinking that it would be a great experience and we'd all enjoy it. I ordered sauted froglegs in a wonderful chili sauce. Truely great food, right up to the moment when my companions whispered amongst themselves, then one of them declared that "that food on your plate disgusts us, and makes us a little sad". Ruined my meal, but didn't make me question my taste.

[MatthewB]

I'm not a fan of chains like Applebees, OG, etc, but they are growing like crazy and here to stay, whether you spend your dollar at the little local Thai place or not.  Just take a look at what happend to all of the small booksellers thoughout the country.

Is this the eGullet version of fatalism?

Sadly, it does seem inevitable in many consumer based industries.

Vive La Revolution!

[hollywood]

You have no idea Hollywood

Just reading between the lines.

[tommy]

When someone says that they "don't like" chains, you shouldn't take offense.

i bet that doesn't offend most. what i find offensive is when people say things like "how can [stupid] people eat that shit [that you like]."

/dead horse flogging.

[KateW]

I'm curious though: if you don't apply taste as one of the primary factors in making decisions about what goes into your body, then what are your criteria?

I do apply taste as a primary factor. I think Olive Garden tastes good. It tastes how it should, and isn't that what tasting good is? There is good, and there is GOOD, and Olive Garden is good.

Wow, the word good looks really weird now.