Visiting NYC from Philly

[davidbdesilva]

OK NYC egulleter's, I need your help again. You have helped me in the past and I am calling on your expertise once again. I will be driving up from Philly and taking my wife into your lovely city again next weekend (Saturday the 17th) for a Valentine's dinner and night out (we never do Valentine's Day proper for obvious reasons). We are serious food eaters but my wife also loves to dine at sleek, chic, sexy places that also have good food. I was going to try for Buddakan Philly or NYC but both are booked solid.

So, I made reservations at 4 different places and need your help deciding on which ONE to go to. You'll see by my choices I have decided on an Asian-themed dinner with decor as a significant factor, but still wanting good food. So with that in mind please give me your opinions on the following (feel free to rank them if you want to):

Buddha Bar

Kittichai

Asia de Cuba

Spice Market

I was also thinking about Megu but that looks a bit too pricey. Also, feel free to suggest any places for a lively night life/dancing afterwards. I was thinking of places like Cielo (not too "sceney" but have dancing?). Thank you for any and all help you can offer.

[Sneakeater]

IMO, at least as far as food is concerned, Kittichai is so much better than the others as to be almost incomparable.

(Great, sexy room, too.)

Edited February 10, 2007 by Sneakeater (log)

[Luckylies]

I actually liked Buddakan. For a big glitzy kinda place I found the food to be very well executed.

Maybe skip Asia de Cuba? I feel like it's lustre has worn off a bit over the years. Try Chinatown Brasserie, it's really good.

[Sneakeater]

Note that Buddakan's not on the list.

[Nathan]

Kittichai is parsecs above the others. Its the only one I would actually recommend going to.

Spice Market might be your second best bet...but it's very inconsistent...it's possible to have a good meal..but don't count on it.

Buddha Bar is ok....about the same level as Morimoto (discounting the omakase at Morimoto which I haven't tried).

Asia de Cuba's best days were long ago....

[chefsimon]

OK NYC egulleter's, I need your help again. You have helped me in the past and I am calling on your expertise once again. I will be driving up from Philly and taking my wife into your lovely city again next weekend (Saturday the 17th) for a Valentine's dinner and night out (we never do Valentine's Day proper for obvious reasons). We are serious food eaters but my wife also loves to dine at sleek, chic, sexy places that also have good food. I was going to try for Buddakan Philly or NYC but both are booked solid.

So, I made reservations at 4 different places and need your help deciding on which ONE to go to. You'll see by my choices I have decided on an Asian-themed dinner with decor as a significant factor, but still wanting good food. So with that in mind please give me your opinions on the following (feel free to rank them if you want to):

Buddha Bar

Kittichai

Asia de Cuba

Spice Market

I was also thinking about Megu but that looks a bit too pricey. Also, feel free to suggest any places for a lively night life/dancing afterwards. I was thinking of places like Cielo (not too "sceney" but have dancing?). Thank you for any and all help you can offer. 

←

Do you realise how restaurants may suffer when you cancel 3 of those dinners

An absolutly discusting thing to do in my opinion

Ok the larger restaurant may fill your cancellation no problem, but smaller independent ones may struggle

[Sneakeater]

Yeah, I didn't notice that. I wouldn't have replied if I did. I hope you cancel on adequate notice.

[Vadouvan]

Do you realise how restaurants may suffer when you cancel 3 of those dinners

An absolutly discusting thing to do in my opinion

Ok the larger restaurant may fill your cancellation no problem, but smaller independent ones may struggle

Bhudda Bar, Asia De Cuba and Spice Market are 200plus seat restaurants that specialise in 10 to 12 dollar plus cocktails. One person cancelling a reservation a day before isnt going to change anything.

Kittichai is subsidized by 60 thompson Hotel/Room Service/Thom Bar....shall I go on...?

As opposed to all these holier-than though-proseletyzing that goes on on e gullet, why dont people just answer the poster's query rather than educating them on reservation etiquette.

I personally know David DeSilva, he isnt some rube from out of town and is clearly aware of cancelling with good notice.

Hell..... new yorkers seem to tolerate the absurdity of Primetime tables.

To answer your question Dave....Kittichai.

The rest are garbage, trendy soulless meatpacking/dated asian fusion restaurants.

Ian Chalermkittichai's food rocks and is far and above beyond the rest of that crap.

[Sneakeater]

And some of us New Yorkers are pissed AS SHIT at Prime Time Tables. And the only justification of that enterprise that I've heard that carries any weight is that it is only rationalizing a situation created in large part by the widespread practice of making multiple reservations and either not canceling the unused ones or canceling them at the last minute.

I hate to sound "holier than thou", but the very existence of the odious Prime Time Tables -- which is another thing penalizing those of us who play fair, by the rules, and making it virtually impossible to get prime-time reservations when you want them -- shows that there's some kind of crisis going in the NYC reservations situation. So I think this shit should be strongly discouraged.

[tommy]

it goes on all of the time. "discouraging" it on one website is hardly going to matter.

and, more than a few days out, and for the restaurants listed (other than, perhaps, kittichai) it won't matter one bit. if you want to make a difference, work to change the system. you're addressing the symptom rather than the issue, and not really being very helpful, all at the same time.

if you think this doesn't happen every day, in every city, then you're probably kidding yourself. thankfully people cancel at the last minute so i can get those last minute reservations. cancel away!

edited to say that i've gotten no indication that the poster didn't plan on canceling as soon as he decided. no-shows are no-shows, regardless of if they happen in a multiple reservation situation, and i agree that they're not very nice.

Edited February 11, 2007 by tommy (log)

[Vadouvan]

I agree that people should not make reservations without cancelling them in a sensible time fashion but that is the name of the game in NY, reserve and make a choice.

Sure some jackasses dont bother to cancel in good time or at all but my only point is this tendency of preachy responses from people in other countries.

The poster is a personal friend and I know his intentions and his respect for restaurants.

One person making multiple reservations is democratic.

One entity making multiple reservations and selling them under assumed names when you show up at the restaurant is frankly BS and completely different.

Bakhoum's husbands analogy that he is doing it for any other reason but money is a collective insult to the intelligence of new yorkers.

[Mayur]

Darn' straight.

I fail to see how it's sharp practice to double-book and decide where you're going... on proper notice. It seems pretty obvious that the OP is planning to cancel his reservation with a day or two to spare; how is this a big deal? It seems rather logical that in NYC, if a restaurant actually has to turn down reservations because you've snagged a table, then they'll also have the cancellation pool to have someone who'll fill those seats if you cancel the reserv. Besides, there are always walk-ins, and I'm sure (especially given the economics of those places, as Vadouvan pointed out) that any of the above-listed restos gets plenty of those.

[EDIT, and FWIW, Kittichai all the way.]

Edited February 12, 2007 by Mayur (log)

[Sneakeater]

At least we all agree on the important thing here: Kittichai by a mile.

[Nathan]

OK NYC egulleter's, I need your help again. You have helped me in the past and I am calling on your expertise once again. I will be driving up from Philly and taking my wife into your lovely city again next weekend (Saturday the 17th) for a Valentine's dinner and night out (we never do Valentine's Day proper for obvious reasons). We are serious food eaters but my wife also loves to dine at sleek, chic, sexy places that also have good food. I was going to try for Buddakan Philly or NYC but both are booked solid.

So, I made reservations at 4 different places and need your help deciding on which ONE to go to. You'll see by my choices I have decided on an Asian-themed dinner with decor as a significant factor, but still wanting good food. So with that in mind please give me your opinions on the following (feel free to rank them if you want to):

Buddha Bar

Kittichai

Asia de Cuba

Spice Market

I was also thinking about Megu but that looks a bit too pricey. Also, feel free to suggest any places for a lively night life/dancing afterwards. I was thinking of places like Cielo (not too "sceney" but have dancing?). Thank you for any and all help you can offer. 

←

Do you realise how restaurants may suffer when you cancel 3 of those dinners

An absolutly discusting thing to do in my opinion

Ok the larger restaurant may fill your cancellation no problem, but smaller independent ones may struggle

←

Though I agree with this in principle...all of these restaurants do a massive amount of business and all of them have many walk-in customers hoping for a table.

But I agree with your general point.

[chefsimon]

I agree that people should not make reservations without cancelling them in a sensible time fashion but that is the name of the game in NY, reserve and make a choice.

Sure some jackasses dont bother to cancel in good time or at all but my only point is this tendency of preachy responses from people in other countries.

The poster is a personal friend and I know his intentions and his respect for restaurants.

One person making multiple reservations is democratic.

One entity making multiple reservations and selling them under assumed names when you show up at the restaurant is frankly BS and completely different.

Bakhoum's husbands analogy that he is doing it for any other reason but money is a collective insult to the intelligence of new yorkers.

←

It was nothing personal to your mate!and it happens in every country, just because i live in another country doesnt mean i cant have a point of view and i visit your country on many occasions during the year

Obviously a cancellation to these kinds of restaurants is not going to effect them, but if your friend does it to these whos to say its not his common practice on smaller independent restaurants also, independent restaurants can be very difficult to book a table at to at prime times

I ve experienced it before as a chef/restauranteur and its not nice especially when you have turned down a table who would really like the experience you as a chef/restauranteur has to offer!

So its definatly not a good practice and if someone cant decide where to go and only book one place they got issues, maybe do there reserch a bit earlier

Simon

[johnder]

Ok, I think it is safe to agree that making multiple reservations and canceling them at the last possible minute is bad, and is frowned upon by everyone -- but hopes are that David is making his decision on which place he is going (Kittichai) and canceling the others ASAP.

That said, let's try to get this back on track.

[davidbdesilva]

Oh boy, look what I started! Actually, as I sent my posting the other day I thought that somebody would probably get pissed off by what I did. First off, thank you Vandouvan for sticking up for me and vouching for my character while many others attacked me, I greatly appreciate it! Here's the deal: didn't think I was going to be able to swing a V-Day dinner at all but as it turns out I can, so I tried to get into Buddakan Philly last minute and it was completely booked, as is Buddakan NYC. Realizing that time was wasting and knowing that I wanted to go Asian with beautiful decor I quickly narrowed it down to the 4 aforementioned restaurants and called them, getting reservations for 6:30 at 3 of them, 6:00 at Asia de Cuba (the reservations nobody else wants).

My intention is, now that I realize that Kittichai is the clear choice (thank you), to call tomorrow (Wednesday) and cancel the other three. Where is the harm in that? They will be taken by others that day or the next I am sure. Remember too, I am an out of towner, I would NEVER do this in Philly where I am familiar with where I want to go and I frequent small BYOB's. So, thank you again for all your help. Kittichai it will be.

If I may dare ask yet one more question: my wife loves to dance but all the dance clubs I've looked at online (e.g. Cielo, Element, Deep, Pacha, Crobar, etc.) seem to be full of half naked 20-somethings. We are in our mid-40's but are not stuffy by any means and will be dressed nicely for the evening. Any bars/clubs you would recommend or even a place to dance that isn't a meat market? Aubar? LQ? Thank You!

[Nathan]

Thanks to the cabaret laws combined with the general NY aversion to the slightest risk of looking foolish, there's not much of a dance scene here I'm afraid. And what there is is primarily populated by 20-somethings (and younger) from the surrounding region. Especially on the weekend....and even more especially on Saturday.

Cielo is probably your best pick. It's also going to be very difficult to get into as it is a very small venue.

More on the general club scene here can be found here:

http://nymag.com/news/features/27845/

[Daniel]

OK NYC egulleter's, I need your help again. You have helped me in the past and I am calling on your expertise once again. I will be driving up from Philly and taking my wife into your lovely city again next weekend (Saturday the 17th) for a Valentine's dinner and night out (we never do Valentine's Day proper for obvious reasons). We are serious food eaters but my wife also loves to dine at sleek, chic, sexy places that also have good food. I was going to try for Buddakan Philly or NYC but both are booked solid.

So, I made reservations at 4 different places and need your help deciding on which ONE to go to. You'll see by my choices I have decided on an Asian-themed dinner with decor as a significant factor, but still wanting good food. So with that in mind please give me your opinions on the following (feel free to rank them if you want to):

Buddha Bar

Kittichai

Asia de Cuba

Spice Market

I was also thinking about Megu but that looks a bit too pricey. Also, feel free to suggest any places for a lively night life/dancing afterwards. I was thinking of places like Cielo (not too "sceney" but have dancing?). Thank you for any and all help you can offer. 

←

If you care anything about food, I would tell you to stay away from Spice Market.. The place is certainly gorgeous before its filled with people..

You want decor and Asian, I would tell you to go to Sakagura.. Its in this underground Japanese Tea Garden type setting.. The food is really good.. Its hip with out being pretentious.. But it might be a little tame for what I feel your looking for..

I have yet to go but, I have seen photos of the inside of La Atilier de Robuchon... The food is certainly going to be good and the room looks really pretty..One would guess its going to be expensive..

Asia De Cuba I went to years ago so I can't really tell you too much about it..

But along those lines maybe try Japonaise.. Its a Chicago transplant, two level place with a clubby feel.. I went there the first night they opened and had a fun time.. Sitting in the lounge ordering different tastes of things..

Edited February 13, 2007 by Daniel (log)

[LPShanet]

OK NYC egulleter's, I need your help again. You have helped me in the past and I am calling on your expertise once again. I will be driving up from Philly and taking my wife into your lovely city again next weekend (Saturday the 17th) for a Valentine's dinner and night out (we never do Valentine's Day proper for obvious reasons). We are serious food eaters but my wife also loves to dine at sleek, chic, sexy places that also have good food. I was going to try for Buddakan Philly or NYC but both are booked solid.

So, I made reservations at 4 different places and need your help deciding on which ONE to go to. You'll see by my choices I have decided on an Asian-themed dinner with decor as a significant factor, but still wanting good food. So with that in mind please give me your opinions on the following (feel free to rank them if you want to):

Buddha Bar

Kittichai

Asia de Cuba

Spice Market

I was also thinking about Megu but that looks a bit too pricey. Also, feel free to suggest any places for a lively night life/dancing afterwards. I was thinking of places like Cielo (not too "sceney" but have dancing?). Thank you for any and all help you can offer. 

←

If you care anything about food, I would tell you to stay away from Spice Market.. The place is certainly gorgeous before its filled with people..

You want decor and Asian, I would tell you to go to Sakagura.. Its in this underground Japanese Tea Garden type setting.. The food is really good.. Its hip with out being pretentious.. But it might be a little tame for what I feel your looking for..

I have yet to go but, I have seen photos of the inside of La Atilier de Robuchon... The food is certainly going to be good and the room looks really pretty..One would guess its going to be expensive..

Asia De Cuba I went to years ago so I can't really tell you too much about it..

But along those lines maybe try Japonaise.. Its a Chicago transplant, two level place with a clubby feel.. I went there the first night they opened and had a fun time.. Sitting in the lounge ordering different tastes of things..

←

If you're willing to include straight up Japanese in your search for an "Asian" place, two others with really nice decor and good food are Megu (downtown) and En Japanese Brasserie. Even though it's apples to oranges, both have better food than any on the list. Of your list, I'll echo that Kittichai is the strongest, although it seems that further endorsement isn't necessary.

[davidbdesilva]

Thank you very much, all of you, for your help. I have decided on Kittichai and canceled my other reservations. Very interesting, I also posted on the "other" board to see what they'd say and they were almost unanimous in recommending Asia de Cuba. I trust this board implicitly and therefore went with your recommendations. I did look at Megu and it looks wonderful, but seems a little bit beyond what I can spend (this time). I've decided to eat at Kittichai, stop at the Kimono Lounge at Megu for drinks (it looks gorgeous) and then stop at Circa Tabac later on so I can have a cigar (which is now also extremely hard to do in Philly since our ban just took place). I was also eyeing a place called Lava Gina because we are into world music and they seem to spin some good music there (but it looks like a meat market as well). Thanks again, lets hope todays snow is all cleared by Saturday!