TDG: IGT Not In Good Taste

[Fat Guy]

Craig Camp sneezes at IGT.

+++

Be sure to check The Daily Gullet home page daily for new articles (most every weekday), hot topics, site announcements, and more.

[tunina]

Craig,

Your Italian wine law articles are very helpful. I imagine the wine designations started out as a good idea perhaps in regards to protecting indigenous grape types and geographical production zones. Unfortunately, it seems that all they really have become are marketing tools. Do you agree?

[Fat Guy]

Marketing tools are great if they provide information. But if IGT provides almost no meaningful information it's merely form without substance.

[Craig Camp]

IGT should have been a good thing for growers making good wines outside of the DOC. It ended up being so broad as to mean nothing. The major beneficiaries of the IGT law have been large cooperatives who can now pump out tasteless wines with a nicer sounding name on it. IGT has been a swell marketing tool for cheap pinot grigio. Just what the image of Italian wine needed.

[Craig Camp]

Craig,

Your Italian wine law articles are very helpful. I imagine the wine designations started out as a good idea perhaps in regards to protecting indigenous grape types and geographical production zones. Unfortunately, it seems that all they really have become are marketing tools. Do you agree?

IGT could have been a good way to protect and promote many indigenous varietals, but then they included all the newer varietals too. They would have had to exclude non-traditional varieties from the IGT to make an impact and that was not going to happen. Don't forget Tuscany had a lot of influence in the IGT law and they wanted to include all the French varietals.

["T"]

One question. Why is a Primitivo grown in Puglia, native to Puglia and bottled in Puglia come under the I.G.T. designation and not DOC or DOCG?

[Ron Johnson]

When I buy Italian wine I never look at the label for DOCG or IGT or any other such designation because its meaningless. By tasting wines found Through recommendations from friends in Italy, trusted retailers, and some choice literature and criticism, I have come to know what I like and I buy that. The letters on the bottle are of no concern to me.

This is also true for all French wine that I buy.

Edited April 15, 2003 by Ron Johnson (log)

[Craig Camp]

One question. Why is a Primitivo grown in Puglia, native to Puglia and bottled in Puglia come under the I.G.T. designation and not DOC or DOCG?

Primitivo has one DOC in Puglia, Primitivo di Manduria. Primitivo grown in Puglia outside that one zone is IGT. Primitivo is included in the following IGT's: Murgia, Puglia, Salento and Valle d'Itria where it can be either blended into an IGT rosso or if it is 100% primitivo, they can use the varietal on the label.

[Craig Camp]

When I buy Italian wine I never look at the label for DOCG or IGT or any other such designation because its meaningless.  By tasting wines found Through recommendations from friends in Italy, trusted retailers, and some choice literature and criticism, I have come to know what I like and I buy that.  The letters on the bottle are of no concern to me.

This is also true for all French wine that I buy.

A sound strategy for those who know what they want. However, the marketing behind IGT has confused many less informed consumers. Often people think IGT is the realm of super-Tuscans and the like and are led to believe that all IGT wines are in some sort of a super category.

[Phadraig]

Dear Craig:

I do not know why you are in such a bad mood about IGT (and DOCG for that matter: previous article). Wine is an agricultural product. It defies categorizations. What humans have done is to TRY to put some meaningful spin to it. All the systems of wine law I have ever studied never promised perfection and all the systems have allowed for evolution, for changes and re-structuring. Italy was stuck with Vino da Tavola as the sole back up for non DOC/DOCG wines and so created IGT. To me that's acknowledging the shortcomings of the process and refining it. That deserves kudos not brick bats.

I'll pull out a few choices quotes.

"No, that wasn't a sneeze, it was IGT.....the new wine classification introduced in 2002...." It was introduced in 1992.

"To further confuse the matter, the phrase 'table wine' in the US is a legal designation set by the government to denote all wines of less than 14.5% alcohol." Were you trying to equate the Italian "Vino da Tavola" with something lowly or maybe even irrelevant? But do you really think most American wine drinkers know the diff, or care? I have been teaching them for 28 years and I don't think so. BTW, the limit for "Table Wine" in the US is 14% not 14.5%.

"These producers were being forced to give their top wines...the lowly Vino da Tavola...designation". Yes, and Piero and Lodovico et al. were wringing their hands and crying about this indignity all the way to the bank.

"There are oceans of 'Veneto I.G.T.' wine arriving in the USA....white, red, rose......39 permitted grape varieties.. from any of 7 provinces. Pretty demanding requirements, right?" One could say much the same thing about the French Vin de Pays (the IGT equivalent) "Vin de Pays d'Oc". Some are $5 great bargains and some cost $75 (rip-offs--rips-off?--or not). I hear no lamentations against Vin de Pays.

"When you see an IGT wine at $50 you have a pretty good idea it is not in the industrial grade category. But, sorry, no guarantee". Is there EVER a guarantee that a given individual will love a bottle of wine, $5 or $50 whether it is IGT, DOC or DOCG at whatever price? Not! That's why there are blind tastings, that's why we read comments by others of (hopefully) more experience, that's what makes the market place the market place.

"Italian wine law is bursting at the seams....Italy is overwhelmed by excellent wines, but they don't just fit well into the few categories and the constrictions of DOC & G, DOC and IGT". Craig, it's hard enough to teach students about Italy's four wine categories. Do you want 8? 20? I can see it now: "Let's see...it costs $35 and most of us think it's great, but it's not made with a famous grape: okay, that goes into the DEAL (Don't Expect A Lot) classification. This one is pure Sangiovese and the cooperage are classic botti but they're made from American oak, so that goes into the YAYK (Yin and Yank) classification." Oy!

Sincerely,

Patrick W Fegan

[Craig Camp]

Patrick,

I think you are a bit idealistic in your assessment of wine laws in general. You say the laws are flexible and have allowed for evolution. One thing is clear the laws have not been flexible and only change when forced to by the market.

Your view of wine as some simple agricultural product ignores the fact that most wine is an industrial product - not made by some small farmer somewhere. It is the large industrial firms that make wine law. Yes IGT was created in response to the shortcomings of the previous system but it did not successfully deal with the problems that existed.

I did not cry out about the poor Vin de Pays d'Oc wines because I was writing about Italian wine law.

I certainly do not wish to make it harder for you to teach your students by adding categories to the Italian wine law. There would be no purpose in that, but you should not teach students that these laws are some sort of an indication of quality. If you do so you are the one doing the confusing.

If you think that Italy does not use DOCG and IGT as marketing tools you are kidding yourself.

Thanks for the correction on the my typo - indeed it was 1992. Now I am starting to confuse centuries. A definite sign of aging.

[Phadraig]

Craig,

Believe me, I have worked harvests on two continents: my attitudes about winemaking and winelaws are anything but idealistic

As for the industrial nature of many wines, granted. The really industrial stuff is labeled Vino da Tavola and rarely gets marketed here anymore. The cut above that is called IGT for the most part except for that small slice that is made that could not fit into DOC or DOCG.

I don't believe I wrote that DOC or IGT were not used as marketing tools. If I did then that would be a classic case of Weinheimer's Disease.

Of course they are used as marketing tools; but marketing was not the genesis of DOC. It was at its base a desire to build a credidible system of wine regulations for a world that had until really the last generation come to view Italian wines as of laughably poor quality. Obviously, the creation of the DOC laws helped turn the world's mind around about Italian wines (one need only look at which country sells us the most wine today versus which one did 30 years ago). To bash them for using DOC et al. as a marketing tool on top of its orginal aim as an assurance of authenticity is unfair.

"...but you should not teach students that these laws are some sort of an indication of quality." You know better than that, Craig: I have never suggested or taught (nor have the Italian or French lawmakers, by the way) that DOC, IGT, or DOC & G are indicators of QUALITY, for that is impossible given not only personal tastes but defendable interpretations of a theme. I have always taught that they gauranteed AUTHENTICITY.

Best,

Patrick W Fegan

[Craig Camp]

Patrick I would generally agree with your last statement.

For those of you who don't know we are happy to welcome to eGullet, Patrick Fegan, one of the foremost wine educators on the planet. You can visit his site at:

The Chicago Wine School

Patrick we hope you are a regular visitor.

Edited April 15, 2003 by Craig Camp (log)

[Phadraig]

Dear Craig,

We have to "fight" more often. Thanks for the plug. Let's do this every month: I could use the business!

Best,

Patrick W Fegan