dying for a frankie - any suggestions?

[howler]

here i am in blighty, a long way away from mumbai, ready to try almost anything for a frankie, like NOW

has anyone any idea of the frankie recipe? the egg and parotha are easily sourced, but do you have any idea of how to get the mutton to taste even remotely like that in the frankie? whats the special spice they sprinkle on at the end?

aaaaarggh, somebody please help.

[BBhasin]

Now I know why you were searching so desperately for Vikram!

Anyway I am not from Bombay and have never tasted a frankie. BUT a customer of mine recomended that The Bombay Cafe in Los Angles makes ones that are very good so I bought their cookbook.

This is how the reciepe goes for the lamb masalla filling( the rest you say you can do)

6 cloves garlic

2 inch piece peeled ginger

3 tablespoons oil

2 large onions, thinly sliced

1 1/2 pounds boneless lamb, preferably from the leg, cut into 1 inch cubes

1 tablespoon ground corriander

1 teaspoon ground cumin

1 1/2 teaspoons cayenne pepper

1/4 teaspoon tumuric

2 large tomatoes halved and thinly sliced

3 green serrano chiles, halved, deseeded and sliced on the bias

1 tespoon salt

puree the garlic and half the ginger in a blender using a little water as needed.

slice the rest of the ginger into thin matchstics.

heat the oil in a large saucepan.add the onion and saute until it turns dark gold.about 5 to 6 minutes. stir frequently so that they do not burn at the edges.

add the garlic and ginger puree and the cubes of lamb contnuing to brown for anither 5 to 6 minutes until all the meat juices have almost dried up.

add the cumin, corriander, cayenne and turmuric combining well.

mix in the sliced tomatoes, chiles, sliced ginger and salt.

reduce the heat to low and cook for about 1 hour and 15 minutes or until the meat is tender enough to cut easily with a fork.

That's it howler. She has instructions on the paratha and egg and rolling the frankie but you say you can manage all that.

I have been meaning to try out this reciepe for years. Can you please let me know how it turned out for you and if it is close to what you get in Bombay. The cookbook author Neela Panis is a very sucessful restauranteer, and has great culinary credentials so I am sure it should be good. You be the judge.

[howler]

much, much gratitude for this.

i'm going to get neela panis' book.

keep you posted.

[pinku]

We too are die-hard fans of frankie. (Tib's frankie in bandra, frankie corner at Shivaji Park..um yumm yumm:)

Whenever I cook kheema at home, I use the left over kheema to make frankies. Just roast a tortilla or a home made chapati with egg wash on one side . then add the kheema , sprinkle some chaat masala and chopped onions. Roll the chapati and put it in a tissue paper. voila! you have the franki ready!!

[prasad2]

here i am in blighty, a long way away from mumbai, ready to try almost anything for a frankie, like NOW

has anyone any idea of the frankie recipe? the egg and parotha are easily sourced, but do you have any idea of how to get the mutton to taste even remotely like that in the frankie? whats the special spice they sprinkle on at the end?

aaaaarggh, somebody please help.

Howler

Frankie is been on my mind for quite some time, specially the Bandra ones, it seems you took it out of my mouth. I was planning on posting this thread for quite some time. Thanks Bhasin for the recipe I shall try this coming Sunday Brunch and I guess my customers should be my Guinny Pigs. I feel there is some souring agent missing in the recipe, as far as I can remember Frankie is quite katta (Soury) and spicy.. may be some fresh lime or amchur (Dry Mango Powder)

Now what are Kaati rolls? Do you like them? Do you have a recipe?

[popesnose]

I'm working up the courage to post for the first time, because evidently my greed is greater than my lurkitude. Are frankies anything like the "rolls" (sometimes called Kaathi, as refered to in the above post) that can be purchased all over the streets of Calcutta? The most famous of these were originated by Nizam's.....and after too many years since a visit to India, the thought of one is making me salivate in a most unfeminine fashion.

If they are similar, then I'm thrilled to have stumbled onto the above recipe...

Also - what would approximate the taste of mutton more would you guys think, lamb or goat?

Wow...this wasn't so hard. I'll have to post and harass you guys more often now!

[BBhasin]

Prasad,

you made me go back to the book again.

she in the final assembly lists

- tamarind and date chutney

-green chile chutney and

lime-cilantro onions

popesnose,

these are very similar to nizam's of calcutta except in calcutta the stuffing was mutton or beef tikkas and this reciepe it seems more like a bhunna. I have forgotten the taste of the origional kathi at Nizams of Calcutta as I was too young. But last year when I visited Delhi I tried a Kathi at their branch in CP. They tasted OK and man were they greasy!! maybe my tastes are different now but this stuff I had there was positively dripping with fat( the paratha i.e. the mutton tikkas in it were grilled though)

My suggestion to all is to fix it yourself. The malasian frozen parathas are a God send for those seeking to assemble kathis, just one tip, tranfer the paratha FROZEN to the hot griddle/pan.

I would work with lamb as it will cook sooner and you will not have to clean too much drool off the kitchen floor.

[tryska]

i have never heard of a frankie - but i'm presuming it's some sort of burrito proto-type?

[prasad2]

i have never heard of a frankie - but i'm presuming it's some sort of burrito proto-type?

Correct. Similar in style but totally different fillings and the bread is whole wheat battered with beaten egg and ghee (Clarified Butter)

Thanks Bhasin for the final addition of the chutneys, as a matter of fact seems to be a slow monday night, I am going to try one with prepared lamb curry.

Now of what of Kathi rolls you explained may be chopped boti kabab should work. What else in Kathi kabab roll?

Thanks again.

Will let you know how it worked out. See some times slow nights are very productive.

[BBhasin]

I am in a bit of a rush right now but I think there is a reciepe for Chaurasia Kathi in Kalra's Prasad. I would improvise on that with a boti kabab.

Bye

[prasad2]

I have been meaning to try out this reciepe for years. Can you please let me know how it turned out for you and if it is close to what you get in Bombay. The cookbook author Neela Panis is a very sucessful restauranteer, and has great culinary credentials so I am sure it should be good. You be the judge.

Bingo BBhasin!!

I think that was it. This recipe worked quite good and as far as I can remember it tasted quite like the one on linking road in Bandra. I used some chat and crushed methi as a sprinkle and it just worked fine. Only thing the lamb was done in more like 20 to 25 minutes rather than 75 minutes what the recipe called for. Ameroican fresh Lamb is a lot tender than the goat meat, I guess.

Correct if I am wrong. The Parathas, I made a thin chapathi, cooked it half way and then bathed in beaten egg and re-cooked on the griddle. Is it how it is supposed to be? I did not make a paratha but instead a chapathi with ghee.

I guess will have some comments this coming Sunday Brunch.

BTW I did see the Chaurasia Kathi in the book, that I will save it for the following Sunday.

[skchai]

Nizam's in Delhi have a website. Wonder if they are even associated with the Calcutta Nizam's since they don't even mention them. They do however have a diet Kathi without egg.

[skchai]

O.K. Some Frankie trivia:

Frankies were named after (Sir) Frank Worrell, who was then a member of the West Indies cricket team and was tearing apart the Indian bowling. Worrell was one of the fabled "three W's" along with (Sir) Clyde Walcott and (Sir) Everton Weekes. Perhaps if he didn't do as well, we would be eating "Pollies"?

[prasad2]

O.K.  Some Frankie trivia:

Frankies were named after (Sir) Frank Worrell, who was then a member of the West Indies cricket team and was tearing apart the Indian bowling.  Worrell was one of the fabled "three W's" along with (Sir) Clyde Walcott and (Sir) Everton Weekes.    Perhaps if he didn't do as well, we would be eating "Pollies"?

SK

If I recall reading on the net that Frankie's is kind of cuisine of Goa or originated in Goa.

[anil]

O.K.  Some Frankie trivia:

Frankies were named after (Sir) Frank Worrell, who was then a member of the West Indies cricket team and was tearing apart the Indian bowling.  ........

Hmmm, Dunno about that The closest a frankie comes to English Carribean is curry-goat-roti .... but then that is 'not from Barbados.....

[skchai]

Ahh. There seem to be some doubters!

I can't say I'm certain about this story myself but I recall hearing it from at least two different sources.

Anil, I don't think the claim is that Frankies originated in the West Indies, just that they were invented in India but named after Worrell because he made a big impression on the Indian public. I did check the records and it turns out that Worrell apparently never toured India (at least not at the Test level), but on the other hand his average against India in the West Indies was pretty enormous. According to Statguru he averaged 60.83 in Tests against India, including a huge 237 in the first innings of the final test of the 1953 series, an innings in which coincidently all the W's scored tons (perhaps the only time they did so). Hmm., but come to think of it, there is some similarity to curry-goat-roti. . . both are rolled up!

Prasad, there are a lot of stuffed-bread type dishes in Goa ("recheado") as well as numerous meat pies ("empada"), but I have never heard of a rolled-flatbread type dish similar to a frankie or kathi roll. However, my ignorance of such a dish doesn't mean that it couldn't have come out of Goa, particularly given that such a high percentage of professional chefs in those days were from Goa. In fact, I could come up with a decent apocryphal story to go with the Goa theory . . . they were named Frankies because they resembled the sleeves on the habits of the Franciscan Friars?

[howler]

the first frankies were sold in breach candy at two locations: mafatlal park and scandal point. much, much later they made it beside sterling cinema and then to bandra.

the scandal point frankies were always the best.

haven't had time try the recipe yet ....

[Vikram]

Hi Howler, back from Madras (on which more later) just as this frankie discussion gets going. Reading it I was struck by a sudden, immediate urge to have a Frankie, so went out of office to the Waikiki stand near Sterling cinema only to find it closed and looking like it had been that way for ages. I walk past that road often, but somehow hadn't noticed that.

If it really is closed - and I'll check again - it would fit my observation that Frankie's are going out of fashion in Bombay. There was a stall near where I stay in Khar which again has gone out of business and I can think of others. Its also no long as easy to find in or near movie theatres, which is where I remember most of the Frankie consumption of my youth.

Perhaps there's something up with the Tibbs guys (that can be checked), perhaps their insistence on control has prevented the Frankie really disseminating within Bombay like the vada pau. It could be a trend away from non-veg snacks - yes, I know there are veg Frankies but they don't bear thinking about. I certainly think the grease level in the average Frankie could be putting people off (the only instruction I'd add to the recipe above is that you have to end up eating at least half the grease sodden paper the Frankie comes wrapped in).

There are similar roll type snacks - the Noorani sheekh kebab roll is a particular favourite of mine, because of the curiously meaty nature of the sheekh which I think could be due to the Noorani owners Moplah roots. I also like the rolls at Samovar in theJehangir Art Gallery. But none of these are the same as Frankies and nor, for that matter, are Calcutta kati rolls, since those lack the greasy-gracy element of Frankies.

One last comment. Just checked the TOI archives and found some confirmation for SKChai's story about its etymology. Here's the story:

Anyone for a FRANKIE!

Ignatius  Albuquerque discovers some little-known facts  about  a favourite of Mumbai                       

Know  how  the  term, Frankie was coined to  signify  that  tasty Indianised concoction of a roti roll wrapped around tasty  chunks of  varied stuff of either mutton, chicken or even  veggies?  Bet you don't.

Thirty years back, Amarjit Tibb  the father of Jasmit Tibb  quite liked  the  Lebanese chicken shawerma when in  Beiruit,  and  got thinking how to adopt this to typical Indian tastes.

And he hit upon the idea of creating Tibbs Frankie.

But  wait,  what about the name Frankie! Well, more  than  thirty years or so back, West Indies were beating the hell out of  India in  a certain series which was being dominated by  their  captain Frank Worrell.  So Amarjit, who to this day oversees the  kitchen and  the  catering  aspect of the  family  business,  thought  of incorporating the name Frank into this new product.

Frankly,  various  combos  were thought of  before  they  finally selected  Frankie  and  till  now, a  whole  lot  of  people  are savouring  and making a meal of it, at the many outlets all  over Mumbai.

It's  all in the Tibbs family. Jasmit oversees the Marketing  and PR division, while brother Charanjit handles the production  with more  than  a little help from father  Amarjit.  Jasmit  welcomes exhibition  such as Utsav because it provides  valuable  feedback from customers whose needs are varied and always significant.

The firm has always maintained its USP of providing a product for Indianised taste which always provides value for money.

The  ambitious Jasmit has expanded business  considerably  whilst incorporating corporate lunches, also takes wedding orders and is also  into providing restaurants and eateries that are not  doing too well with technical  and  professional expertise to  achieve  a  turnaround businesswise.

Frankie  also  fits considerably into the  exhibition  scheme  of things, wherein you can eat while you shop and also happily munch away on a Frankie all the time.

Jasmit  stresses that Frankie is an exclusive trademark of  Tibbs and though it has spawned a host of imitators, there is only  one original.  Have  any  doubts, ask  actress  Bhagyashree  and  pop singer,  Jassi!

[howler]

"Thirty years back, Amarjit Tibb the father of Jasmit Tibb quite liked the Lebanese chicken shawerma when in Beiruit, and got thinking how to adopt this to typical Indian tastes."

yessss, it all makes sense, the wheel has come full circle.

my favourite sandwiches in the world are lebanese shwarma/shis taouk and frankies. how cosmically satisfying.

incidentally, while i'm deeply grateful that amarjit tibb discovered his frankie roll, i can't believe he thought chicken shwarma needed to be adapted to indian tastes. EVERY indian i've ever taken to get a well made shish taou/shwarma, ladled with toom, has adored it.

i know theres a maroush in bombay - i saw it driving past - i hope they serve the right stuff.

[Vikram]

i know theres a maroush in bombay - i saw it driving past - i hope they serve the right stuff.

Yes, at the ITC Grand Maratha Hotel which means you're getting street food at five star prices which sort of dampens one's enthusiasm, however good it is. Maroush is quite good, but most people seem to go there for the belly dancers more than the food. The Lebanese place I like is Lebanese Point in the middle of all the chaos of that main commercial street in Andheri Lokhandwala. Its run by guys from Dubai and its all good, honest, authentically tangy stuff,

Vikram

[howler]

man, have you had the shish taouk sandwich and are you hip to toom?

good toom changes the universe ...

[anil]

Ahh.  There seem to be some doubters! 

I can't say I'm certain about this story myself but I recall hearing it from at least two different sources. 

Anil, I don't think the claim is that Frankies originated in the West Indies, just that they were invented in India but named after Worrell because he made a big impression on the Indian public. I did check the records and it turns out that Worrell apparently never toured India (at least not at the Test level), but on the other hand his average against India in the West Indies was pretty enormous........

No I am not a doubter, However, it is about the details Dear Watson

Vikram

One last comment. Just checked the TOI archives and found some confirmation for SKChai's story about its etymology. Here's the story:

While I do not doubt either Prof. SKChai or TOI - Remember, Sir Worrell had stopped playing just about when I was growing up so put this at 40+ years. It is the Tibbs folks appropriation of the product (If one can call that) I have difficulty reconciling. I cannot account for a decade before I first heard of Frankie.

There was egg-roll in Kolkatta way back -- essentially it was egg,roti and fillings (veg or non.veg) Egg on the outside, roti or paratha and fillings (not wrapped in paper)

Oh Well !!!

Edited September 24, 2003 by anil (log)