Simmering while covered to thicken?

[Ducksredux]

Howdy!

Currently have Julie Sahni's Chickpeas in Ginger Sauce from Classic Indian Cooking on the stove, but I've encountered a problem that seems to be recurring with many of her recipes.

After frying some onion, garlic and ginger, adding some spices and some chopped tomato, I'm supposed to add the chickpea juices and some water, reduce the heat to low, simmer for about 10 minutes or until its reduced to a thick pulpy gravy. But isn't reducing when the water cooks off? So how can it reduce if it's covered? Sure isn't thickening while covered. My wife always yells at me to not put any water in at all, but I feel her approach can't be right either.

[JayBassin]

Thickening a gravy occurs two ways. When starches are involved, as with chickpea sauces (or old-fashioned flour gravies or roux), thickening can occur when the starch granules absorb water and swell. This is entirely independent of reduction or evaporation of water. Reduction thickening does require evaporation, but I think your recipe thickens by starch.

[Ducksredux]

So I guess there's lots of starch in the chickpea juice. Thanks, that makes sense.

Does the starch absorb water faster if the water is hotter? Like in a risotto I would add boiling water (or stock), so should I heat this water up first before adding it to increase absorption?

A clarification: I reread the recipe and it says "a pulpy gravy" not a thick pulpy gravy. And it was freaking delicious.

Thickening a gravy occurs two ways. When starches are involved, as with chickpea sauces (or old-fashioned flour gravies or roux), thickening can occur when the starch granules absorb water and swell. This is entirely independent of reduction or evaporation of water. Reduction thickening does require evaporation, but I think your recipe thickens by starch.

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[JayBassin]

So I guess there's lots of starch in the chickpea juice.  Thanks, that makes sense. 

Does the starch absorb water faster if the water is hotter? 

Yes.

[scott123]

Chickpeas don't contain that much starch. Even with the little starch they do contain, when you cook chickpeas in water, unless you cook them forever, very little starch is released. Definitely not enough starch to have any impact on the texture of a sauce. Not to mention that chickpea water has already been boiled substantially so whatever starch may be present has swelled/absorbed as much water as it's going to absorb. I think Julie recommends adding chickpea juices not for texture but for flavor.

Does Julie specify that the simmering pot be covered? If so, then the thickening occurs when the vegetables (primarily onions and tomatoes) break down into smaller pieces. These smaller pieces create a thicker consistency. There's a little bit of starch in onions but the thickening comes mostly from broken down particles of fiber.

[Geetha]

Sometimes scientific thinking goes a long way to disturb the things, and belief goes a long way in setting it right thats all that we have heard from very very experienced cooks fromm moms to grandmoms and so on

I have practised this technique to perfection as long as my belief in their method was strong. I do falter sometimes disbelieving these things in unproved science

It is more of consistency question so too is science and belief

I don't know if it can be decifered by inspecting it is just to be followed in belief, thats is why some people ask to train along side so that they may impart some of their intuition and constant belief to their students

Indian cooking can only be explained in this way the methods are similar always with total belief, for a foodie it is a new thing to learn to do but pays off a lot in terms of satisfaction

edited:Oh a lot of minor changes to improve readability

Edited April 11, 2006 by Geetha (log)