Bad Behavior at a Restaurant Bar?

[Kouign Aman]

Why is it not ok for the man to set rules for his own bar?

Why must the bar meet FatGuy's preconceived notion of a neighborhood bar, and aspire to be no more or no less?

Why is it ok for a food discussion website to have rules, and enforce them to maintain a desired atmosphere, but not, in FatGuy's opinion, ok for a bar owner to do the same?

Point was made up a few, about the risk of a spilled drink on a laptop. Good one. Who's insurance covers if the waitress/waiter/patron trips during drink transport?

Its NOT absurd to say "his place, his rules". He probably has a sign up (most restaurants etc do) saying :we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone:. He didnt. He just awkwardly tried to communicate that he wanted the laptop out of use. If you dont like the rules, find another bar. Put his place on the list for another occasion.

Its fair to not like his rules. Its fair to wish they were different. Its fair to find a place that provides the desired experience. Its not fair or reasonable to insist the bartender is wrong, for having reasonable rules that dont meet a specific patron's fantasy of a bar.

WHY those are his rules, are reasonable to discuss and to wonder about. There've been many suggestions on this thread. but its flat out bullshit to say its invalid to just ask his rules to be respected.

[Landru]

Why is it not ok for the man to set rules for his own bar?

Why must the bar meet FatGuy's preconceived notion of a neighborhood bar, and aspire to be no more or no less?

Why is it ok for a food discussion website to have rules, and enforce them to maintain a desired atmosphere, but not, in FatGuy's opinion, ok for a bar owner to do the same?

...

I was wondering why no-one has spoken about that egullet elephant that's been hanging around the bar with or without a laptop. I have to admit that I put off joining egullet for quite a long time and just lurked because the joining policy irked me. I'm sure there were reasons, but I did not feel encouraged or welcomed like I have at other forum websites. I felt guilty of something and I didn't even what it was! I now realize that the forum administrators have made a decision to get only committed people in here to raise the level of discourse than they saw in other websites and hence the extra hoops to gaining admittance.

Perhaps the laptop banning bar/restaurant owner is trying to raise the level of discourse? I happen to agree with him, in that I tend to view a laptop denizen as one who has chosen to "bubble" themselves out of the rest of the room - they seem to cut off communication or even acknowledgment. It seems that their universe is happening on the laptop and we are secondary. But, somehow that doesn't happen with solo reading/writing - solo readers/writers still seem part of the room's society - they seem more open to me - in a way that the laptop-bubbled typer doesn't. Don't ask me why - could be just a prejudice. In any case these are my two-cents. Hope this doesn't get me kicked off the forum as it's only my second post...

[Fat Guy]

Well, I trust that those who have taken the "his bar, his rules" position will never complain about an eG Forums rule again! (Not that eG Forums is my bar or even a bar, and not that its rules are my rules.) But of course, the two situations are not really comparable. Our rules are clearly posted, so there should be no surprises about what those rules are; the restaurant's rules are, as far as I can tell, not written anywhere. (I don't think we'd be having the same discussion if there had been a sign outside the restaurant saying "No laptop computer use.") We're a membership organization, similar to the private club analogies that were drawn above; the restaurant is a place of public accommodation. And we encourage laptop computer use.

[Kouign Aman]

Well, I trust that those who have taken the "his bar, his rules" position will never complain about an eG Forums rule again!

Now, that's funny Fat Guy, being as [Decorum - bullet 7]eG Forums > eGullet Society Support and Documentation Center > eGullet Society Policies, Guidelines & Documents - internal link to Decorum and topicality guidelines.

Of course we can, as we did here, discuss whether we like a rule or not (in a bar or restaurant or other food establishment, or the FDA). And whether we think the philosophy behind the rule is sound or not. We simply cant choose to disobey the rules as patrons of that establishment.

So, Chris's bar owner runs a bar in a way Chris wishes he didnt. Many folks agree with the owner, and prefer a non-electronic bar. Others dont get why it would be a problem; laptops and their users do not disturb these folks. Pretty much everyone seems to agree that the guy can set the rules for his own place.

Regarding a sign posted out front - if he has this problem three times, I'll bet he puts one up!

<edited to correct formating>

Edited December 5, 2007 by Kouign Aman (log)

[slkinsey]

I don't think it's reasonable to expect that a restaurant or bar have rules posted outside. Gramercy Tavern doesn't have sign reading: "no shirt, no shoes, no dice dude" on the front door.

[Kouign Aman]

I don't think it's reasonable to expect that a restaurant or bar have rules posted outside.  Gramercy Tavern doesn't have sign reading: "no shirt, no shoes, no dice dude" on the front door.

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If it did, they'd better keep a supply in stock. I think a sign that says "no dice dude" would make a super souvenir and they'd see high turnover!

[slkinsey]

Perhaps with a companion sign saying "learn it, know it, live it"?

[johnder]

I don't think it's reasonable to expect that a restaurant or bar have rules posted outside.  Gramercy Tavern doesn't have sign reading: "no shirt, no shoes, no dice dude" on the front door.

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If it did, they'd better keep a supply in stock. I think a sign that says "no dice dude" would make a super souvenir and they'd see high turnover!

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We have had the "etiquette guide" swiped from PDT's bathrooms a few times now. People would rip the frame right off the wall and take the whole thing. We have since changed it so they are screwed to the wall with tamper resistant screws. So unless you have a pin-head torx security screwdriver with you, hopefully they will be there for the long run.

[eje]

We have had the "etiquette guide" swiped from PDT's bathrooms a few times now.  People would rip the frame right off the wall and take the whole thing.  We have since changed it so they are screwed to the wall with tamper resistant screws.  So unless you have a pin-head torx security screwdriver with you, hopefully they will be there for the long run.

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I would except the lovely folks at the TSA took it away all my pinhead torx bits the last time I forgot them in my briefcase and tried to fly with them.

I guess they were afraid I was going to take the plane apart in mid-flight.

If you've got a tech heavy crowd, I wouldn't count on them sticking around too long.

;-)

[Chris Amirault]

If you've got a tech heavy crowd, I wouldn't count on them sticking around too long.

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Just the sort of bad seeds that would be carrying around laptops and talking on their cell phones.