Looking for direction on which path to take

[BROWNSUGA]

I am need of advice on how to approach my desired path. I enjoy baking, but I am looking to grow as a baker and hopefully, one day turn this hobby into a part-time gig. I am particularly interested in cakes (creative, custom, wedding/party/special occasion), cookies, etc. I would like to learn more about the science of baking. I want to make great, quality cakes/cookies/pies. I thought that a baking and pastry program would be a great idea. I did enroll and took two classes during the first quarter. Unfortunately, my work schedule wont allow me to take classes during this next quarter. However, this "break" has allowed me to reevaluate my decision.

The curriculum at school did interest me very much. However, I dont know if I want to spend the kind of money right now. I would have to resort to student loans and I dont want to rack up any more debt. I am not looking to make a career change, as I plan to keep my full-time job. (There is someone that I may partner with who also has the same situation and desires.) I have the books (i.e professional baking books) that were for the curriculum. I am thinking that I could just take the time, read through the books and learn on my own. My quest for information relates to the baking part of it and the business side.) The decorating part can be learned through other means.

I dont know if I should:

1) Return to school and complete the program

2) Read and learn on my own using the books for the curriculum and other sources. Instead of school, focus more on learning about the business side of things through classes/seminars at local community college, small business development centers, etc.

3) Any other advice?

Also, I wanted to know if there are any short term courses anywhere that may focus on the things I am looking for instead of having to take a full baking and pastry program.

Any advice or input would be appreciated.

Edited December 4, 2004 by BROWNSUGA (log)

[artisanbaker]

i don't believe in self taught people. one should give credit where credit is due, and people who learn on the job pick up skills from associates and bosses. pride can be misleading.

school can be excellent but it depends on the school and your personal desire to learn.

debt sucks.

for short term programs i go to the french pastry school or sfbi but i specialise in european baking.

Edited December 4, 2004 by artisanbaker (log)

[BROWNSUGA]

i don't believe in self taught people. one should give credit where credit is due, and people who learn on the job pick up skills from associates and bosses. pride can be misleading.

school can be excellent but it depends on the school and your personal desire to learn.

debt sucks.

for short term programs i go to the french pastry school or sfbi but i specialise in european baking.

←

Huh? When I say self-taught, I meant through reading and learning from books and things of the like.

[artisanbaker]

that is what we might call a freudian slip (rant)

i wanted to go the apprenticeship route but ended up finding myself with the strong desire to get a formal education, even if the classes were continuing ed (certificate) classes.

everybody, school or not, will end up reading books at some point. certain schools have the additional networking advantage as well.

good luck

[Wendy DeBord]

But if, at the most, your looking to turn this into a part-time job I think investing in an expensive education doesn't make alot of sense. Theres places that will hire you now as a part time employee if you can demonstrate you have a serious interest. I'd tell you to go the formal education route if you were looking to make this a full time career.

[BROWNSUGA]

Thanks Sinclair! Your advice makes alot of sense. I think my decision would be much easier if I were planning to make a total career change, but that is not the case. And that is what makes it so tricky! Although I enjoy it, I also still enjoy my full-time job (and it's salary and benefits) to a certain degree. I want to learn more, but I just dont feel comfortable racking up over $10,000 in more debt just for this to be a part time thing. Arrggh.

I think for now I take the non-formal education route. I will take advantage of baking classes here or there if they should become available. If things should change in the future, I will look into it then.

Thanks alot!

Oh, BTW, I saw your cakes on here! You are very talented!! Wow!

[Suzanne F]

In theory, school is great for these reasons:

1. There is someone who can answer the questions you have that your reading doesn't clear up.

2. There is someone who can show you different ways of doing the same thing, rather than your just assuming that the way the book shows you is THE way.

3. There is someone with whom you can discuss the different techniques, to help you decide which will work best for you.

4. There is someone -- and more likely several people -- who can help you finding work during and after your time in school, and with whom you can network for the rest of your life.

I say "in theory" because the quality of school faculty varies greatly. Better to go it on your own than pay a lot of money where you can't get the above. And if you aim is only part-time work, you have to decide whether the intellectual stimulation is worth the investment.

[polack]

I agree with Sinclair, if it's going to be part-time why invest in school when you you will not use it professionally and full time. Finding someone who will teach you the ins and outs is a lot cheaper. I know there's a lot of ventures that I started, got bores and quit after awhile.

Polack

[K8memphis]

Wull, I am self-taught as opposed to classroom taught, and passionately so. That of course means, I designed my own curriculum over a looong period of time. I'm still learning and it's still my passion. I think that you arrive at the pathway you describe, "(creative, custom, wedding/party/special occasion), " through desire rather than by a culinary class environment.

Learning the science of baking could be begun in a classroom and that would be a good, fun place. But a very funny thing about baking is that one baker's, 'never ever ever do' is another baker's, 'I swear by this' - and they're both right. So you don't want anything to box you in or limit you either. But sooo much can hinge on one teensy detail, one seemingly harmless change in whatever formula can be crucial to success one way or the other. Or that 'blunder' may be the creation of a whole new wonderful thing.

Umm, I just made the Ginger Apricot Pierre Herme cake. It was good, I'm gonna make it again for my chef-wanna-be-boy if he ever gets home for the holidays. But I tell ya what - my own brownie recipe forged over the anvil of time (no extra charge for the drama ) is far and away more appealing. There are no leftover brownies ever. I tossed out the last piece of PH cake yesterday.

And besides, with the internet now...sheesh...you can learn soooo much with the click of a mouse.

Since you have a nice job to keep the roof over your head - dabble your heart out - bake your dreams - it's just the best past-time type activity - share the calories, co-workers & neighbors love the ground you walk on - I recently worked out a great white cake formula - I baked & baked & tweaked & tweaked & I got it & I'm delighted with it.

I think you have the best of both worlds - a job to support your baking addiction. and a way to satisfy your creative and scientific desires.

The visual creative side of baking is so goal driven - you have the idea - you go about reaching your conclusion - you screw up, or you hit the mark, or you throw out your creation, or you exceed your own expectations (it happens sometimes ) Then you do it again because you taught yourself sooo much doing it the first time.

Here's two quotes from, "The Making Of A Pastry Chef" by Andrew MacLauchlan:

Here he is quoting, Bill Yosses, "The advantage of formal education is that it categorizes what is necessary and teaches you how to assimilate the information you are receiving." Go Bill.

And you got your textbooks and the information highway here to circumvent formal education.

Then, Jacques Torres, "I think the mind of a chef and of a pastry chef are structured differently. I think a pastry chef is someone who loves to plan, organize, and not be rushed. A chef is someone who is going to deal with the rush and do their very best work in that situation."

So you have the luxury of passion-driven time to hone your skills and to refine your niche. It's a win/win.

[andiesenji]

I suggest you subscribe to the email newsletter (free) of

The Food Service Professional.

Check their site. They have some great training videos, including pastry, pies, etc.

Kitchen Krafts also has training DVD, etc.

as does Sugar Craft.

and also:

Winbeckler's videos.

In many ways these can be more helpful than courses because you can refer back to them again and again and go through a project step-by-step along with the video.

The food service prof. website also has a great deal of information about management, portion control, dealing with staff, etc. A great resource.

[BROWNSUGA]

Thank you all so much for your help!!! I truly appreciate all of your advice and links!

Edited December 9, 2004 by BROWNSUGA (log)

[RodneyCk]

I am in the same boat. My focus is on cakes at the moment, but the idea of pastries as well is enticing. I figured I had two options, continue working and attend a local cake decorating school for cheap or attend the Tante Marie's Cooking School in the fall and take their 6 month pastry program for $7 to $10k.

I don't have $10k.

So, I opted for the first option. I am taking the beginning cake decorating classes at the local cake supply/decorating school. I will take my first gumpaste class next week and the intermediate program next month. I want to keep my current job, but figure this would be a good way to get a part-time job later and test the waters. You never know if you are going to hate something and it would be worse if you paid $10k to discover this fact.

So far, I love the instruction. I learn a lot on my own from books and the internet, of course, lol, but it is not the same. My instructor has been teaching for 20 years and just sold her bakery. She gives great tips and quicker, that I guess are better, ways of working.

So my suggestion to you, find local classes. In the worst case, Michael’s stores offer Wilton courses.