When the house rounds the check

[tommy]

glenn, how many people are using cash to pay at upscale places? i've probably used cash to pay for a meal once in my last 300 meals. additionally, if i do pay cash, and the bill is say 66.21, i'll probably just leave 80 on the table and head out the door. are these pennies really so much a problem? you say yourself it's not adding up to much. seems you've got the solution sussed.

and "don't overcharge your customers" isn't a vague generality, nor is it, i think, meant to be a solution to this huge problem that the industry is faced with. it's just common sense and good business. if they don't have that going for them, they're probably beyond help.

Edited October 4, 2003 by tommy (log)

[suzilightning]

why would i want to pay a percentage on a tip if i had to ?

why would you want to pay interest on *any* money if you don't have to? perhaps along with paying the tip in cash, one might also pay a max of 50 bucks on the card for dinner and pay the rest in cash? where is the line drawn? although now i think i'm off topic.

exactly why if it is a big bill (30.00 or over)i put the principal on the card and leave a cash tip since i pay my crdit card bill in toto each month. many times i stop for a burger and beer or wings and beer in local spots and it comes with tax and tip to 20.00. when johnnybird took me to american grill or warehouse grill the bill for two with drinks, food and tax was about 60.00 which went on the card(i pay his cards in full each month, too) but the tip for bartender(american) and waitstaff(warehouse) was cash.

[glenn]

Tommy, the more upscale the restaurant, the less cash taken in. At our place, about 20% of the receipts are cash. At 3 and 4 star restaurants, it's probably closer to 5%. But that's irrelevant. And yes, many people that pay cash leave an even amount to include the tip. But many other customers wait until they get their change before leaving the tip, primarily because they don't have the right amount of change, i.e., check comes to $66.21 and the customer wants to leave $80 but only has a big bill. How much change should the server give the customer, $34? $33.79? $33? I know that this is a deviation from the original post, but a legitimate question nevertheless. As for the original post about Balthazar rounding up, that's clearly wrong, and I have to wonder if perhaps this was an aberration. As has been said, it's wrong to round, not only because most people pay by credit card, but because it's wrong, unless it's always rounded down.

[suzilightning]

But many other customers wait until they get their change before leaving the tip, primarily because they don't have the right amount of change, i.e., check comes to $66.21 and the customer wants to leave $80 but only has a big bill.

johnnybird can not be disuaded from this -

when the server presents the check he puts his card down, puts down cash for the tip and when they pick it up , usually saying "do you need change?"

he says "no the cash is for you but i want the card back"

[tommy]

As for the original post about Balthazar rounding up, that's clearly wrong, and I have to wonder if perhaps this was an aberration.  As has been said, it's wrong to round, not only because most people pay by credit card, but because it's wrong, unless it's always rounded down.

well jeez, you're making sense now.

there are only 3 choices here: short the customer, give the customer the correct change, the restaurant takes a hit a few a pennies.

i'm no quarterback, but clearly there is one most correct answer, one acceptable answer, and one unacceptable answer.

[tommy]

exactly why if it is a big bill (30.00 or over)i put the principal on the card and leave a cash tip since i pay my crdit card bill in toto each month.

but then why bother paying the tip in cash? isn't it just easier to tip on the card, along with the rest of the meal?

[Al_Dente]

As long as pennies are legal currency, you charge EXACTLY. Do you think rounding off would fly in other business transactions? Has anyone ever seen this in a retail environment?

[hollywood]

i'm no quarterback

What would Rush do?

[fresco]

Doing away with pennies, of course, is the same as rounding.

i just don't see that. price adjustment, of course, would happen. however, it would not necessarily be "up", and more than likely the new price would be posted, and you'd pay what you thought you were going to pay, rather than 2/100's of a dollar more.

Of course. Rounding can be up or down.

[Al_Dente]

i'm no quarterback

What would Rush do?

He probably wouldn't mind the rounding off. He doesn't want any pennies since they're a different color than other US coins. Plus, it has Lincoln on it.

[Suzanne F]

Well, SHE (the manager) told me that sometimes they round up, sometimes down. I still think the whole argument is specious. Why round at all, WHEN MOST LIKELY PEOPLE ARE NOT LEAVING CASH????? Not that it's okay when it's a cash transaction, either. But there's no reason of convenience to the customer, in any case.

BTW: while I was there (Balthazar), two Italian women sat down at the table next to mine. One of them ordered a cappucchino; both ate pastries out of bags from the Balthazar Bakery, attached. You should have seen the daggers in the eyes of the server!

[Suzanne F]

Ooops. Double post.

Edited October 4, 2003 by Suzanne F (log)

[glenn]

Suzanne, why don't you write to Keith McNally and give him your 2 cents? :-)) Seriously, I would, but then again I'm a maniac.

[fresco]

Come to think of it, on the odd occasion when a merchant has, for whatever reason, decided to round, it has always been in my, or some other customer's, favor. It seems like a very inexpensive way to buy goodwill.

[tommy]

Come to think of it, on the odd occasion when a merchant has, for whatever reason, decided to round, it has always been in my, or some  other customer's, favor. It seems like a very inexpensive way to buy goodwill.

of *course* it has. i've never heard of anything quite like what suzanne has described. i have to think it was a dumb move by a dumb server, and a dumb manager. i wonder if the owners know about their "policy".

[tommy]

Doing away with pennies, of course, is the same as rounding.

i just don't see that. price adjustment, of course, would happen. however, it would not necessarily be "up", and more than likely the new price would be posted, and you'd pay what you thought you were going to pay, rather than 2/100's of a dollar more.

Of course. Rounding can be up or down.

but removing pennies from a curreny isn't rounding, at least in the sense of the word as it's taken in this discussion. this particular "rounding" was a server over-charging a patron on products that presumably had their prices listed from the get-go.

Edited October 4, 2003 by tommy (log)

[fresco]

Come to think of it, on the odd occasion when a merchant has, for whatever reason, decided to round, it has always been in my, or some  other customer's, favor. It seems like a very inexpensive way to buy goodwill.

of *course* it has. i've never heard of anything quite like what suzanne has described. i have to think it was a dumb move by a dumb server, and a dumb manager. i wonder if the owners know about their "policy".

I find it hard to see this as an attempt to gouge. We're talking pennies here. It just sounds like a dumb decision compounded by an even dumber explanation.

[fresco]

Doing away with pennies, of course, is the same as rounding.

i just don't see that. price adjustment, of course, would happen. however, it would not necessarily be "up", and more than likely the new price would be posted, and you'd pay what you thought you were going to pay, rather than 2/100's of a dollar more.

Of course. Rounding can be up or down.

but removing pennies from a curreny isn't rounding, at least in the sense of the word as it's taken in this discussion. this particular "rounding" was a server over-charging a patron on products that presumably had their prices listed from the get-go.

They're not the same thing, for sure. One is stupidity. The other is at least an attempt at efficiency.

[pjs]

As long as pennies are legal currency, you charge EXACTLY. Do you think rounding off would fly in other business transactions? Has anyone ever seen this in a retail environment?

However, the much beloved IRS lets you round to the nearest dollar on your 1040.

I always round down when giving a cash customer change. Usually in pennies, sometimes in nickels, dimes and quarters.

Rounding up--no matter how small--will put you and your business in the same despised league in the customer's mind with used car salesmen.

PJ

[zilla369]

i'm no quarterback

What would Rush do?

He probably wouldn't mind the rounding off. He doesn't want any pennies since they're a different color than other US coins. Plus, it has Lincoln on it.

Heh heh.