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ATram

Methocel

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I'm new to the society and resurrected this thread in hopes of more information about Methocel. I've since realized that my post would be more appropriate in the Baking forum, so I've moved it to this thread.


Edited by gfjane (log)

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We have been trying our hand at Methylcellulose for savory cooking processes.

Hydration seems best in hot liquid. BryanZ, you say to hydrate in water. How much water to Methylcellulose? Do you then cool it and add it to purees/liquids and the like?

We have been wondering what Methylcellulose can do that conventional means cannot. Egg whites and yolks with careful cooking seem to be about as good in making "gels" and foams.

Honestly, I don't even know where to start regarding the possibilities of Methylcellulose. I bought some thinking that I would find some great usage from them but I am left guessing of what do I even do? What are some things people do? What are some things people do that would be impossible to replicate with classical cooking techniques?

I am not trying to harass Methylcellulose fans. I am simply ignorant of its basic functions and would love to know something. I have read a lot and asked around some and am still having trouble getting my head around Methylcellulose.

BTW, I have a lot of it to test with. Pounds of different types from Willpowder. I am interested in savory applications. Warm and cold.

I know different types of Methylcellulose have different properties. Not exactly sure of the simple understanding of their behaviors though...

Thank you for your help in this. I am excited to learn and would love a great place to start.

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Interesting call on the squash puree.

Although there aren't many of us making this kind of stuff here, I fully second the not adding air (with the exclamation points).

I read all the warnings about adding air, but how exactly do you prevent it when using a blender? I didn't purposely shake it or blow air into it but I have bubbles in mine :(

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Interesting call on the squash puree.

Although there aren't many of us making this kind of stuff here, I fully second the not adding air (with the exclamation points).

I'm waiting for my methylcellulose HV and tapioca maltodextrin to come in and I can't wait to use it. Have you used Tapioca maltodextrin before and if so what kind of ratios do you use? Great info on the cellulose BryanZ & rock lobster very helpful since I'm kinda a rookie at using these food chemicals.

Peace :biggrin:


"Only dull people are brilliant at breakfast"

Oscar Wilde

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I'm not BryanZ and he may give you a much more useful answer but I don't use ratios with things like tapioca maltodextrin or Ultratex (which I realize you didn't ask about). I just blitz it in a little at a time until I get the consistency I want.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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Let me explain it another way, the correct ratio is the one that gives the result you want. The amount needed can vary from fat to fat and batch to batch of the same type of fat. I haven't done any testing but I wouldn't be surprised if results can vary when using different brands of tapioca maltodextrin. You can use a ratio to get in the ballpark but if you read through threads on tapioca maltodextrin you will see many accounts of inconsistency in results using a set ratio even when working with the same type of fat. If you keep track of the amount you use on a specific fat the first time you get the result you want, it will put you close the next time but don't be surprised if it requires a bit of fine tuning each time. It may not, but it could. Try starting with 40 - 50% maltodextrin to fat and be prepared to go up to 60 - 65% for some fats.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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Methylcell is completely indigestible, much like fiber. In fact it used to be added to fiber supplements, but was taken out by the FDA because if eaten in a pure, non-hydrated state, then there was a slight risk of stomach blockage, but as are as I know, no cases were ever reported in conjunction to this.

Enough said. Is hot ice cream really worth ingesting something that should not be eaten? I highly support recipe experimentation, but we all know that not every product of modern science to hit the market has had a positive effect. I say science experiments should be left in the labs, not brought to kitchen tables.

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Methylcell is completely indigestible, much like fiber. In fact it used to be added to fiber supplements, but was taken out by the FDA because if eaten in a pure, non-hydrated state, then there was a slight risk of stomach blockage, but as are as I know, no cases were ever reported in conjunction to this.

Enough said. Is hot ice cream really worth ingesting something that should not be eaten? I highly support recipe experimentation, but we all know that not every product of modern science to hit the market has had a positive effect. I say science experiments should be left in the labs, not brought to kitchen tables.

The quote you presented as evidence actually says "if eaten in a pure, non-hydrated state, then there was a slight risk of stomach blockage". Similar warnings apply to psyllium and other fiber supplements that don't have methylcellulose added. Inadequate water has the slight risk of leading to the opposite effect of the one desired... it can plug you up. You will not find many (any?) recipes that call for methylcellulose in an unhydrated state. I don't think I've seen one. When using a warning as basis for concern, the entire warning in context really should be considered. You shouldn't drive a car without the steering wheel either, it can cause loss of control of the vehicle, but, since everybody drives their car with the steering wheel in place, it's not a major concern.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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Sorry to be a bit off top-ic but RE: Tapioca Maltodextrin, 2 parts Tap to 1 part fat is a good place to start...


2317/5000

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here is a quick breakdown for dow's methocels

they are catagorized by types....

There are five types of dow methocels

Type SGA

Type A

Type E

Type F

Type K

Each type has a different gelling temperature.

Each type has a different grade with various viscosities.

The SGA METHOCEL gels between 38-44 degrees C

The A METHOCEL gels between 50-55 degrees C

The E METHOCEL gels between 58-63 degrees C

The F METHOCEL gels between 62-68 degrees C

The K METHOCEL gels between 70-90 degrees C

The amount of heat that will be applied to the final product will determine the type of methocel that you want to use.....

For instance if you are doing a "noodle" that is going to be added to hot water, you will need to use the SGA150, it gels really fast....If you are "whipping" something that needs to be heated for a longer period of time on the stove you would want to use an E or an F.....

hope this helps and spawns more questions and experimentations

cheers

That was the most useful post in this entire thread, which has grown somewhat stale.

But I'm not trying to make hot ice cream, I'm trying to fine a consommé, such as the oxtail consommé shown in Modernist Cuisine, p. 2-376. It calls for SGA 150, but I presently only have some F50. So the question is whether I can substitute the F50 for the SGA.

It seems to me that if I heat the broth to above the gelling point, either form ought to work, although the higher viscosity of the SGA might be beneficial.

I guess if it doesn't work, I might end up with a consommé of less than perfect clarity, but I won't kill anyone.

Bob

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