Jump to content
  • Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create a free account.

Mushrooms and Fungi in China


Recommended Posts

Regarding the comments in the first post about soaking dried Chinese mushrooms in hot water, my understanding has always been that you get better results for many types of mushroom with a long soak in cool water, rather than a short soak in hot water.

With shitakes, I'll sometimes cheat and soak for a couple hours in warmer water, but normally, I try to soak stem-down for 8+ hours in room temperature water. This is what I usually do for most other dried stuff used in Chinese cooking too (mian lun, fu zhu, etc.).

What do other folks do?

Edited by Will (log)
Link to post
Share on other sites

I've never known anyone in China to soak mushrooms or anything else in cold water for so long. For example, the hua gu pictured above were pre-packed and the instructions on the bag say to soak in hot water for 20 minutes and that is all I have ever seen people do.

 

instructions.jpg

 

What advantage would there be in soaking in cold water?

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites

Regarding the comments in the first post about soaking dried Chinese mushrooms in hot water, my understanding has always been that you get better results for many types of mushroom with a long soak in cool water, rather than a short soak in hot water.

With shitakes, I'll sometimes cheat and soak for a couple hours in warmer water, but normally, I try to soak stem-down for 8+ hours in room temperature water. This is what I usually do for most other dried stuff used in Chinese cooking too (mian lun, fu zhu, etc.).

What do other folks do?

I usually:

  • put the dried ones in a (largish-rice) bowl
  • cover them with tap water
  • cover the bowl with cling film
  • pierce it a couple times with a knife and then
  • zap it in the microwave for about a minute then
  • let them soak about an hour.

I'm not sure exactly where I picked that up at, America's Test Kitchen possibly? I've never tried any other way so I've nothing to compare it to but perhaps I should try another way? This seems to work out ok however.

Maybe I would have more friends if I didn't eat so much garlic?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Awesome mushroom porn. A truly great and informative thread. We can get a lot--but far from all--of those locally in fresh form. I, too, had been wondering about what to do with king oysters--I'd tried a couple of methods, including my go-to recipe for roast mushrooms (usually used with Swiss browns or, say, small portobellos), without much (i.e. edible results) success. Will keep braising in mind.

Chris Taylor

Host, eG Forums - ctaylor@egstaff.org

 

I've never met an animal I didn't enjoy with salt and pepper.

Melbourne
Harare, Victoria Falls and some places in between

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you so much, what a thrilling post.

with the photographs and descriptions , you could write a book.

I will read it more than once.

Martial.2,500 Years ago:

If pale beans bubble for you in a red earthenware pot, you can often decline the dinners of sumptuous hosts.

Link to post
Share on other sites

What advantage would there be in soaking in cold water?

I haven't done extensive direct comparison, but in my experience, cooler water seems to give a better flavor and a more even texture to the rehydrated mushrooms, and I think less of the flavor seems to be released into the water. Also, it will depend on the size, etc., but even with fairly hot water, soaking for only 20-30 minutes doesn't seem to hydrate the mushrooms enough for me -- the middle is generally still too tough -- might be Ok, depending on how the mushrooms will be further cooked.

My in-laws soak in cool water, but just to make sure they're not weird, I did an informal survey of a few (5 so far) ethnic Chinese about what they or their parents do. Some of them are from Mainland China; others from Taiwan, HK, or SE Asia. Most said they soak in cool or room temperature water, with longer soaking times (from 2-3 hours to overnight), unless they're in a hurry. So, regardless of the reason, I don't think this is an uncommon practice.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Another commonly available fresh mushroom is the Jade Gill Mushroom (海鲜菇 hǎi xiān gū, literally "seafood mushroom") or Crab Flavour Mushrooms (蟹味菇 xiè wèi gū). Although this looks like a larger version of the enoki mushrooms above, it is actually a variety of the shimeji mushroom (also above). Shimeji normally grow in bunches but when they grow individually they are referred to as jade gill mushrooms. They are used in cold dishes and soups.

 

haixiangu800.jpg

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites

What does it mean when dried mushrooms start turning white?

I have dried shiitakes and porchinis, stored airtight well over a year, turning white. I realize that I've held them too long, but I've been using them, so I assume they're safe to eat. But I wonder if there any concerns or reasons why they should not be eaten.

Monterey Bay area

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is one type of fresh mushroom which I bought a few years ago from my regular trusted mushroom seller in the local market. I never did positively identify them. She never had them again, so she probably can't remember either. I must print out the picture and see if she does.

 

They really look like the chocolate mushrooms they sell to the kids round here, but I promise they were real!

 

mushrooms.jpg

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

I came across these today. I'm not sure what they are. The Chinese is 松柏菇 (sōng bǎi gū), which literally translates as 'pine cypress mushroom'. Mr. Google and his Chinese counterparts have proved to be no help in identifying them.

 

I haven't eaten any yet, but they have a strong mushroom scent. After soaking the dried mushrooms the soaking water has a distinct green tinge.

 

Anyway, here they are dried

 

Conifermushrooms.jpg

 

and here are a few rehydrated

 

Conifermushrooms2.jpg

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote
They remind me Slippery Jacks

 

I'm fairly certain they aren't. They don't match the description or the pictures in that article or this one.

"It is slimy to the touch, bare, smooth, and glossy even when dry ..." The ones I'm looking at aren't.

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 4 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...

In post #2, I mentioned bamboo pith fungus. What I failed to mention was that these come in two forms. There are the adult mushrooms with their lace-like veil

 

800px-Bamboo_pith_mushroom.jpg

 

but the immature fruiting bodies are egg shaped and are sold as "bamboo fungus eggs" (竹荪蛋 zhú sūn dàn).

 

BambooFungusEggs.jpg

 

These are soaked in hot water for half an hour, then braised, fried or used in soups.

(P.S. I'm still working on the 48 mushroom menu translation. Soon, I hope.)

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites

The 48 mushroom menu from my local restaurant turned out to have only 41 mushrooms on it. Here they are. Those in red are some which I haven't been able to positively identify, but have given a somewhat literal translations instead. If anyone can elucidate, I will be delighted.

 

junlintianxia1Large.jpg

 

羊肚菌 Morel

松茸 Matsutake Mushroom

黄金菇 Golden Oyster Mushroom

竹荪 Bamboo Fungus

鸡油菌 Chanterelle

老人头 Portobello Mushroom

猴头菇 Monkey Head Mushroom

美味牛肝片 Porcini Pieces

白牛肝 White Bolete, King Bolete

鸡枞菌 Termite Mushroom

金喇叭带 Girolle

橙盖鹅膏 Caesar's Mushroom (Amanita Caesarea)

百灵菇嫩 Lark Mushroom

鲍鱼菌 Abalone Mushroom

姬松茸 Almond Mushroom (Agaricus subrufescens)

蜜环菌 Honey Agaric

冷杉菇 Fir Mushroom

珊瑚菌、有药效功效 Coral Mushroom

青杠菌 Tricholoma quercicola Zang

球盖菌 Burgundy Mushroom (Stropharia rugosoannulata)

松毛菌 (美容菌) Thelehhora ganhajun Zang (Beauty Mushroom)

黑牛肝 Black Boletus

金丝蘑菇 Golden Thread Mushroom

小黄菌 Small Yellow Mushroom

黄牛肝 Yellow Boletus

黑虎掌 Black Tiger Paw Mushroom (Sarcodon Aspratus)

茶树菇 Tea Tree Mushroom

鱼肚菌 Fish Maw Mushroom

雪山菇 Snow Mountain Mushroom

鸭掌菌 Duck Web Mushroom

姬平菇 Oyster Mushroom

小白侧 White Oyster Mushroom

冬瓜菌 Shaggy Ink Cap (Coprinus comatus)

玉黄菌 Jade Mushroom (Russula virescens)

红乳牛肝 Boletinus asiaticus

白乳牛肝 Milk Boletus

马蹄菌 Horse's Hoof Mushroom

海鲜菇 Shimeji (Beech Mushroom)

见手青 Boletus speciosus

草菇 Straw Mushroom

野生香菇带 Wild Shiitake

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites

I came across these today.

Known as 元蘑 (yuán mó) in Chinese, they are the highly rated "Honey Mushrooms" (Armillaria mellea). They have been compressed and dried (or vice versa) into little tablets measuring 2½ x 1½ x ¼ inches. The packaging suggests stewing them with chicken or "meat". They shouldn't be eaten raw as they are slightly poisonous when uncooked.

This block is soaking now, just to the side of my computer desk, and the smell is amazing.

compresedhoneymushroom.jpg

Edited by liuzhou (log)
  • Like 1

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 4 weeks later...

The honey mushrooms are from Daxinganling (大兴安岭) in China's Heilongjiang province. It is a forested area on the border with Russia. The annual average temperature is minus 2.8C (27F)and in the long winters gets as low as minus 40C (minus 40F). Summer is a mere two months long. The area is known for its mushrooms and other wild foods.

 

When soaking, the mushrooms have a distinct earthy smell, but the taste is more subtle. Not so pronounced as cèpes, but up there with morels and chanterelles.

 

I've used them in stews with chicken, in a mixed mushroom stir fry and had them in soups.

 

Here is what happens when I soak the compressed block in hot water.

 

honeymushrfoomsoaking.jpg

 

And the final reconstituted mushrooms.

 

honeymushroom.jpg

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

Today I came across these big fellows.

This is a giant flower mushroom (大花菇 dà huā gū) - a shiitake considerably larger those normally available.

LargeFlowerMushroom1.jpg

LargeFlowerMushroom2.jpg

Interestingly, they were also considerably cheaper than regular "flower" mushrooms". At ¥60 per 500g as opposed to around ¥100 per 500g for the regular sort. Also, these were supposedly imported from Japan, so the price difference seems even greater.

It seems the little ones are more highly prized.

Edited by liuzhou (log)

...your dancing child with his Chinese suit.

 

The Kitchen Scale Manifesto

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Similar Content

    • By liuzhou
      Chinese food must be among the most famous in the world. Yet, at the same time, the most misunderstood.

      I feel sure (hope) that most people here know that American-Chinese cuisine, British-Chinese cuisine, Indian-Chinese cuisine etc are, in huge ways, very different from Chinese-Chinese cuisine and each other. That's not what I want to discuss.

      Yet, every day I still come across utter nonsense on YouTube videos and Facebook about the "real" Chinese cuisine, even from ethnically Chinese people (who have often never been in China). Sorry YouTube "influencers", but sprinkling soy sauce or 5-spice powder on your cornflakes does not make them Chinese!
       
      So what is the "authentic" Chinese food? Well, like any question about China, there are several answers. It is not surprising that a country larger than western Europe should have more than one typical culinary style. Then, we must distinguish between what you may be served in a large hotel dining room, a small local restaurant, a street market stall or in a Chinese family's home.

      That said, in this topic, I want to attempt to debunk some of the more prevalent myths. Not trying to start World War III.

      When I moved to China from the UK 25 years ago, I had my preconceptions. They were all wrong. Sweet and sour pork with egg fried rice was reported to be the second favourite dish in Britain, and had, of course, to be preceded by a plate of prawn/shrimp crackers. All washed down with a lager or three.

      Yet, in that quarter of a century, I've seldom seen a prawn cracker. And egg fried rice is usually eaten as a quick dish on its own, not usually as an accompaniment to main courses. Every menu featured a starter of prawn/shrimp toast which I have never seen in mainland China - just once in Hong Kong.

      But first, one myth needs to be dispelled. The starving Chinese! When I was a child I was encouraged to eat the particularly nasty bits on the plate by being told that the starving Chinese would lap them up. My suggestion that we could post it to them never went down too well. At that time (the late fifties) there was indeed a terrible famine in China (almost entirely manmade (Maomade)).

      When I first arrived in China, it was after having lived in Soviet Russia and I expected to see the same long lines of people queuing up to buy nothing very much in particular. Instead, on my first visit to a market (in Hunan Province), I was confronted with a wider range of vegetables, seafood, meat and assorted unidentified frying objects than I have ever seen anywhere else. And it was so cheap I couldn't convert to UK pounds or any other useful currency.
       
      I'm going to start with some of the simpler issues - later it may get ugly!

      1. Chinese people eat everything with chopsticks.
       

       
      No, they don't! Most things, yes, but spoons are also commonly used in informal situations. I recently had lunch in a university canteen. It has various stations selling different items. I found myself by the fried rice stall and ordered some Yangzhou fried rice. Nearly all the students and faculty sitting near me were having the same.

      I was using my chopsticks to shovel the food in, when I noticed that I was the only one doing so. Everyone else was using spoons. On investigating, I was told that the lunch break is so short at only two-and-a-half hours that everyone wants to eat quickly and rush off for their compulsory siesta.
       
      I've also seen claims that people eat soup with chopsticks. Nonsense. While people use chopsticks to pick out choice morsels from the broth, they will drink the soup by lifting their bowl to their mouths like cups. They ain't dumb!

      Anyway, with that very mild beginning, I'll head off and think which on my long list will be next.

      Thanks to @KennethT for advice re American-Chinese food.
       
       
    • By liuzhou
      Wowotou buns ( 窝窝头 wō wō tóu), also known more simply as wō tóu are originally from northern China. The name means "nest" and they come in many forms. These are the ones I use. As you can see, they are usually stuffed with whatever the cook decides. These are stuffed with spicy pork and pickled greens, but I've also served them with a seafood stuffing.
       

       
      This is the recipe I usually use.
       
       窝窝头
       
      350 grams all-purpose/plain flour
      150 grams black soya bean flour
      3 grams instant yeast
      260 grams  milk
       
      Mix the flours well, dissolve the yeast in the milk and stir into the flour until a dough forms. Knead the dough until smooth. Cover with plastic
      wrap and leave in a warm place until double in size.
       
      Sprinkle flour on the chopping board, knead the dough, adding more flour if too wet. until all air is expelled and the dough has a smooth surface.
       
      Form the dough into six even-sized balls and rub between the palms until smooth and round. Flatten slightly, then use your thumb to press the dough into a nest shape.
       
      Steam covered for 30-35 minutes.
       
      Note: The flours used vary a lot. Corn or sorghum flours are very popular, but I don't like corn and sorghum isn't the easiest to find here in southern China. Use what you like, but the overall quantity for this recipe should be 500 grams. It has been suggested that pure corn flour is too sticky, so probably best to mix it with regular wheat flour.
       
      They freeze well.
       
      Recipe adapted from 念念不忘的面食  by 刘哲菲 (Unforgettable Wheat Foods by Liu Zhefei). This isn't a direct translation, but retelling of the gist. Any errors are mine. Not Ms. Liu's.
    • By liuzhou
      Beef with Bitter Melon - 牛肉苦瓜
       

       
      The name may be off-putting to many people, but Chinese people do have an appreciation for bitter tastes and anyway, modern cultivars of this gourd are less bitter than in the past. Also, depending on how it's cooked, the bitterness can be mitigated.
       
      I'll admit that I wasn't sure at first, but have grown to love it.

      Note: "Beef with Bitter Melon (牛肉苦瓜 )" or "Bitter Melon with Beef (苦瓜牛肉)"? One Liuzhou restaurant I know has both on its menu! In Chinese, the ingredient listed first is the one there is most of, so, "beef with bitter melon" is mainly beef, whereas "bitter melon with beef" is much more a vegetable dish with just a little beef. This recipe is for the beefier version. To make the other version, just half the amount of beef and double the amount of melon.

      Ingredients

      Beef. One pound. Flank steak works best. Slice thinly against the grain.

      Bitter Melon. Half a melon. You can use the other half in a soup or other dish. Often available in Indian markets or supermarkets.
       

       
      Salted Black Beans. One tablespoon. Available in packets from Asian markets and supermarkets, these are salted, fermented black soy beans. They are used as the basis for 'black bean sauce', but we are going to be making our own sauce!

      Garlic. 6 cloves

      Cooking oil. Any vegetable oil except olive oil

      Shaoxing wine. See method

      Light soy sauce. One tablespoon

      Dark soy sauce. One teaspoon

      White pepper. See method

      Sesame oil. See method

      Method

      Marinate the beef in a 1/2 tablespoon of light soy sauce with a splash of Shaoxing wine along with a teaspoon or so of cornstarch or similar (I use potato starch). Stir well and leave for 15-30 minutes.

      Cut the melon(s) in half lengthwise and, using a teaspoon, scrape out all the seeds and pith. The more pith you remove, the less bitter the dish will be. Cut the melon into crescents about 1/8th inch wide.

      Rinse the black beans and drain. Crush them with the blade of your knife, then chop finely. Finely chop the garlic.

      Stir fry the meat in a tablespoon of oil over a high heat until done. This should take less than a minute. Remove and set aside.

      Add another tablespoon of oil and reduce heat to medium. fry the garlic and black beans until fragrant then add the bitter melon. Continue frying until the melon softens. then add a tablespoon of Shaoxing wine and soy sauces. Finally sprinkle on white pepper to taste along with a splash of sesame oil. Return the meat to the pan and mix everything well.

      Note: If you prefer the dish more saucy, you can add a tablespoon or so of water with the soy sauces.

      Serve with plained rice and a stir-fried green vegetable of choice.
       
    • By liuzhou
      Stir-fried Squid with Snow Peas - 荷兰豆鱿鱼
       

       
      Another popular restaurant dish that can easily be made at home. The only difficult part (and it's really not that difficult) is preparing the squid. However, your seafood purveyor should be able to do that for you. I have given details below.

      Ingredients

      Fresh squid. I tend to prefer the smaller squid in which case I allow one or two squid per person, depending on what other dishes I'm serving. You could use whole frozen squid if fresh is unavailable. Certainly not dried squid.

      Snow peas aka Mange Tout. Sugar snap peas can also be used. The final dish should be around 50% squid and 50% peas, so an amount roughly equivalent to the squid in bulk is what you are looking for. De-string if necessary and cut in half width-wise.

      Cooking oil. I use rice bran oil, but any vegetable cooking oil is fine. Not olive oil, though.

      Garlic.  I prefer this dish to be rather garlicky so I use one clove or more per squid. Adjust to your preference.

      Ginger. An amount equivalent to that of garlic.

      Red Chile. One or two small hot red chiles.

      Shaoxing wine. See method. Note: Unlike elsewhere, Shaoxing wine sold in N. America is salted. So, cut back on adding salt if using American sourced Shaoxing.

      Oyster sauce

      Sesame oil (optional)

      Salt

      Preparing the squid

      The squid should be cleaned and the tentacles and innards pulled out and set aside while you deal with the tubular body. Remove the internal cartilage / bone along with any remaining innards. With a sharp knife remove the "wings" then slit open the tube by sliding your knife inside and cutting down one side. Open out the now butterflied body. Remove the reddish skin (It is edible, but removing it makes for a nicer presentation. It peels off easily.) Again, using the sharp knife cut score marks on the inside at 1/8th of an inch intervals being careful not to cut all the way through. Then repeat at right angles to the original scoring, to give a cross-hatch effect. Do the same to the squid wings. Cut the body into rectangles roughly the size of a large postage stamp.
       

       
      Separate the tentacles from the innards by feeling for the beak, a hard growth just above the tentacles and at the start of the animal's digestive tract. Dispose of all but the tentacles. If they are long, half them.

      Wash all the squid meat again.

      Method

      There are only two ways to cook squid and have it remain edible. Long slow cooking (an hour or more) or very rapid (a few seconds) then served immediately. Anything else and you'll be chewing on rubber. So that is why I am stir frying it. Few restaurants get this right, so I mainly eat it at home.

      Heat your wok and add oil. Have a cup of water to the side. Add the garlic, ginger and chile. Should you think it's about to burn, throw in a little of that water. It will evaporate almost immediately but slow down some of the heat.
       
      As soon as you can smell the fragrance of the garlic and ginger, add the peas and salt and toss until the peas are nearly cooked (Try a piece to see!). Almost finally, add the squid with a tablespoon of the Shaoxing and about the same of oyster sauce. Do not attempt to add the oyster sauce straight from the bottle. The chances of the whole bottle emptying into your dinner is high! Believe me. I've been there!

      The squid will curl up and turn opaque in seconds. It's cooked. Sprinkle with a teaspoon of so of sesame oil (if used) and serve immediately!
       
    • By liuzhou
      Big Plate Chicken - 大盘鸡
       

       
      This very filling dish of chicken and potato stew is from Xinjiang province in China's far west, although it is said to have been invented by a visitor from Sichuan. In recent years, it has become popular in cities across China, where it is made using a whole chicken which is chopped, with skin and on the bone, into small pieces suitable for easy chopstick handling. If you want to go that way, any Asian market should be able to chop the bird for you. Otherwise you may use boneless chicken thighs instead.

      Ingredients

      Boneless skinless chicken thighs  6

      Light soy sauce

      Dark soy sauce

      Shaoxing wine

      Cornstarch or similar. I use potato starch.

      Vegetable oil (not olive oil)

      Star anise, 4

      Cinnamon, 1 stick

      Bay leaves, 5 or 6

      Fresh ginger, 6 coin sized slices

      Garlic.  5 cloves, roughly chopped

      Sichuan peppercorns,  1 tablespoon

      Whole dried red chiles,   6 -10  (optional). If you can source the Sichuan chiles known as Facing Heaven Chiles, so much the better.

      Potatoes 2 or 3 medium sized. peeled and cut into bite-sized pieces

      Carrot. 1,  thinly sliced

      Dried wheat noodles.  8 oz. Traditionally, these would be a long, flat thick variety. I've use Italian tagliatelle successfully.    

      Red bell pepper. 1 cut into chunks

      Green bell pepper, 1 cut into chunks

      Salt

      Scallion, 2 sliced.
         
      Method

      First, cut the chicken into bite sized pieces and marinate in 1 1/2 teaspoons light soy sauce, 3 teaspoons of Shaoxing and 1 1/2 teaspoons of cornstarch. Set aside for about twenty minutes while you prepare the rest of the ingredients.

      Heat the wok and add three tablespoons cooking oil. Add the ginger, garlic, star anise, cinnamon stick, bay leaves, Sichuan peppercorns and chiles. Fry on a low heat for a  minute or so. If they look about to burn, splash a little water into your wok. This will lower the temperature slightly. Add the chicken and turn up the heat. Continue frying until the meat is nicely seared, then add the potatoes and carrots. Stir fry a minute more then add 2 teaspoons of the dark soy sauce, 2 tablespoons of the light soy sauce and 2 tablespoons of the Shaoxing wine along with 3 cups of water. Bring to a boil, then reduce to medium. Cover and cook for around 15 minutes until the potatoes are done.

      While the main dish is cooking, cook the noodles separately according to the packet instructions.  Reserve  some of the noodle cooking water and drain.

      When the chicken and potatoes are done, you may add a little of the noodle water if the dish appears on the dry side. It should be saucy, but not soupy. Add the bell peppers and cook for three to four minutes more. Add scallions. Check seasoning and add some salt if it needs it. It may not due to the soy sauce and Shaoxing.

      Serve on a large plate for everyone to help themselves from. Plate the noodles first, then cover with the meat and potato. Enjoy.
       
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...