What's the origin of shishbarak?

[shawarma_prince]

I've always been curious about the origin of this dish. Some research tells me it originated in pre Islamic Persia. Was it brought there by Turks/Mongols? Chinese influence along the silk road? Or independently created in Persian kitchens? Manti is supposed to have a turkic origin. How are these two dishes different?

[Hassouni]

Manti is definitely Turkic in origin, and shishbarak seems like it's a Turkic thing, given that it's basically a baked mantı, however at least the word, I discovered, is Persian. See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshpara 

 

The Turks and Mongols weren't really much a thing in the Middle East until after the advent of Islam, so its entry into the Arabic language would have been through contact with the Sassanian empire

[liuzhou]

9 hours ago, Hassouni said:

however at least the word, I discovered, is Persian

 

 

According to the OED the word is Syrian Arabic.

 

Quote

shawarma, n.

 

Brit. /ʃəˈwɔːmə/, /ʃəˈwɑːmə/, U.S. /ʃəˈwɑrmə/

 

Forms: 19– shawarma, 19– shawirma

 

[‹ Syrian colloquial Arabic šāwirma, šawirma ‹ Turkish çevirme sliced meat roasted on a spit or skewer ‹ çevirmek to turn, rotate.]

 

In the cuisine of certain Arabic-speaking countries: meat cooked on a spit and served in thin slices, often rolled in pita bread and sold as a street snack; a doner kebab.

 

 

[shawarma_prince]

On 1/18/2020 at 1:48 PM, Hassouni said:

Manti is definitely Turkic in origin, and shishbarak seems like it's a Turkic thing, given that it's basically a baked mantı, however at least the word, I discovered, is Persian. See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshpara 

 

The Turks and Mongols weren't really much a thing in the Middle East until after the advent of Islam, so its entry into the Arabic language would have been through contact with the Sassanian empire

 

Interesting. So I guess the internet is wrong on it being a pre islamic Persian dish.

 

https://www.proprofs.com/discuss/q/1420162/how-is-ravioli-different-from-joshpara

 

[shawarma_prince]

Also

 

https://courses.hamilton.edu/edwaters/origin

 

Funny how they got the origin so wrong. I always thought it was Turkish too.

[Hassouni]

12 minutes ago, shawarma_prince said:

Also

 

https://courses.hamilton.edu/edwaters/origin

 

Funny how they got the origin so wrong. I always thought it was Turkish too.

 

Is this a whole class on shishbarak??

[shawarma_prince]

I have no idea if it is a whole class.

 

My Persian friends definitely insist that shish barak is Persian.

[shawarma_prince]

Anybody else have anything to add to this topic?

[shawarma_prince]

And what about aushak (afghan ravioli)>