An interface between the two languages

[Kuma]

Hi there,

I bought some Disney furikake recently, and it comes in 4 different flavours.

Nori = seaweed

Yasai = Vegetable (I think)

Sake = Salmon

BUT...

I can't figure out what Akaka is !!

Can anyone tell me? It looks like little brown flakes inbetween the regular multi-coloured ones that they have in each of the packs.

-Rob.

Edited February 1, 2008 by Kuma (log)

[prasantrin]

This won't really help that much, but it's "okaka", not "akaka". It makes me laugh to think it might be "o-kaka". You did say it was brown...

I looked it up and found a recipe for it. It contains shirasu-boshi (white-bait or young sardine flakes, according to my dictionary).

Edited February 1, 2008 by prasantrin (log)

[Hiroyuki]

Okaka (おかか) is another name for katsuo bushi (dried bonito), but it usually means shaved katsuo bushi plus a bit of soy sauce. Okaka onigiri is very poular. Commercially available okaka furikake usually contain ingredients other than shaved katsuo bushi such as nori and sesame seeds.

The recipe that prasantrin linked to calls for

Shirasu (baby sardines), katsuo bushi, nori, ao-nori, toasted white sesame seeds, and seasonings.

[Kuma]

Thank you both, This is such a helpful thread.

I suspect it might be made from alternative ingredients, as katsuo bushi is not listed as an ingredient (the only seafood one is salmon)

...and I'd better brush up my hiragana again before next year !

[Hiroyuki]

Thank you both,  This is such a helpful thread.

I suspect it might be made from alternative ingredients, as katsuo bushi is not listed as an ingredient (the only seafood one is salmon)

...and I'd better brush up my hiragana again before next year !   

←

That's strange... No dried bonito in okaka furikake??

I can't find an ingredient list for that product, but I found a list for a similar okaka furikake of the same manufacturer from here:

原材料：調味顆粒（ぶどう糖、鰹節粉、食塩、砂糖、とうもろこしでん粉、デキストリン、酵母エキス）、味付鰹削り節（鰹削り節、砂糖、食塩、酵母エキス、しいたけエキス）、海苔、酸化防止剤（ビタミンE）

The list contains both dried bonito powder and savings.

Didn't you find these kanji in the ingredient list of your furikake?

鰹節粉

鰹削り節

top: dried bonito powder

bottom: dried bonito savings

[Underfoot]

okaka onigiri sounds like the perfect college student food, hmm...

I have a related question. I know that katsuo bushi and bonito are both dried tuna of some sort, but how are they different in the sense of their production? My limited knowledge is that katsuo bushi is used more as a garnish and bonito is used for making broth. Also does anyone ever slip up and say "kabutomushi" instead of katsuo bushi? I often think about that as a potential pun...

[JasonTrue]

Bonito is just the English word for a katsuo-like fish. Katsuo is usually skipjack tuna. The word bonito isn't used in Japanese. Katsuobushi is used for the dried fish and refers to already shaved katsuo (or at least strongly implies that it's been dried and shaved)

[Hiroyuki]

Here is an entry of katsuobushi in Wikipedia.

Like Jason says, katsuo = bonito.

When I was small back in 1960s, we still used katsuobushi in block form and used a special shaver to make shavings.

We use the word Katsuobushi to mean both a block form and shavings.

I think that katsuobushi shavings are regarded as an ingredient rather than a garnish, and often as an required ingredient in such dishes as takoyaki and konomiyaki.

Also does anyone ever slip up and say "kabutomushi" instead of katsuo bushi? I often think about that as a potential pun...

I don't think so.

[Kuma]

That's strange...  No dried bonito in okaka furikake??

Didn't you find these kanji in the ingredient list of your furikake?

鰹節粉

鰹削り節

top:  dried bonito powder

bottom:  dried bonito savings

←

I couldn't find it.. Here's the ingredient list:

and here's the main pack (kawaii, desu ne):

[prasantrin]

It's there. The bonito powder is in the seond line (along with some katsuo "ekisu" powder--what's that?), and the shavings are in the fourth line. There are other katsuo-related ingredients in there, too.

[Hiroyuki]

prasantrin is right. I can see the kanji. Ekisu is extract.

Thanks for the photo. The list gives the ingredients of all the four types of furikake!

[Kuma]

It's there.  The bonito powder is in the seond line (along with some katsuo "ekisu" powder--what's that?), and the shavings are in the fourth line.  There are other katsuo-related ingredients in there, too.

←

Ah, I see them now. Thank you for that.

prasantrin is right.  I can see the kanji.  Ekisu is extract.

Thanks for the photo.  The list gives the ingredients of all the four types of furikake!

←

It's really funny (or suspicious) that the english translation of ingredients lists only the following (given here as it appears on label):

Salt, wheat flour, Soy sauce, prepared (mashed Potato pumpkin spinach carrot), Dried seaweed, Potato starch, ground green tea, Yeast extract, Shell calcium, 621, 627, salmon, 150a, 160a, 306, Coconut oil, 163, Corn colour, Flavour (milk wheat soybean salmon)

That's it - no bonito, extract, or shavings listed at all

I think there may be things left off these generally translated labels (which is a pity, because I have to carefully check for 621, 623, 625 and 627 - thank goodness they're listed on this one. I know not to eat too much at once. (MSG intolerance)

[Underfoot]

So I was learning about the mythical Japanese creature 河童 (kappa) the other day, and I learned that it is the origin of the name for the cucumber roll, かっぱまき (kappa maki). Apparently people used to put cucumbers in the river as offerings to the kappa because they liked them. It was mentioned that other foods have been named after mythical creatures and or deities.

Looks like inari zushi is named after the fox-god "Inari" whose messenger was a fox. People used to catch foxes with deep-fried mice and so people began to make offerings of fried tofu skins stuffed with sushi rice to Inari, imitating those mice. (According to this link which I may or may not have understood fully)

What other foods are sort of "nicknamed" after other characters (and why)?

Do they all stem etymologically from some sort of offering made to the deity/creature?

Also, is there any record of how a certain deity/creature was deemed to like a certain food?

Thanks for any insight.

Edited March 29, 2008 by Underfoot (log)

[Hiroyuki]

All I can think of at the moment is tanuki, as in tanuki soba and tanuki udon.

Entry of tanuki in Wikipedia (Japanese only)

I will provide some more info when and if I come up with other examples.

[Underfoot]

All I can think of at the moment is tanuki, as in tanuki soba and tanuki udon.

Entry of tanuki in Wikipedia (Japanese only)

I will provide some more info when and if I come up with other examples.

←

Thank you!

I find this sort of etymology so fascinating, plus the translation is good for my Japanese studying

[JasonTrue]

There's also kitsune-udon and kitsune-soba, which also involve abura-age.

[_john]

Sorry, doesn't answer your question exactly but here are some dishes with interesting names that make you think: 親子丼 oyako don parent and child donburi. かぼちゃのいとこ煮 kabocha itokoni pumpkin and cousin boil (the cousin is usually adzuki). 他人丼 taninn don stranger donburi.

[Hiroyuki]

Neko matagi

ねこまたぎ

猫跨ぎ

From here

・猫跨ぎ（ねこまたぎ）　１．不味（まず）い魚。また、捨てるほど大量に捕れる魚。２．塩味が非常にきつい塩漬けの魚。　★以前は「鮪のトロ」を呼んでいたこともある。釣り人の間では「外道（ヒイラギなど）」を呼ぶ。

Fish that is so bad that even a cat (neko) would pass over (matagu) it. Thus, neko matagi.

Interestingly, toro (fatty tuna) was called neko matagi until the advent of modern refrigeration technology.

[Hiroyuki]

Ganmodoki

[Yung-i]

So, I bought some karaage flour the other day, but I'm not sure how to use it.

Would I be right in guessing that I have to add 100cc of water to the flour, stir it to make a batter, and then add about 400-500g of chicken to it, letting it sit for 10 minutes before I fry the chicken?

Oh, and hello to all. I'm not exactly new to the forum, but after I joined, college happened...and so yeah. It's good to be back.

[Peter Green]

Neko matagi

ねこまたぎ

猫跨ぎ

From here

・猫跨ぎ（ねこまたぎ）　１．不味（まず）い魚。また、捨てるほど大量に捕れる魚。２．塩味が非常にきつい塩漬けの魚。　★以前は「鮪のトロ」を呼んでいたこともある。釣り人の間では「外道（ヒイラギなど）」を呼ぶ。

Fish that is so bad that even a cat (neko) would pass over (matagu) it. Thus, neko matagi.

Interestingly, toro (fatty tuna) was called neko matagi until the advent of modern refrigeration technology.

←

I wonder if that's an offshoot from the famous dumplings of Tianjin "even a dog wouldn't eat them"?

[Hiroyuki]

Would I be right in guessing that I have to add 100cc of water to the flour, stir it to make a batter, and then add about 400-500g of chicken to it, letting it sit for 10 minutes before I fry the chicken?

Oh, and hello to all. I'm not exactly new to the forum, but after I joined, college happened...and so yeah. It's good to be back. 

←

Exactly.

Put one bag of flour (which is 100 g) into a bowl, add 100 cc of water. Mix well, using a pair of cooking chopsticks or something similar.

Add 400 to 500 g of chicken (two chunks) and let it sit for 10 minutes.

Deep-fry in oil heated to 170C.

[Hiroyuki]

I wonder if that's an offshoot from the famous dumplings of Tianjin "even a dog wouldn't eat them"?

←

Sorry, I don't know. You need to ask a Chinese.

[MoGa]

Hopefully I won't end up abusing this fine thread.

Sometimes I can work things out for myself, but this is just too confusing for me.

It's a recipe for Goya soda at the very bottom of this web page:

http://lazynanana.blogspot.com/2007_09_01_archive.html

"そしてゴーヤーソーダ。ゴーヤーを縦割りして種を取り、摺り下ろしたものにソーダを注ぐだけの「超」簡単ソーダ。ゴーヤーがたくさんあるときに摺り下ろしてziplocしておくといいかも。チャンプルー以外のゴーヤー料理を身につけようと頑張った私の、今年の一押し。料理というには簡単すぎるものですが、それでもこれはなかなかやみつきになりますよ。ここでは、甘みはついているけれどノンカロリーのソーダを使うのがポイントです。せっかく体にいいゴーヤーを使うので、カロリーも撃退！するのがお作法かと思います。でも、甘みのないペリエとかサンペレグリノとかクラブソーダだと×です。"

What I can deduce from this is:

The seeds are removed from the goya's centre and the goya turned into pulp (would a liquidiser/blender be OK for this?). Only a little of this pulp is needed so the rest can be stored in a ziplock bag (presumably in the fridge).

You put some pulp in a glass and top it up with the soda of your choice - but she suggests sparkling water or club soda as these have no calories.

Obviously I'm guessing most of this. Is that it? Or am I off track? Or is there something else I'm missing?

Any pointers would be much appreciated.

[Hiroyuki]

OK, let's break the paragraph down:

そしてゴーヤーソーダ。

And goya soda.

ゴーヤーを縦割りして種を取り、摺り下ろしたものにソーダを注ぐだけの「超」簡単ソーダ。

"Super" simple soda, which you can make by cutting a goya lengthwise, removing the seeds, grating it (flesh), and pouring soda.

ゴーヤーがたくさんあるときに摺り下ろしてziplocしておくといいかも。

When you have plenty of goya, it may bea good idea to grate them and put them in ziploc bags (and probably storing them in the fridge, I suppose).

チャンプルー以外のゴーヤー料理を身につけようと頑張った私の、今年の一押し。

This is this year's best recommendation from me, who have tried to master goya dishes other than champuru (sp?).

料理というには簡単すぎるものですが、それでもこれはなかなかやみつきになりますよ。

This is too simple to be called a dish, but you may be hooked on it.

ここでは、甘みはついているけれどノンカロリーのソーダを使うのがポイントです。

The point here is to use sweet but non-calorie soda.

せっかく体にいいゴーヤーを使うので、カロリーも撃退！するのがお作法かと思います。

You use goya, which are good for your health, so I think cutting back on calories is the way to go.

でも、甘みのないペリエとかサンペレグリノとかクラブソーダだと×です。

But, Perrier, Sanpellegrino, Club Soda, and the like, which aren't sweet, are not good.

So, did you get them right?

Correction: Not fridge but freezer.

Edited May 16, 2008 by Hiroyuki (log)