Japanese knife techniques

[paulraphael]

In step 2, the blade is horizontal, while for sogi giri, you place the blade diagonal. The main purpose of sogi giri is to give the ingredient more surface area so that it soaks up flavor quickly.

Are there any fundamental differences between these techniques besides the angle of the cut? I've done both, but always thought of them as variations on the same motion.

[Hiroyuki]

From my copy of Japanese Cooking by Shizuo Tsuji, I thought that inside draw cut towards the hand is called usu-zukuri. Or is that term specifically for fish? I mentioned in the other thread about slicing salmon that I use this technique for gravlax. The first time I did it it's SCARY! Where does the salmon flesh end and my own finger flesh begin? With big sides of salmon you need the long knife strokes so you really do need a steady hand. Though as paulraphael has already said, you get best tactile feedback from your fingertips and once you get it yo never feel like you're going to cut yourself ever.

Usu (= thin) zukuri is a type of sogi (= chipping) zukuri

Kazago usu zukuri. For usu zukuri, you have to make very thin slices. Fugu (blow fish), himame (flounder), and other very firm white-fleshed fish often cut this way.

Suzuki usu zukuri

[Hiroyuki]

In step 2, the blade is horizontal, while for sogi giri, you place the blade diagonal. The main purpose of sogi giri is to give the ingredient more surface area so that it soaks up flavor quickly.

Are there any fundamental differences between these techniques besides the angle of the cut? I've done both, but always thought of them as variations on the same motion.

I don't even know how the technique in step 2 is called. The Japanese version of the webpage uses the word (verb), "hegu", which is similar to "sogu", from which "sogi" derives.

I can say that it's easy to imagine that a very thin slice is made by moving the blade backward and forward carefully.

As for sogi giri, you make a constant cut towards you (except the initial backward and forward movement), using the entire, long blade, right?

***

From other sources, I have learned that the authentic way to make ginger slivers (hari shoga) is to cut ginger with the katsuramuki technique first and then cut the resultant sheets thinly.

***

My 25th Anniversary Edition of Japanese Cooking by Tsuji mentions both usu-zukuri and sogi-zukuri on page 165.

[Hiroyuki]

This page of the e-Cooking School website discusses kazari giri (decorative cuts).

Click one of 64K, 300K, and 1M below the title of interest, and the movie will start.

Have fun!

[David A. Goldfarb]

What is this one called?--

http://www.ehealthyrecipe.com/recipe-webapp/ecook/k0057.php

I learned to do it with one knife, first cutting the slot, then along the diagonal, rolling and again on the diagonal.

[Hiroyuki]

What is this one called?--

http://www.ehealthyrecipe.com/recipe-webapp/ecook/k0057.php

I learned to do it with one knife, first cutting the slot, then along the diagonal, rolling and again on the diagonal.

Kiri chigai

[David A. Goldfarb]

Kiri chigai

Thanks!

[Chris Amirault]

Renn mentioned Japanese Kitchen Knives: Essential Techniques and Recipes by Hiromitsu Nozaki up topic. I was at Borders today and devoted half an hour to it. I think it's an excellent book, though I don't know enough about the techniques to know how complete it is and it suffers, of course, from being still photos instead of video. I'd be very interested to know what some more skilled folks think of the book.

[paulraphael]

Interesting article on Salon about Western chefs taking Japanese knife skills class.

[Twyst]

Bumping a really old thread, but has anything changed as to whats available to assist in learning basic knife techniques for J knives? After years of doing things the european way where the tip of the knife stays on teh board most of the time I dont really understand the differences between push cutting, a straight up and down "tap chop", etc and when each would be appropriate?

Im making the switch from my german blade to a masamoto ks and a konosuke HD next week (couldnt decide so bought both ><) and want to learn how to use them effectively now!

Edited April 30, 2012 by Twyst (log)

[Dakki]

I don't think there's any quantitative difference in technique between a traditional chef's and a gyuto, just the qualitative difference you'll see from having a thinner blade and (potentially) a steeper, sharper edge. With the western-style j-knives you let the blade do the work and merely guide it with the lightest of touches, rather than muscling your way through things. Thanks to that I lost the "knife callus" on the base of my index finger years ago, so now I get zero respect from the "pros" - if I ever did.

Traditional j-knives are another matter entirely.

Edited April 30, 2012 by Dakki (log)

[budrichard]

"Bumping a really old thread, but has anything changed as to whats available to assist in learning basic knife techniques for J knives?"

You might want to peruse a copy of 'Japanese Kitchen Knives' by Nozaki.

I purchased a copy and felt its the best out there as it has pictures along with descriptions.

Also, some very nice knives!-Dick

Edited April 30, 2012 by budrichard (log)