Amer Picon & Torani Amer

[FrogPrincesse]

Calisaya is on their list and I've never heard of it. If you go, remember that dell'Erborista is about 3-4x more expensive to buy than the others. Just sayin'.

 

I hear you.

 

Regarding Calisaya, see Amaro 104.

Edited October 9, 2014 by FrogPrincesse (log)

[FrogPrincesse]

Another nice one with Picon - End of Days by Matthew Schrage with Rittenhouse rye, Amer Picon (Picon bière), Abbott's bitters, Henri Bardouin pastis (St. George absinthe) float.

 

 

[tanstaafl2]

Another nice one with Picon - End of Days by Matthew Schrage with Rittenhouse rye, Amer Picon (Picon bière), Abbott's bitters, Henri Bardouin pastis (St. George absinthe) float.

 

 

[FrogPrincesse]

In your list I have only tried Ramazotti, but it's a different flavor profile, less orange-forward.

[Rafa]

The closest in flavor to the real Picon that I've tried is CioCiaro, but it's more complex and less caramelly than the real deal.

[tanstaafl2]

I have generally stuck to the CioCiaro/Everclear/Angostura orange formula the Professor suggested in this post for the most part, which of course uses Amaro CioCiaro, but never having had the original Amer Picon I am just relying on his personal experience with the real thing. The Boudreau recipe just seems like too much work.

 

If I get really lazy I make do with the CioCiaro and a dash or two of orange bitters! As it is finding Angostura orange bitters can sometimes be a challenge in its own right.

[KD1191]

Here's the tasting I just completed...for science. Still processing the results, and will post detail later. However, I will say that after I was done I went about trying to create a better stand-in for the real thing based on products I had around the house, and Lemon Hart 151 was involved.

 

The lineup, from right to left: 100/15/1 Mix (a la Wondrich), The Violet Hour's House Picon Mix, Picon Bière, the Original Amer.

 

[KD1191]

Here are my notes:

 

100/15/1 Wondrich Mix

 

Aroma: Heat, Ethanol, Cardamom (from the Angostura), Bitter Orange Peel

Flavor: Syrupy, burnt orange. Glycerin-like artificial smoothness at first, but finishes with a sharpness from the rectified spirit. The Angostura Orange flavors (which I most associate with subcontinental spices) dominate.

 

The Violet Hour Picon Mix

 

Aroma: Dried Seville orange, marmalade-like. Reminiscent of Amaro Nonino.

Flavor: Lighter. More subtly bitter, but mouth-coating and lingering, evokes Gran Classico. No burned/cooked/caramel flavors.

 

Picon Bière

 

Aroma: Suze...gentian, gentian, gentian, burnt orange. (Here, I stopped to wonder if Crêpe Suzette might have originally been made with Suze?)

Flavor: Gentian bitterness, orange sweetness. A smooth, caramelized finish. Pretty inoffensive, not particularly interesting.

 

 

Vintage Amer Picon

 

Aroma: Brandy-soaked fruitcake? A bit musty. Clearly higher proof than the last two.

Flavor: Clean/angular, burnt bitterness. Orange only appears in the aftertaste, but the finish is ridiculously long. The orange note is more Campari-like than any of the others. There's a sweetness to it, and some hogo or something very similar...reminds me of the lower-proof Inner Circle rums (blue/red dot), though this could just be the age of the bottle and/or whatever bleached the label showing through.

 

I'm left with the impression that the original started with fruit-based distillate, likely grape, not neutral spirit. In playing around with trying to recreate the flavor, I mixed up a blend of Amaro CioCiaro, Louis Royer Force 53, and Pierre Ferrand Dry Curaçao (2:1:1)...it wasn't all that close. Swapping the Force 53 for Lemon Hart 151 and adding a couple drops of Ango Orange felt like I was getting closer. That said, I'm not sold on the integrity of my original sample. I have another sealed bottle and will have to do a side-by-side once the first starts to get low.

[tanstaafl2]

Thanks for taking one for the team! I wonder if something like a high proof grappa (if such a thing exists) would give you the grape base you note over vodka or grain alcohol?

[KD1191]

Thanks for taking one for the team! I wonder if something like a high proof grappa (if such a thing exists) would give you the grape base you note over vodka or grain alcohol?

 

Yeah, that was my thought as well, but it's not something I'd keep around. Closest thing I have is a 76 proof German vineyard peach eau de vie.

[FrogPrincesse]

(from the Drinks! thread)

 

 

Joking aside, my manager recently came up with a very simple, yet complex, GPtastic drink to try and use up some Amer

 

40ml Martini Dry

20ml Amer Picon

10ml Cynar

Some Bitter Truth Grapefruit Bitters.

Stirred, Up

Probably had a lemon twist.

 

Banging.  Really impressive for something with next to no alcohol in it.

 

 

On behalf of every cocktail nerd in the US, fuck you. In the nicest possible way, of course.

 

 

What he said!

 

Would love to have "real" Amer Picon to "have to get rid of"! I have used several alternatives including Torani Amer and the formula offered by Splificator as a substitute. But never had the real thing.

 

Current Picon Club and Picon Biere don't really count for me (not that I wouldn't try them if I had them!) meaning at this point it would have to be about 50 years old to be as close as possible to the real thing before the proof got slashed down from the original 78 proof.

 

I wonder if the Amer Picon "Black" available at TWE at a slightly higher 42 proof is a similar formula and would be better than the current day Amer Picon at 36 proof.

 

Hey, don't put words in other people's mouths! All I have is Picon Biere, but I am in the US and will share if asked nicely.

 

Here it is with Dolin dry and BDW grapefruit bitters (and a grapefruit twist).

Does it have a name and who is the creator, so I can credit him?

 

 

 

[EvergreenDan]

Baller.

[ananth]

hello everyone,

in France, we can find lemon picon but the main version are the picon biere (generally used for beer) and picon club (generally used for cocktails).

Even though I am French (born there and live there), I am ashamed to tell you that I have never actually taste it except when I ordered a brooklyn or a creole in a bar.

Do you actually know the taste difference between the biere and the club version? Is it the beer version which is generally used in cocktail in the US? Is it due to the impossibility to get the club version?

[FrogPrincesse]

Until fairly recently, Picon Biere was by far the most common in France and it was quite hard tracking down the other versions. Now Picon Club and the fairly new (2012) Picon Citron also seem to be available in most supermarkets.

Edited July 31, 2015 by FrogPrincesse (log)

[J_Ozzy]

Anyone have any thoughts on how Bigallet China-China stacks up as a substitute for the original 78 proof formula? I've been seeing it used quite widely here in Montreal as the go-to.

[KD1191]

It's been awhile, but I recall the Bigallet being pretty spectacular. The proof and the orange notes were pretty much pitch perfect, but there was an undertone/background note that seemed to be missing vs. vintage Picon...perhaps the result of their starting with beet neutral spirit.

[FrogPrincesse]

Liberal cocktail (George J. Kappeler, 1895, via Martin's index) with Michter's straight rye whiskey, Picon, gomme syrup. This version of the Liberal comes sans sweet vermouth.

 

 

Edited February 21, 2016 by FrogPrincesse
Spelling (log)

[Czequershuus]

Has anyone tried Amer dit Picon from Golden Moon distillery yet? Curious if it works in classic cocktails calling for Amer Picon, or if the other subs work better.

[FrogPrincesse]

4 minutes ago, Czequershuus said:

Has anyone tried Amer dit Picon from Golden Moon distillery yet? Curious if it works in classic cocktails calling for Amer Picon, or if the other subs work better.

That looks intriguing, but $56 a bottle? Wow.

 

[Czequershuus]

12 minutes ago, FrogPrincesse said:

That looks intriguing, but $56 a bottle? Wow.

 

I know, way up there. I am asking for my personal bar but also because I am now an assistant manager of a liquor store, and I am considering bringing this in, but I would not at the price unless it is stellar. This site is honestly the best resource anywhere for unbiased opinions by palates I trust.

Edited February 21, 2016 by Czequershuus (log)

[Craig E]

33 minutes ago, FrogPrincesse said:

Liberal cocktail (George J. Kappeler, 1895, via Martin's index) with Mitcher's straight rye whiskey, Picon, gomme syrup. This version of the Liberal comes sans sweet vermouth.

 

 

Is that you, or your spell-checker, that keeps misspelling Michter's? 

(This is coming from someone who would have sworn it was "Señor Curacao of Curacao" before he was corrected.)

[FrogPrincesse]

3 minutes ago, Craig E said:

 

Is that you, or your spell-checker, that keeps misspelling Michter's? 

(This is coming from someone who would have sworn it was "Señor Curacao of Curacao" before he was corrected.)

Pretty sure that's me! Thanks for the catch.

[EvergreenDan]

On 2/21/2016 at 2:53 PM, FrogPrincesse said:

That looks intriguing, but $56 a bottle? Wow.

 

The moon is big. Takes a lot of leaf to gild it.

[Rafa]

Of the Picon-alikes on the US market, I think Bigallet is by far the best (and better than the real thing). That said, Golden Moon is decent. It's what we use at my bar and it gets the job done. 

[lesliec]

It appears Amer Picon has changed its label:

 

Left = old one; right = new, just purchased.

 

It's tempting to say it's a different product, but the new label has 'Amer Picon' in tiny letters.  There are differences, though:

• The new bottle is lower alcohol (18 vs. 21%)
• The old is lighter in colour.  The new one seems a distinctly darker brown
• I get orange and gentian in both, but I feel the new one is slightly less bitter.

Anybody know anything?