Chamber Vacuum Sealers, 2011–2014

[Chris Amirault]

Any/all of the above. I fiddled with it, didn't notice much change after the first vacuum treatment. Give it a go and see what you think.

[lstrelau]

I just vacuumed once - used maximum time (60 sec). Used several different liquids including tequila with some chili, lemon syrup and some white wine that was handy. All were interesting. Forgot about one package for over a week and threw that one away without trying.

Also, this was using perhaps less than optimal melon available in Canada in winter. Look forward to using really good summer fruit.

[Paul Kierstead]

A good vacuum pump is a little over $100 and a seal bar is also probably about $100. Designing a method to push the seal bar closed and get power to it shouldn't be too big a hurdle. More later.

I've contemplated this for a while (or even just a vacuum system for jars and compression, but no bags). I'm not as far down the road as you, but I do have a large, fairly powerful vacuum pump (rotary vane). One of the big issues seems to be moisture getting into the pump. The commercial chamber machines have fairly elaborate channels, etc to keep the moisture out of the pump. Have any thoughts on that? I've consider just one of the compressed air drier systems, just run in 'reverse' as it were, but not sure it would work.

Correction: It is a "two chamber rocking piston oil-less vacuum pumptwo chamber rocking piston oil-less vacuum pump" with Aluminum parts to prevent corrosion. Still don't want to be sucking some acidic marinade in there

Edited April 28, 2011 by Paul Kierstead (log)

[Msk]

I've been compressing with my cheap-o faucet aspirator, so it takes several shots to get decent compression - but I'd imagine that if you were doing it in a bag which was being sealed, you'd have to cut the bag each time to be able to draw a new vacuum.

With the VP112, if you hit the Off button instead of "Stop" it will evacuate without sealing.

Mike

[KennethT]

A good vacuum pump is a little over $100 and a seal bar is also probably about $100. Designing a method to push the seal bar closed and get power to it shouldn't be too big a hurdle. More later.

I've contemplated this for a while (or even just a vacuum system for jars and compression, but no bags). I'm not as far down the road as you, but I do have a large, fairly powerful vacuum pump (rotary vane). One of the big issues seems to be moisture getting into the pump. The commercial chamber machines have fairly elaborate channels, etc to keep the moisture out of the pump. Have any thoughts on that? I've consider just one of the compressed air drier systems, just run in 'reverse' as it were, but not sure it would work.

Correction: It is a "two chamber rocking piston oil-less vacuum pumptwo chamber rocking piston oil-less vacuum pump" with Aluminum parts to prevent corrosion. Still don't want to be sucking some acidic marinade in there

Paul - wow, a 2 chamber system should pull quite a lot of vacuum. Much more than you'd need I think... but you can never have too much as you can always stop it early. In any case, I plan to put one of these between the tank and the vacuum pump. Coalescing filters are very good at removing aersol oil and water vapor from compressed air lines, and I'd assume they would work in a vacuum line as well - but I'm planning on calling their tech support to check.

With such a powerful pump, just make sure your chamber is very strong - I'd hate for it to implode one day!

[Paul Kierstead]

Actually, it'll only pull 27", and the cut off (which I could probably override) stops at 25". It is designed for a good vacuum, but also to move a lot of air (6.5 CFM). So it'll make a damn quick evacuation, but only about normal for a commercial unit I think in terms of strength. I use it for vacuum veneering with a 4'x8' vacuum bag....

[blackp]

....., but also to move a lot of air (6.5 CFM). So it'll make a damn quick evacuation, but only about normal for a commercial unit I think in terms of strength.

I have a Henkelman Boxer 42 unit which is a large table top commercial machine. It's pump according to the spec. pulls 21m3/h which equates to 12.3CFM or nearly twice as fast as your pump. The cycle time for my machine is 15-35 seconds and the best I can calculate the volume of the chamber is that it is something less than 1.2cf (or 0.03 m3). If my calculations are correct it should vacuum in around 6-10 seconds which seems about right then allowing a couple of seconds for sealing and a further few for soft air introduction the stated cycle times seem about right. I notice that it takes much longer to pull the last few percent of vacuum than it does to go from 0-80%, so I don't think that you can just calculate the time using only the volume of the chamber and the vacuum rate of the pump.

What size of the chamber are you planning to vacuum? If it is too large you may find that a 6.5cfm pump takes a while to get there.

[Paul Kierstead]

The pump evacuates a 4'x8' bag (note feet, not inches) in a quite reasonable period of time (usually to 23"HG or so is what I set it to; note sure how long it takes, but quite quickly). I am definitely not concerned about evacuation time; it would have to be very large indeed to be an issue. When I start vaccing 6'x1'x'1 chambers (a whole moose leg?) I'll get concerned

[abadoozy]

I did the watermelon last night, and it was great! 2-3 oz of liquor for about 24 ounces of melon was light but definitely tasty. I might use more liquor next time. Anyone else thinking of fruit salad?

I also had a thought in the middle of the night that I just tried - cold brewed coffee. I know you can make a good cup of coffee by letting the grounds and water sit overnight then straining and heating, or keeping cold for iced coffee. Why not try speeding up the process with the vacuum sealer?

Following this recipe, I put 1/3 cup (22 grams) of fresh ground coffee in a bag with 1.5 cups of water and vacuumed. At about the 25 second mark it started boiling over, to the point that it didn't seal. I figure that didn't really matter, what I was looking for was the vacuum, not necessarily the seal. I pulled it out and filtered through a gold filter. And it worked - the coffee was definitely strong and good.

Still, I wanted to see what would happen with a longer vacuum, so put it back in the bag with the grounds and vacuumed again. Came out slightly stronger this time. Next time I'm going to use a larger bag and hopefully get a longer initial vacuum and see what happens.

I'll definitely be using this technique for iced coffees this summer. Very nice to not have to brew then wait for it to cool. I'm also thinking I could use some cream and maybe some flavorings (nutmeg/cinnamon/vanilla bean/whatever) and make it interesting that way.

Or liquor... there's always liquor. Iced Irish Coffee, anyone?

[Chris Amirault]

Genius.

[KennethT]

Update on vacuum filters - I just got off the phone with tech support at Parker (the parent co. of Wilkerson linked upthread). Unfortunately, you can't use a coalescing filter because it can shatter under the vacuum... BUT, they do make a filter made for vacuum.. it only has a 10 micron filter, but the engineer said it should remove water/oil vapors just fine. This is a link to their catalog - once loaded, do a search for "vfp" and you should see it.. It's in section B, digital page 55. It has a stated range of up to 28inHg, but she said that there is a safety factor built it, so you could go a bit higher with no problems. It's just not intended for REALLY strong vacuum, which we wouldn't be using in the kitchen anyway...

[edsel]

...

I also had a thought in the middle of the night that I just tried - cold brewed coffee. I know you can make a good cup of coffee by letting the grounds and water sit overnight then straining and heating, or keeping cold for iced coffee. Why not try speeding up the process with the vacuum sealer?

...

Genius.

Agreed! This is a great idea. I'll be trying it tomorrow.

[Carlton]

So I've decided i'm in the market for a chamber sealer, my foodsaver just isn't cutting it anymore. Is everyone here still happy with their VP112? The only negative I've read is that the dry piston that is in the VP112 and VP210 will give out faster when being used with liquids than the oil pump in the VP215, but I figure that probably is still after years of home use. I know the VP112 can't use retort bags but the manual does say it works with the 4 mil bags which would be a little thicker at least.

Obviously price is a consideration, I can't spend a couple thousand but do you think the larger units like the VP210 or VP215 would be worth getting over the Vp112? Quality Matters has them all on sale right now and the VP215 is especially cheap. I'm not really concerned about size or weight, I won't be traveling with it and I can lift 90 pounds enough to get it off the counter and into a cabinet.

For those with the VP112 what would you estimate is the largest size chunk of meat you could put in? I know a section of tenderloin would be no problem but what about a section of a rib roast?

p.s. Chris A, I know we've both been enjoying the MC Pastrami lately. I've resorted to doing my brine in a large cambro container because I'm doing batches of 3kg+ at a time, it's much easier than trying to seal that much liquid (especially with a food saver). I don't know how much effect of the brine I'm losing by not having it vacuumed but it seems to taste the same. I'm getting so many requests for pastrami now my poor little SousVide Supreme can't keep up.

[avaserfi]

I'm getting curious about this topic as well. My foodsaver is dying a slow death and will probably give out any day now. This was one of their first models and was used infrequently for years. As soon as I started to use it more often for sous vide cooking it started to break down. I really don't want to spend $200 on another foodsaver just to have it break and I know there are other companies that make clamp style sealers, but a chamber vac is intriguing, especially with the lower cost bags.

Right now I'm trying to figure out the benefits of having a chamber vacuum sealer over a clamp style (I have not gotten to the relevant portion in Modernist Cuisine, if there is one) . The most obvious is the ability to easily seal liquids. Along side that there is speeding up marinades, compressing fruits and better storage life. Considering the fact that the cheaper vacuum chamber sealers cost about 3x a clamp sealer (not including bag costs), does it offer anything else to the experience over a clamp sealer?

Also, are there any downsides to having a chamber sealer vs clamp sealer? I've read that some models might crush softer foods, is this really an issue?

[KennethT]

To me, it seems that the biggest problem for a chamber sealer is the fact that everything has to be cold before being sealed. So, for me right now, using a ziplock, I can sear a piece of meat, put a little liquid in the bag (or rendered fat) and seal it right away. If using a chamber sealer, I'd have to chill it in the fridge for a while until it's cold - which would probably take a couple of hours.

[Chris Amirault]

Yep -- and the first time you forget about that, well, it's quite an experience cleaning the thing up....

[avaserfi]

Thus far I haven't had a need to seal anything while it was hot. The warmest thing I have sealed was slightly above room temp which, from what I understand, shouldn't be a problem.

For those who upgraded from a clamp style vacuum sealer to a chamber sealer do you still think it was worth it?

[LoftyNotions]

Thus far I haven't had a need to seal anything while it was hot. The warmest thing I have sealed was slightly above room temp which, from what I understand, shouldn't be a problem.

For those who upgraded from a clamp style vacuum sealer to a chamber sealer do you still think it was worth it?

While I'll never be able to financially justify it, for the toy value I'm very happy with my chamber sealer. With my clamp style I could seal somewhat larger items, but that hasn't been a big problem.

Now that bags only cost 2 to 8 cents each I find myself using it a lot more than when bags were over 30 cents each.

And for food preparations like curry infused apples and mango sorbet, they're awesome.

Chris, does your sealer have a manual seal/override button? On mine, if something starts boiling I just hit the manual seal and haven't had a spill to date.

Larry

[Mayur]

Quick question (related):

Any advice on which bags are best to get for the Vacmaster? I'm completely new to the model and I'm unsure exactly how thick a bag I'll be needing for sous vide vs. storage vs. infusion, etc.

[paulpegg]

Quick question (related):

Any advice on which bags are best to get for the Vacmaster? I'm completely new to the model and I'm unsure exactly how thick a bag I'll be needing for sous vide vs. storage vs. infusion, etc.

The VP112 uses commercial bags such as these from VacuumSealersUnlimitedYou cannot use the Foodsaver type with a mesh section.

[Carlton]

With the issues I'm starting to have with my foodsaver I've decided I'm def going to be picking up a chamber unit. My question for you guys is VP112 for $600 or VP210 for $750. Is the 210 worth an extra $150, I don't mind the price if the value is there. I'm looking to pick it up in the next couple days so your feedback is appreciated. For people with the vp112, what would you estimate the largest size roast you could fit in. Would it fit something like a portion of a rib roast?

[LoftyNotions]

Quick question (related):

Any advice on which bags are best to get for the Vacmaster? I'm completely new to the model and I'm unsure exactly how thick a bag I'll be needing for sous vide vs. storage vs. infusion, etc.

My chamber sealer isn't a Vacmaster, but I've been happy with standard 3 mil bags for everything. I have used Mylar bags for storing Transglutaminase, but that's a special case.

Larry

[LoftyNotions]

Also, are there any downsides to having a chamber sealer vs clamp sealer? I've read that some models might crush softer foods, is this really an issue?

There is a discussion of this in the Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment thread starting on page 13, post # 376. Probably the most useful information is In post 397 LINKED HERE.

Larry

[avaserfi]

Has anyone ever run into a situation where an item did not fit in the chamber? Is it possible to use a chamber vacuum sealer as an edge sealer in this case?

[LoftyNotions]

Has anyone ever run into a situation where an item did not fit in the chamber? Is it possible to use a chamber vacuum sealer as an edge sealer in this case?

I've seen videos of the MVS31 being used like that, but I haven't personally tried it.

Larry