Lemon Hart 80

[Hassouni]

So I lucked upon a couple bottles of the stuff today, and have access to the remaining ten cases in the US (!), should I choose to cough up the cash.

I really like the stuff, and am tempted to get at least a case, but how does it compare with the El Dorado 5? I've had the 8 once and quite liked it, but never tried the 5. If the 5 is comparable, I may just enjoy these 2 bottles and forget it, as the LH80 is $24 a pop (ED 5 is way less, hell, I get the ED12 for $24)

[Rafa]

How does the LH80 compare with the 151? To me the LH151 is much oilier and darker in flavor than any of the El Dorados, certainly than any of the younger ones in the line. As for how the ED5 compares with the 8, it's different juice, sharing distillate from ED's wood coffey still with the 8 but nothing else. The El Dorado rums aren't the same rum at different age expressions; rather, each is a unique blend from the vast collection of unique stills in the distillery's possession. (Here is a chart comparing which distillates go into which release.) I haven't had the 5 year, but reviews have compared it to the 3, but with more sweetness and barrel influence, and a lot of bright fruit. Here's a very positive review.

[bostonapothecary]

How does the LH80 compare with the 151? To me the LH151 is much oilier and darker in flavor than any of the El Dorados, certainly than any of the younger ones in the line. As for how the ED5 compares with the 8, it's different juice, sharing distillate from ED's wood coffey still with the 8 but nothing else. The El Dorado rums aren't the same rum at different age expressions; rather, each is a unique blend from the vast collection of unique stills in the distillery's possession. (Here is a chart comparing which distillates go into which release.) I haven't had the 5 year, but reviews have compared it to the 3, but with more sweetness and barrel influence, and a lot of bright fruit. Here's a very positive review.

I just found a mid century distillation paper that explained how sometimes light and heavy rums can be made from the very same distillation runs. the most neutral fractions become the light rum which see very light aging and the concentrated outer fractions go into barrels for a long time (or in hot areas) to become the basis of heavier rums. sometimes lighter rum stock is blended in afterwards. I guess this approach has all sort of unique economies.

everybody praises the pot still but even continuous column stills can be operated to make heavy rums if certain fractions are collected and recycled in certain ways to maximize ester formation in the still. one thing that makes the pot still superior is that more of the esters are ethyl-esters instead of esters of higher alcohols like amyl. I guess there is a notorious amyl-ester that smells like bananas and is considered a flaw. this ester is one reason extraordinary brandies cannot be made in continuous column stills. I've smelt banana in some rums like goslings and wondered if it was the product of that amyl-ester.

I've always wanted to take lemon hart apart and see what it was like in pieces. especially without the coloring.

[Hassouni]

I have an old-label, Pernod-Ricard bottle of LH 151, and the 80 is basically just that but diluted. Yeah, I'm aware of the differences in stills with El Dorado, was just wondering if the LH80 was comparable to the ED5. It was VERY nice in a Queen's Park Swizzle last night!

[Rafa]

How does the LH80 compare with the 151? To me the LH151 is much oilier and darker in flavor than any of the El Dorados, certainly than any of the younger ones in the line. As for how the ED5 compares with the 8, it's different juice, sharing distillate from ED's wood coffey still with the 8 but nothing else. The El Dorado rums aren't the same rum at different age expressions; rather, each is a unique blend from the vast collection of unique stills in the distillery's possession. (Here is a chart comparing which distillates go into which release.) I haven't had the 5 year, but reviews have compared it to the 3, but with more sweetness and barrel influence, and a lot of bright fruit. Here's a very positive review.

I just found a mid century distillation paper that explained how sometimes light and heavy rums can be made from the very same distillation runs. the most neutral fractions become the light rum which see very light aging and the concentrated outer fractions go into barrels for a long time (or in hot areas) to become the basis of heavier rums. sometimes lighter rum stock is blended in afterwards. I guess this approach has all sort of unique economies.

everybody praises the pot still but even continuous column stills can be operated to make heavy rums if certain fractions are collected and recycled in certain ways to maximize ester formation in the still. one thing that makes the pot still superior is that more of the esters are ethyl-esters instead of esters of higher alcohols like amyl. I guess there is a notorious amyl-ester that smells like bananas and is considered a flaw. this ester is one reason extraordinary brandies cannot be made in continuous column stills. I've smelt banana in some rums like goslings and wondered if it was the product of that amyl-ester.

I've always wanted to take lemon hart apart and see what it was like in pieces. especially without the coloring.

Interesting. I can see why those amyl-esters would be considered a flaw in grape brandies, but I tend to enjoy the banana aromas I get in Gosling's 151 among others...

I wonder if there are any independent bottlers purchasing un-colored rum from DDL. I also would love to taste LH151 without the coloring, since the heavy caramel is such a huge part of its flavor.

[Hassouni]

Yes, I think there are. On Whisky Exchange there are MANY unusually branded Demeraras, and at Hogo in DC (sister bar to the Passenger) they have a few indie Demeraras

[Hassouni]

Well, I spent more money on booze (this is getting ridiculous) and picked up some ED 5 and did a very amateurish side-by side tasting of the LH80 and that just now.

Thoughts: For $16, ED5 is a banger of a rum. Arguably the best value aged rum out there. As far as it compares to Lemon Hart....El Dorado is more refined, "smoother," sweeter. The Lemon Hart by comparison is a bit rougher around the edges, has a hint of smoke and fire, a definite hogo funk about it, and is much dryer.

They're not really comparable at all, frankly. In a simple cocktail (aged daiquiri, or an outrigger, for example), the El Dorado would be lovely. But for complex, tiki-style drinks, I feel that it would get a bit lost and muddled, whereas the Lemon Hart would stick out.

I'll do some cocktail side by sides over the next few days and report back. Maybe: Queen's Park Swizzle, Demerara Cocktail, Outrigger...any other good tests for a rum besides a daiquiri?

[Rafa]

Palmetto, El Presidente, good old Old Fashioned.

[Hassouni]

Hmmmm, I think the ED5 got properly lost in an El Presidente (or at least played very soft), whereas the Lemon Hart took a more assertive tone, demanding that you pay attention to it. I sort of like the latter quality in a rum, though I guess you could say the El Dorado "blended" better...

I think it's safe to say that despite my limited comparisons so far, the Lemon Hart has a LOT more character than the young El Dorado. That said, at this price point, the real competition pricewise for LH is ED 12...

In any case, made and just finished a Palmetto now with the ED5, we'll see how it fares against the LH in a little bit....

[FrogPrincesse]

Thoughts: For $16, ED5 is a banger of a rum. Arguably the best value aged rum out there. As far as it compares to Lemon Hart....El Dorado is more refined, "smoother," sweeter. The Lemon Hart by comparison is a bit rougher around the edges, has a hint of smoke and fire, a definite hogo funk about it, and is much dryer.

They're not really comparable at all, frankly. In a simple cocktail (aged daiquiri, or an outrigger, for example), the El Dorado would be lovely. But for complex, tiki-style drinks, I feel that it would get a bit lost and muddled, whereas the Lemon Hart would stick out.

I'll do some cocktail side by sides over the next few days and report back. Maybe: Queen's Park Swizzle, Demerara Cocktail, Outrigger...any other good tests for a rum besides a daiquiri?

Hmmmm, I think the ED5 got properly lost in an El Presidente (or at least played very soft), whereas the Lemon Hart took a more assertive tone, demanding that you pay attention to it. I sort of like the latter quality in a rum, though I guess you could say the El Dorado "blended" better...

I think it's safe to say that despite my limited comparisons so far, the Lemon Hart has a LOT more character than the young El Dorado. That said, at this price point, the real competition pricewise for LH is ED 12...

In any case, made and just finished a Palmetto now with the ED5, we'll see how it fares against the LH in a little bit....

I like ED5 in tiki drinks. I haven't tried LH 80 and don't remember ever seeing it in stores, but ED5 has a rich taste (caramel but also some spice and complexity) that mixes very well with Jamaican rum in an Ancient Marineer/Navy Grog or even aged rhum agricole in a Three Dots and a Dash, for example.

I also have ED12 but feel that it gets easily lost in tiki drinks. It's a beautiful rum but I prefer it in simpler drinks where it can shine.

[Kerry Beal]

LH 80 is available in Ontario - you can take a bottle back when you are here for the workshop if you wish.

[FrogPrincesse]

LH 80 is available in Ontario - you can take a bottle back when you are here for the workshop if you wish.

I would love to but it looks like I have a very limited baggage allowance with United, so I don't think this will work. Way too much rum in my collection already anyway.

[Hassouni]

Update - Palmetto was better with ED5 - something about the LH didn't mesh well with the Dolin rouge....but again, it had more character. The ED blended right in but didn't really distinguish itself.

Queen's Park Swizzle was good with both, but the LH, again, stuck out more

Edited April 18, 2013 by Hassouni (log)

[Rafa]

I don't understand why most of the liquor stores with good selections here in NYC (Astor, Warehouse, Sherry-Lehmann, DrinkUpNY) don't carry ED5. Astor only ever carries ED3 and one of the 12 or the 15.

Incidentally, I really like a white Palmetto with ED3 and Dolin blanc (2:1) and two dashes of mole bitters.

Edited April 18, 2013 by Rafa (log)

[Hassouni]

Not sure if this is covered elsewhere, but how is the new LH151 compared to the old one? The LH80 I can get is $24 a bottle, the 151 is $30ish....Compared to ED5 which is $16, ED8 around $22, ED12 which is $25 and ED15 which is $31.

I know with the old stuff, the 80 was just diluted 151, meaning one could create a new bottle of LH 80 (or indeed, 90 proof, 100 proof, whatever), out of the bottle of 151 and still have a decent amount of 151 to spare. If the new bottling of 151 is comparable to the old, At $30 I may just stick to the 151 and dilute it as needed.

[FrogPrincesse]

Not sure if this is covered elsewhere, but how is the new LH151 compared to the old one?

Covered in detail here.

[Hassouni]

Merci Princesse....sounds legit...