Food Guides to Paris: Zagat's etc.

[robyn]

The Michelin Guide to Paris costs $11.53 on Amazon (where I bought it). It covers most (all?) of the restaurants you mention. It lists the prices (in euros) - both for the carte and the menu(s) - including a lunch menu if there is one. All contact information - including web sites if applicable. And dates when the restaurants are closed. I think it is worth $11.53 . After looking up certain restaurants - I think the prices listed are about 10%-15% low (food prices have gone up a fair amount recently). Robyn

[ulterior epicure]

The Michelin Guide to Paris costs $11.53 on Amazon (where I bought it).  It covers most (all?) of the restaurants you mention.  It lists the prices (in euros) - both for the carte and the menu(s) - including a lunch menu if there is one.  All contact information - including web sites if applicable.  And dates when the restaurants are closed.  I think it is worth $11.53  .  After looking up certain restaurants - I think the prices listed are about 10%-15% low (food prices have gone up a fair amount recently).  Robyn

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Yes, yes, to be sure, it's on order. But, I got a message yesterday from Amazon that it's on back-order, for some unknown reason. I'm sure I'll get mine soon and I'll stop pestering y'all.

[robyn]

The Michelin Guide to Paris costs $11.53 on Amazon (where I bought it).  It covers most (all?) of the restaurants you mention.  It lists the prices (in euros) - both for the carte and the menu(s) - including a lunch menu if there is one.  All contact information - including web sites if applicable.  And dates when the restaurants are closed.  I think it is worth $11.53  .  After looking up certain restaurants - I think the prices listed are about 10%-15% low (food prices have gone up a fair amount recently).  Robyn

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Yes, yes, to be sure, it's on order. But, I got a message yesterday from Amazon that it's on back-order, for some unknown reason. I'm sure I'll get mine soon and I'll stop pestering y'all.

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Seems to be in stock now. I'd also get a Zagat's Guide - because the Michelin coverage is very limited (compared to the old "Red Guide" - which used to list just about any restaurant you might stumble on. Robyn

[ulterior epicure]

Seems to be in stock now.  I'd also get a Zagat's Guide - because the Michelin coverage is very limited (compared to the old "Red Guide" - which used to list just about any restaurant you might stumble on.  Robyn

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Yeah, that's the strange thing; the website says its in stock, but for some reason, I got a note telling me that it's been delayed. I'm not *too* worried at this point.

Zagat? Really? Is it largely French-biased or American-biased.

Made reservations at L'Arpege.

[robyn]

I don't know about "bias" with Zagat's. And I don't know the difference between a French and an American bias. What do you mean by that? I would divide things more along a continuum from very traditional - to very avant garde - without taking countries into account. Not that one end of the continuum is necessarily better than the other. But I do have my prejudices. Heaven knows - I love licorice - and have always loved licorice. I eat it a lot - straight. But if I see another menu item paired with licorice just for the heck of it (which seems to be very fashionable these days) - I'm walking in the other direction. It is peculiar that many restaurants - not only in France - but elsewhere - tout X,Y or Z with licorice - but don't seem to use a lot of fennel (which imparts a much more subtle licorice taste - more suitable for pairing with other ingredients IMO). Or perhaps they're using fennel but say it's licorice because fennel sounds so old fashioned and boring. Whatever - when I want licorice - I eat licorice. When I want to impart a subtle licorice flavor to a dish (and subtle is important when using such a strong flavor) - I use fennel (or sometimes a touch of anisette).

The one thing I can be pretty much 100% sure about is you - as a tourist - will not get 100% wonderful treatment in the newest hottest Le Fooding bistro - as opposed to the treatment that someone who lives in the neighborhood and goes there twice a week gets. That is the nature of places like Paris - New York - and especially places like Miami and Los Angeles - etc. Where nothing is "undiscovered". OTOH - I fully expect that you will get wonderful treatment in more traditional Michelin restaurants with stars. And you can have some fun in lower end not so trendy places too. I am pretty much planning to "bar bell" our meals in Paris. Some very high end. Some much lower - just "catch as catch can".

I usually buy a Zagat's guide when I go to a big city - and use it for looking up places where I might want to have lunch or little deal dinners when I'm in the neighborhood doing other things. It lists places by neighborhoods - types of food - open Sunday - nice patio - any kind of list you can imagine. I consider it more of a restaurant "map" than a ratings guide. So if I am in museum X - and I am hungry for lunch - I might find an interesting place on a side street a couple of blocks away that I might not otherwise know exists (although I'll always look at the place and the menu before deciding to eat there). Robyn

[ulterior epicure]

I don't know about "bias" with Zagat's.  And I don't know the difference between a French and an American bias.  What do you mean by that?  I would divide things more along a continuum from very traditional - to very avant garde - without taking countries into account.  Not that one end of the continuum is necessarily better than the other.  But I do have my prejudices.  Heaven knows - I love licorice - and have always loved licorice.  I eat it a lot - straight.  But if I see another menu item paired with licorice just for the heck of it (which seems to be very fashionable these days) - I'm walking in the other direction.  It is peculiar that many restaurants - not only in France - but elsewhere - tout X,Y or Z with licorice - but don't seem to use a lot of fennel (which imparts a much more subtle licorice taste - more suitable for pairing with other ingredients IMO).  Or perhaps they're using fennel but say it's licorice because fennel sounds so old fashioned and boring.  Whatever - when I want licorice - I eat licorice.  When I want to impart a subtle licorice flavor to a dish (and subtle is important when using such a strong flavor) - I use fennel (or sometimes a touch of anisette).

The one thing I can be pretty much 100% sure about is you - as a tourist - will not get 100% wonderful treatment in the newest hottest Le Fooding bistro - as opposed to the treatment that someone who lives in the neighborhood and goes there twice a week gets.  That is the nature of places like Paris - New York - and especially places like Miami and Los Angeles - etc.  Where nothing is "undiscovered".  OTOH - I fully expect that you will get wonderful treatment in more traditional Michelin restaurants with stars.  And you can have some fun in lower end not so trendy places too.  I am pretty much planning to "bar bell" our meals in Paris.  Some very high end.  Some much lower - just "catch as catch can". 

I usually buy a Zagat's guide when I go to a big city - and use it for looking up places where I might want to have lunch or little deal dinners when I'm in the neighborhood doing other things.  It lists places by neighborhoods - types of food - open Sunday - nice patio - any kind of list you can imagine.  I consider it more of a restaurant "map" than a ratings guide.  So if I am in museum X - and I am hungry for lunch - I might find an interesting place on a side street a couple of blocks away that I might not otherwise know exists (although I'll always look at the place and the menu before deciding to eat there).  Robyn

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Sorry, I should have been much more clear; I could have saved you a dissertation about licorice and fennel.

Presumably, as Zagat does in the U.S., the ratings for restaurants in the Paris guide are based on "votes" submitted by the general dining public. What I meant to ask is (simply) is whether the ratings for the Paris Zagat are a result of a higher number of local Parisian voters or foreign (American) voters. In other words, are the opinions of the Paris Zagat more French-b(i)ased or American/non-French-b(i)ased?

Edited August 23, 2008 by ulterior epicure (log)

[robyn]

Sorry, I should have been much more clear; I could have saved you a dissertation about licorice and fennel.

Presumably, as Zagat does in the U.S., the ratings for restaurants in the Paris guide are based on "votes" submitted by the general dining public.  What I meant to ask is (simply) is whether the ratings for the Paris Zagat are a result of a higher number of local Parisian voters or foreign (American) voters.  In other words, are the opinions of the Paris Zagat more French-b(i)ased or American/non-French-b(i)ased?

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I'm not sure there's a scientific way to answer your question. I did take a look at the Zagat on-line reviews - and they seem to vary a lot. For example - l'Ambroisie had 41 on-line reviews. Twelve were from people outside the US - and four were from people who live in Paris. Spring had 12 on-line reviews. Eight were from people outside the US - and five were from people who live in Paris. Note that Zagat used to publish its Paris guide in French - and I assume that version had a large amount of local input. Robyn

[John Talbott]

I'm not sure there's a scientific way to answer your question.

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Colette fills her form out in English and I do it in French; so who knows how we're classified. I've heard rumors that American-based respondants are over-represented.

[robyn]

I'm not sure there's a scientific way to answer your question.

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Colette fills her form out in English and I do it in French; so who knows how we're classified. I've heard rumors that American-based respondants are over-represented.

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Like I've said - I think Zagat's highest and best use is as a restaurant "map" when you're wandering around in a strange area looking for nearby places to eat - have a drink - etc. I've stumbled into some pretty good meals using Zagat's. Of course - I've stumbled into some pretty good meals without Zagat's as well. Zagat's also has a *lot* more listings than the new format Michelin guide (for example - Baratin - showcased in the Gourmet Magazine article - is in Zagat's - but not Michelin). And it's lighter (easier to carry around). I don't have a clue about the accuracy of the ratings in either guide - but the Zagat's is the one that I will probably throw in my purse when I am exploring various neighborhoods in Paris. Robyn

P.S. I am not as organized a traveler as some. Apart from maybe 3 or so major reservations - I will leave things up in the air and decide what to do when I'm in Paris.