Osmotolerant yeast in regular pizza dough

[FlashJack]

Looking through various threads I notice that people seem to add extra 'normal' instant yeast when they don't have an osmotolerant yeast called for in a particular recipe. My question is about the opposite case.

 

I have plenty of osmotolerant yeast (SAF gold). Is there any reason not to use it in a non-enriched pizza dough?

 

[scott123]

The scientists call dead yeast a 'reduction agent' and they'll tell you how reducing helps with extensibility.  Dough should be extensible, so, at first glance, dead yeast appears to be good stuff. But with just about every aspect regarding pizza, the golden mean is critical.  The extensibility one gets without adding dead yeast is more than sufficient enough for pizza dough. If you start adding dead yeast, when you go to knuckle stretch it, it's going to want to plummet to the ground.

 

Instead of calling dead yeast a reduction agent, I'd be more tempted to refer to it as a gluten inhibitor.  And gluten, in pizza, is absolutely critical.

When you're using yeast in an off label environment, it's going to be inhospitable, and you're going to see a greater proportion of dead yeast than if you used it in it's intended environment.  You can offset the lack of rising power by ramping up the yeast, but, as you do so, you're ramping up the dead yeast.

Now, how much of an impact is this going to have?  I've never seen this studied, so I can't say.  Maybe if you started off with 14% protein flour, some extra dead yeast might go unnoticeable, but, I can't say for certain. One thing I do know, for certain, though, is that 14% white flour (16% on the label) doesn't exist in Australia.

If you're starting with either weak Australian flour or weak imported Italian 00, the gluten inhibition you're going to see from counter-indicated yeast could be pretty dramatic. And if you push the fermentation clock, then that might make things even worse.

[FlashJack]

Thank you @scott123. Your replies are always thoughtful and generous.

 

I take your point that it's best to send a specialist on a specialist mission but I do wonder what is the volume of dead yeast in a given batch of dough. It's measurable but ...

 

Re flour: I have used many different 'baker's flours' with good results. These around ~12-13%.

 

I've switched to a flour that claims 16%. It has revolutionised my dough.

 

[scott123]

9 hours ago, FlashJack said:

Thank you @scott123. Your replies are always thoughtful and generous.

 

I take your point that it's best to send a specialist on a specialist mission but I do wonder what is the volume of dead yeast in a given batch of dough. It's measurable but ...

 

You're welcome! Thanks for the kind words.

 

I dig some digging and found this:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0308814614015817?via%3Dihub

The content is behind a paywall, but, summarizing, the study's authors found that the amount of dead yeast in various dried and fresh commercial products varied by quite a bit- up to about 80 times.  The authors found that this variation produced a recognizable weakening effect in the dough. In their words, "This makes GSH [the glutathione in dead yeast] an important ingredient rather than a minor accompanying substance. "

 

I also found this:

https://www.lallemand.com/BakerYeastNA/eng/PDFs/LBU PDF FILES/1_7REDUC.PDF
 

Quote

REDUCING AGENTS AND MIX TIME REDUCERS

Nonleavening Yeast 0.25–1.0% Natural source of glutathione

Now, you may very well be in that .25% range for total yeast being added to the dough, and dead yeast will be a small fraction of that. Initially (up to 8% based on the first study I linked to).  It's important to remember, though, that yeast is a processed derived ingredient- that as you proof the dough, you're creating more and more dead yeast. Depending on how unhappy osmotolerant yeast is in less enriched dough, you might hit that .25% metric and see weakening.

Can I guarantee that you'll see weakening? No.  But I do believe that the ranges being discussed above are low enough to make dead yeast a very viable player in dough rheology. In my somewhat purist opinion, I don't think it's something you should underestimate. 
 

Quote

I've switched to a flour that claims 16%. It has revolutionised my dough.

Interesting   15.5% protein with a 360 W value is... odd. 

 

https://www.mulinocaputo.it/prodotti/oro/?lang=en

 

Caputo's Manitoba is W 380 (avg) at 14.5%.  W, as I'm sure you're aware, is gas trapping ability, and gas is trapped by gluten, which is formed from protein. There are factors that might skew the relationship, but, in white flour, the two tend to be very proportional. The Polselli number is just not in line with the typical protein/w ratio you see in other Neapolitan flours.  Apparently, they have a history posting irregular protein specs:

 

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=59615.msg597919#msg597919

I'm not accusing Polselli of funny business, but, at the same time, I might take that 15.5% spec with a grain of salt.  Protein can actually be a little misleading- which is why the Europeans came up with the W value.  The W value doesn't lie.  At 360, the Super is basically Polselli's Manitoba, clocking in as being slightly weaker than the Caputo Manitoba.  360 is pretty respectable.  It's basically unmalted American bread flour.  With some diastatic malt, it becomes ideal for a typical home oven. Now, if you've got a wood fired oven or an Ooni, it might be a little on the strong side for Neapolitan.

Ultimately, though, my protein spec concern is just me being a little pedantic   Thanks for bringing this flour to my attention. I think I might have written it off earlier based on the 10% protein spec, but, at 360 W, I'll be adding it to my list of viable flours.

[FlashJack]

Scott,

 

thanks again for your thoughtfulness and thoroughness. I followed the links -- some went over my head but I'm grateful.

 

Do try the Polessi Super if you have a chance. I'd be very interested in your thoughts.

 

As to my original question, I'll make identical batches to the best extent possible with osmotolerant and non-osmotolerant yeast and see if I can identify any difference.

 

[FlashJack]

@scott123You might be interested in a brief discussion of nutritional yeast as a reducing agent in this week's episode of Good Food on KCRW. It's pretty much just in passing (and in reference to noodles). It's about five minutes in.