annanstee

Hi Dave, I would like some examples of when we, as diners, have shown clouded judgment in our forum. I myself am not claiming that I or anyone should withhold our true opinions. I am suggesting that part of having integrity is framing your argument in a way that is cogent and constructive. I am also suggesting that ad hominem attacks will both weaken your argument and invite return attacks- and that you should then be prepared to get as good as you give. If we do "play nice" over on the board, it may be because the professionals over there have been known to rigorously defend their places of business, and we may not be in the mood to be dragged into a brouhaha. Then again, those are kind of fun too-though being a well brought up young lady, I usually prefer to watch from the stands. As Arne points out, many of these professionals are an integral part of our community- and we cannot exclude them because of what they do. Why would we? It may also be that as this community evolves, people are more and more leery of being controversial, because of evolving editorial policies. And yes, it is personal. Life is personal. And that is fine. And you know what? I might tell my buddy if he has BO, but I may not tell him that his plaid and polka dot combo doesn't work for me and publicly shame him into wearing chino's and a button down instead. I will not assume he has never heard of button downs. I will continue to allow him to shop for his own clothes. It is, in your analogy, the difference between telling a chef about, say, a bad oyster, or that you don't think tuna melts are a combo that works for most, and telling him that if he continues to make tuna melts, you won't be held responsible for ensuing public flaying, and that you will make fun of all his friends, and his dog. Edited for Dan Qualeyness.

Well until GMO's are labelled, buying organic is one way to know that I am NOT eating transgenic products. And I live in a city very close to the valley that produces most of the produce in my province, so I have certainly been on both kinds of farm, and on canola farms as well, the latter of which reliably had crude oil extractors on them.

I didn't have it when I was there, but I think it is 65.00

Excellent idea!

That is what mama always taught me

I don't think the average diner on the Vancouver forum pursues an agenda- certainly there are a few professionals who use the site to shill- but most do not and certainly the chef in this case is and has been an active member with much to say of interest outside of the Rare adventure. To me it is natural that a long standing and valued member of the eG community is going to get some encouragement. When I go to the Pastry thread, I see the same kind of encouragement go out to those starting a new business, by both fellow professionals and enthusiasts- so aren't we all to some degree a little clubby? Maybe I try to frame criticism gently and/or withhold it in some cases because I don't confuse my right to express an opinion with my right to be offensive- admittedly a widespread malady. Certainly I do have the right to be offensive, but I must also realize, to quote Lou Reed, that "spitting in the wind, it comes back twice as hard". Anyone who has taken Critical Thinking 101 knows that an ad hominem attack leads to a fallacious argument. The real issue in credibility comes when egulleters (including Gillster) attack personally rather than framing their opinions in a reasoned way. I think that this will go much further to undermine our credibility as a community than the occasional overenthusiasm. Look at how A. Gill's has been questioned. With Respect, Ann Edited for formatting

Well, no one to my knowledge has yet created a transgenic corn cultivar with blowfly genes, so that evidence couldn't possibly exist. For those transgenic cultivars that do actually exist -- like Bt corn-- there is an enormous amount of literature. ← You're right- and that was meant to be kind of a joke. To me there is a distinction between transgenesis between widely variant species and cross breeding. But aren't antibiotic resistant crops implicated in the problem of Superbugs?

hmmm, don't mean to be argumentative, but this is kind of a perfect example of what i was talking about. your intentions are certainly in the right place. and i'm all for supporting small farmers, but that doesn't mean organic. earthbound farms runs about 45,000 acres of lettuce. interesting varieties? that's a small farmer attribute, not an organic one. gmos? about the only food crop in the us with a significant gmo percentage is soybeans (watch out tofu eaters!). the gmo corn you hear so much about is field corn, not sweet corn. ← Don't forget about Rapeseed (Canola). And you are right- there are two real arguments here. Lets just say that I prefer local, sustainable, seasonal, organic food for ethical, environmental, and health reasons. I will buy local and organic first, local, small producer, sustainable second non local organic 3rd, standard agro-factory stuff last.

This gets to the point of is it good because it's organic or is it good because it's local and therefore fresher? I lean toward the local/fresher argument. The only taste difference I've noticed in a grocery store purchased certified organic item and conventional is in dairy products. Local beats non-local for taste everytime for any product. You should consider WHY you care about something being "organic" or not. There's a Consumer Reports piece from the last year or so about whether you're getting your money's worth when buying organic. They measured pesticide residues on various organic and conventional produce. The organic benefit from that perspective was negligible on broccoli and asparagus (I think), but better for apples and peaches. ← I guess I am lucky, because in my area organic produce and dairy are not very expensive compared to the standard- meat is, however. As far as meat goes, there is absolutely no comparison between a battery chicken and a free range bird. If that bird is organic, so much the better. It is true that the taste is likely better because the produce is in season and because it has often travelled a much shorter distance. One result of the latter is that producers can let the fruit actually ripen on the tree. The point to me is that the organic producer is more interested in the "sensory" qualities than a standard producer more interested in "travels well". And whither GMO's? There is simply not enough evidence out there to tell me whether it is safe to graft - say blowfly- genes onto corn. Edited for punctuation

There are other issues though- other than the chemicals one ingests from non organic fruits and vegetables. I do prefer them, and probably 50-60% of the food I buy is organic- most of the fruits and vegetables- yoghurt, eggs, and butter, meat and chicken when I can. Why? You are right- part of the reason is that alot of the organic stuff is raised by smaller producers who seem to care more about what they are doing. They also often produce a more interesting variety, not the same old species all of the time. The real issues for me are health, sustainability, and GMO's. I just don't feel comfortable having Monsanto own the patent on my food.

The Organic Connection has fantastic lemons right now- so juicy and they actually taste...extra lemony Made a salad dressing with them, some pear from the same place, and some olive oil and salt. Dressed Butter lettuce from one of the other purveyors there, red onion, goat cheese, sweet and hot pecans, strawberries. I know its early for them, but the pomegranates were all gone. The butter lettuce came with the roots still on- it was branded "live lettuce" or something; you can keep it on your counter in a little water. It was the most perfect looking lettuce I have seen in ages. Not a wilted leaf. .99 a head and all usable.

You probably already know this - but Spotted Dick is an English steamed pudding as well as an unfortunate result of injudicious partnering

Really good fleur de sel Aged Balsamic Vinegar A special oil- truffle is good- how about hazlenut or something?

The sad fact is that this is more an attack on eGullet than it is on Brian's work, which is unfair to Rare and what they are trying to do. This is not what I would consider serious food writing. Sorry if it is off topic Arne.

I don't get what happened to Soupspoons- it was a good product, good concept. Did they expand too quickly? I used to take my kid to the one on Broadway and Heather. He loved the lemongrass chicken soup.

NO! not normal! Slimy is not normal either.

Very sad. I have brought my aunties from England there when they came out to visit.

Wilton has a stand up house shaped cake pan you could adapt [http://fantes.com/images/2545cake_pan_shapes.jpgclick Not sure if it would be big enough though.

This is probably getting off-topic, but such a ridiculous point needs to be addressed. Because it's shoddy, irresponsible journalism. Because she's not just commenting on her experience, but on the restaurant as a whole. Because what she writes has real-world implications. Need I continue? ← Exactly- because she styles herself as a food critic, because people make decisions based on her experience, because it is not professional, not living up to the reponsibilities of her craft. Moreover, Ms. Gill seems to get more pleasure out of her barbs then she does out of food. It makes one wonder if she is in the right profession.

Virginia, Do you sell to the laiety as well? I am sure there will be interest among the Joe Publics among us

I just fired off an email to the BC Chicken Marketing Board to do exactly that! Here is the URL for the contact page http://www.bcchicken.ca/contact?PHPSESSID=...f585a25bdd3272e

Well said Chef Jeff. I remember well that after the Great Chicken Massacre of a couple of years ago the AgroBorgs were calling for a ban on all organic chickens-yeah because factory farming does not spread disease- ethical farming does.

Lease signs in the window of Cotton Club. Also, Big Al banner gone from that catering place on second; anyone know if he is still there?

Yup, loved the mussels that I had; service was great- obviously a great deal of care has been lavished on every detail. I will have to go back and have a more relaxed meal- sadly I had child care issues and had to cut and run, but really like the room and look forward to coming back and sitting in the servery. Break a leg, Brian et al!

Sorry, meant the term, not the phenomena Ah, that would explain. I have never heard, used or experienced Global Television News