Soy Milk in desserts

[bloviatrix]

Ok, I know this is sacriligous, but I need some help.

I'm planning my menus for Rosh Hashannah, and most of meals will be meat based. This means I can't serve dairy-based desserts. Does anyone have experience using soy milk to make pastry cream or ice cream? If it's doable, I'm thinking about that as an option.

[jackal10]

Strictly its not Kosher either, "chukas h'goy", since it might deceive a stranger into thinking that the law prohibiting meat and milk could be broken.

Tastes awful as well...

[Jason Perlow]

Screw the fake dairy. Go with sorbets.

Also some sesame-based desserts would be cool, like Halvah. Or maybe marzipans.

[bloviatrix]

It's just that I would really like to do a nice fruit tart with a pastry cream. I think it would look impressive.

As for halvah, I can't seem to find a recipe for it (I was on a quest about 4 months ago - pre-egullet). Do you have one? My m-i-l is addicted to halvah. I would make a lifelong ally if I could make it from scratch.

[Jason Perlow]

http://www.recipesource.com/desserts/07/rec0749.html

http://www.cdkitchen.com/rec/scaled.php?mi...id=2974&scale=1

Either of these dipped in melted chocolate would be great.

[Lesley C]

I tasted a soy latte at Starbucks the other day. It was so awful I threw it in the garbage after two sips. Just imagine plain cooked white navy beans, pureed and mixed with espresso.

Please don't ruin your good desserts with that stuff.

[Lochina]

You could do a frangipane (sp?) fruit tart.

[Jason Perlow]

Here's a walnut-based halvah:

http://food.epicurious.com/run/recipe/view?id=40004

and two almond ones:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=halvah+r...aol.com&rnum=23

and one flavored with saffron:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=halvah+r...est.net&rnum=21

[bloviatrix]

I need to rant for a moment. I know that all desserts taste better when made with butter, cream, milk, etc. I've confined my cooking to dairy only this summer, and as a result, my desserts have been nice and rich. Before this summer I never kept a steady supply of heavy cream in fridge, but this summer I've gone a bit wild. So, now that we're going back to fall and the holidays, I'll be returning to cooking meat meals, which means finding the appropriate desserts. And I'm feeling the frustration of being limited. I know sorbets are an option, and I have pareve equipment for my ice cream maker. Last year I made a mango-star anise sorbet that went over well. Gordon Ramsey has fruit gelees in his book, and that looks promising. I can always go the poached fruit route, and I've done that many times. It's just that I want to do something different. Hence my thoughts about soy milk.

This is when kashrut is a bitch.

End rant.

[Jason Perlow]

Theres no need to rant. That's why we're tying to help you come up with solutions.

However, I feel that "fake dairy" really should not be attempted when there are perfectly good, delicious, valid, non-dairy desserts that can be served -- especially authentically Jewish ones like Halvah.

[bloviatrix]

Jason, believe me, I appreciate the suggestions. As I've already said, halvah is a great idea. And I'm open to other ideas (perhaps I need to start a new thread call desserts w/no diary?).

I'm far from traditional when I cook my meals, so the ideas don't have to Jewish in nature.

[Lesley C]

Your idea is commendable. It's just that soy milk, IMO, has an off-putting vegetable taste that could ruin your desserts. Maybe you should try a few brands to find the one with the most neutral flavour.

[Katherine]

Why don't you just try substituting soy milk for dairy in a recipe in advance and see if it tastes acceptable to you?

[beans]

Any thoughts on that Almond Breezes stuff from Blue Diamond?

Here's a Rice Pudding with Almond Essence recipe that includes some nice rehydrated, dried cherries. Although I'd skip on the non-dairy whipped topping suggestion!

[bloviatrix]

Any thoughts on that Almond Breezes stuff from Blue Diamond?

Here's a Rice Pudding with Almond Essence recipe that includes some nice rehydrated, dried cherries.  Although I'd skip on the non-dairy whipped topping suggestion!

Your post reminded me that I have recipe for a Couscous pudding made with coconut milk and that might be a good idea.

As for Almond Breezes, I'm not sure if it's kosher. I'll have to take a look at it.

[jersey13]

I read this post much earlier today and it just hit me now: Perhaps you could visit a vegan shop where they might have such things as non dairy cream cheese. While I have never had non dairy cheese myself, I was thinking that if it isn't just plain gross, you could make a nice no bake tart topped with fresh berries. The filling would simply be cream cheese, sugar and some fruit juice, and lemon rind, well beaten. You could use a graham crust done with margarine, toss the fruits with some preserves and spread it over the filling. Gourmet had a similar recipe using marscapone, but I have never seen non dairy marscapone.

Anyway, just though it might be a suggestion.....

On another note,if you can figure out how it's made, I have had tofu ice cream and I loved it....

Edited September 1, 2003 by jersey13 (log)

[NeroW]

If you're sticking with the fruit tart idea, I would second the frangipane suggestion.

EDIT: I have an easy recipe for pear and frangipane tarts. They are really beautiful.

Edited September 1, 2003 by NeroW (log)

[jersey13]

Please educate the ignorant: What exactly is frangipane?

[bloviatrix]

Please educate the ignorant: What exactly is frangipane?

Frangipane is almond cream. Think sugar, almonds, butter, eggs, and flour. When baked, it becomes cakey.

The problem with frangipane is that it calls for butter (at least the Payard recipe calls for it). This means using margarine as a substitute. And although Payard's tart dough is suprisingly flakey with margerine, I don't know how the frangipane will taste.

Edited September 1, 2003 by bloviatrix (log)

[jersey13]

Thanks. Now that you describe it, I recall having it before I developed an allergy to almonds.

I generally find that substituting butter in things that really rely on it for flavour tends to be a mistake. That;s part of the reason I suggested the tart with graham crust. It's not butter dependent and you can add a dash of ginger or some lemon rind for flavour. Or, use ginger cookies instead. I know it sounds like something right out of a Kraft commercial, but we're working with a special dietary need.. (as you well know). You could try a normal crust using butter Crisco (I know, I know) and sweeten it, so as to imitate a sweet short crust.

I love butter. (Sorry, just had to get that out).

[Suzanne F]

Frangipane is a mixture of almond paste, sugar, butter (or in Bloviatrix's case, parve margarine), flour, and eggs. It is heavenly with pears, or probably any stone fruit. The extra flavor from the almond paste more than makes up for the lack of flavor from the margarine or vegetable shortening. It's a great suggestion.

Katherine's suggestion to try your dairy recipes with soy milk is also excellent. Although you'll probably find that you're happier NOT trying to substitute. I once had a "creme brulee" at a kosher steakhouse -- had to see what it was like -- and I regretted it on the first spoonful. You simply cannot substitute for some ingredients, when they contribute such a high proportion of the flavor -- and the fat in dairy is one of the elements that carries the flavors of the other ingredients. My mother used to refer to the "Ice cream" we'd be served at weddings and bar mitzvot as "frozen Spry." True, true.

As for beans's question about Almond Breezes: I make an iced almond milk that is just great (not just my opinion). I got the recipe off a carton of Italian almond milk. When I tried making it with AB, it was just not as good: the flavor of roasting was stronger than the flavor of almonds. But that was my taste; you might like it fine. It can work well as an ice milk. It will never have the richness of ice cream, though.

[bloviatrix]

If you're sticking with the fruit tart idea, I would second the frangipane suggestion.

EDIT: I have an easy recipe for pear and frangipane tarts.  They are really beautiful. 

Are you willing to share your recipe? The only one I have calls for heavy cream, which defeats the purpose.

[Malawry]

I sometimes sub in coconut milk for regular milk in all sorts of recipes. I bet it would work in a pastry cream, and would taste pretty good to boot. Hmm, ginger-flavored crust, coconut pastry cream, and sliced tropical fruits might make a tasty pareve tart for the holidays.

I have cooked with Edensoy soy milk (which I regard as the least offensive soy milk) with moderate success. Some soy milks have a tendency to split when cooked for a long time, so I usually add them at the end of cooking. I've used them more like I would real cream to finish a sauce or soup than as the base of something like pastry cream, but it's worth a shot. BTW some people vehemently disagree that Edensoy is the least offensive, and I've learned over time that different soy milks can be better for different activities. I think Vitasoy froths better for a soy milk cappuccino (sorry Lesley), for example, but it's not as rich as edensoy. And for some, rice milk or almond milk simply taste better than soy milk.

Go to a natural foods store and buy single-serving containers of soy and other milks, it's the easiest way to sample several types. Then give it a shot and tell us what happens. Maybe you could make a soy pastry cream and a dairy pastry cream and compare them side-by-side if you really want to feel rueful.

[jersey13]

Hi NeroW.

If you're PM'ing that frangipane recipe, mind sending one my way?

[Jason Perlow]

Oh yes, coconut milk. You could make a Thai rice pudding with coconut milk, with the mango slices on it.