About Time!!

[ngatti]

Here's the link to John Foy's review of 'The Restaurant'

The Restaurant

This is all I ask. A focused and staight forward critique of a New Jersey restaurant. No showing off, no pedantry. Impressions of the food, service and wine. Nice Going! Could we have something similar every week?

Quibbles? Again, with all the references to the chef (the Chef this..and the Chef that...), perhaps a name?

Thanks John. Thanks Pat.

Nick

[rozrapp]

ngatti posted on Jul 31 2002, 12:45 AM

This is all I ask. A focused and staight forward critique of a New Jersey restaurant.  No showing off, no pedantry. Impressions of the food, service and wine....  Quibbles?

I'm darned if I understand how Foy can give this restaurant 3 stars (Excellent) considering his negative remarks as follows:

1. "...the wine list fails to give vintages...."

2. "As enjoyable as the shrimp were, the chef should know there is a reason the Japanese do not serve seaweed salad topped with cocktail sauce, and ditto for mango salsa. It's an idea run amok."

3. "Beef carpaccio was straightforward but boring...."

4. "The sweetish shallot sauce [accompanying the Chilean sea bass] wasn't to our liking...."

5. With the rack of lamb: "Had I known the perfumed, mint syrup was going to coat the lamb I would have requested it on the side, since I found it too sweet. " And "the chef overpowered the dish with an overly sweet onion chutney, which resembled an onion confiture without the latter's balancing vinegar."

6. Desserts (all $8) were anticlimactic. My companion, whom I refer to as the "dessert queen" (she would prefer to start and end her meal with the dessert menu) was disappointed, as was I, with a misconceived and poorly executed variety of crème brulées; a cylindrical, too-dense tower of milk and dark chocolate; a tough lemon cake, and a berry-misu that merely mocked tiramisù." Not even one recommended dessert!

Foy calls the food "on balance...exceptional." True, the ambiance and service were very fine, and there were some very well-prepared dishes, but overall, this sounds more like a 2-star restaurant to me.

BTW, is this John Foy the chef/restaurateur and brother of Dennis or a different John Foy?

[Fat Guy]

I thought the writing was quite poor; barely readable. And I got the feeling the writer is an inexperienced diner. Am I alone on this one? Nick, are you really holding this out as an example of a good restaurant review, or is your point mainly that you're relieved to see a review that appears to be relatively agenda-free?

[Nockerl]

BTW, is this John Foy the chef/restaurateur and brother of Dennis or a different John Foy?

Yes

(oops)

[Fat Guy]

Yes the brother or yes different?

And don't say "yes."

[Nockerl]

Yes the brother, chef etc.

[rozrapp]

Fat Guy posted on Jul 31 2002, 03:27 PM

And I got the feeling the writer is an inexperienced diner.

So John Foy the chef (brother, etc.) cooked but rarely dined??

[Rosie]

His expertise is wine.

[Fat Guy]

Rosie, what's the deal with the reviews in this paper? They seem to be written by 100 different reviewers.

[tommy]

c'mon nick! didn't the font rub you the wrong way or something?

[ngatti]

Fat-Guy,

A resounding yes on the second point (agenda free). Some of these guys can be downright mean and nasty. You sometimes wonder whether thay want to jump up from the table and go back and show the chef how it should be done! You want to see poorly written? Travel back through the various reviews.

Perhaps poorly written, but it was focused. I'm happy for that. Maybe making the point about chefs as critics

Foy may have much wine expertise, but he was the Chef at 'Tarragon Tree' and the original incarnation of 'Sonoma Grill'. He's pretty well known locally. That being the case perhaps writing under a nome de plume would be in order. Especially since I hear he's still doing local restaurant consulting work on the side.

.

Rosie, what's the deal with the reviews in this paper? They seem to be written by 100 different reviewers.

FINALLY!!, SOMEONE HEARS ME . Seriously it comes through on the review pages that some people doing the writing are there for the expense account meal and wouldn't know Beluga from Bordelaise if it rose up and bit 'em on the arse.

May be two or three, but 10/11?? I don't think it helps the sections credibility.

Thanx for your respnse FG and others

Nick

[tommy]

you're a nasty, bitter, chef.

[ngatti]

you're a nasty, bitter, chef.  

THE HEART

by Stephen Crane

In the desert

I saw a creature, naked, bestial

Who, squatting upon the ground,

Held his heart in his hands,

And ate of it.

I said, "Is it good, friend?"

"It is bitter---bitter," he answered;

"But I like it

Because it is bitter,

And because it is my heart."

Nick

[tommy]

to put it in kenu reaves' words (sp?), "whoa".

[Steve Klc]

OK--I can't let this pass without fishing for a few comments from others--this guy was a chef, no longer attached to a property, but working as a restaurant consultant in the area AND he's reviewing restaurants? Shaw--I know you're big on anarchy and re-evaluating conflict of interest and anonymity of restaurant critics--but this is a first. Where do you stand on this, if it were indeed true?

Nick--would you prefer to be reviewed by a chef who has a vested financial interest in your competition? Would you take it any better if the identity of said reviewer were shielded?

[Fat Guy]

OK--I can't let this pass without fishing for a few comments from others--this guy was a chef, no longer attached to a property, but working as a restaurant consultant in the area AND he's reviewing restaurants?  Shaw--I know you're big on anarchy and re-evaluating conflict of interest and anonymity of restaurant critics--but this is a first.  Where do you stand on this, if it were indeed true?

I'll use the legal term "presumption" to describe how I'd feel about that, were it indeed true. That is to say, those kinds of potential conflicts raise, in my mind, a strong presumption of nuttiness and bad judgment on the parts of the editors and writer involved. But it is a "rebuttable presumption" in that it can for me be turned around through consistently strong writing and unassailable analysis. In other words, if this guy proved through his writing that he was the best guy for the job and was able to use all his tools and training and professionally honed critical faculties to bring his audience awesome restaurant reviews -- and he simultaneously conducted himself in such a manner as to show no preferential treatment to clients, acquaintances, whatever -- I'd cut him some slack. Now of course if you read the review in question you know you're not dealing with somebody who will ever rise to that level, so here I'd say it was just a dumb move.

[ngatti]

SK said:

Nick--would you prefer to be reviewed by a chef who has a vested financial interest in your competition? Would you take it any better if the identity of said reviewer were shielded?

I used to think that as long as a reviewer wasn't using their position to gain advantage for their interests it would be okay (say not writing a review for a restaurant you were working for). But as I read this it's obvious that conflicts of interest can be turned to advantage in many other ways.

With your example I agree that the reviewer should recuse himself from writing restaurant criticism.

Nick

[Rail Paul]

SK said:

Nick--would you prefer to be reviewed by a chef who has a vested financial interest in your competition? Would you take it any better if the identity of said reviewer were shielded?

I used to think that as long as a reviewer wasn't using their position to gain advantage for their interests it would be okay (say not writing a review for a restaurant you were working for). But as I read this it's obvious that conflicts of interest can be turned to advantage in many other ways.

With your example I agree that the reviewer should recuse himself from writing restaurant criticism.

Nick

There are two parallel discussions over on food media which touch on these issues.

One covers the qualities in a perfect reviewer, the other looks at the weaknesses of the Hackensack Record's use of a dozen reviewers (no consistency, agendas, etc)

Tarragon Tree - a jewel in the wilderness, a green shoot among the thistles, when the skins covered inhabitants of Chatham lived in caves eating boiled dog and squirrel. We were all so young then.

[Rosie]

Rosie, what's the deal with the reviews in this paper? They seem to be written by 100 different reviewers.

Actually, it is less than 100! I guess by using alot of people everyone gets a chance!

Foy may have much wine expertise, but he was the Chef at 'Tarragon Tree' and the original incarnation of 'Sonoma Grill'.

Dennis and John Foy were at Tarragon Tree and I believe that Dennis, a brillant chef, did the cooking.

[rozrapp]

I recall that many years ago, we had dinner at a restaurant where John Foy was chef/owner and Dennis was not involved. The name totally escapes me, but I remember it as being quite fancy. When Foy left, a woman took over as chef. Anyone know the name?

[Lady S]

John Foy used to own Le Delice in Whippany. It was very well rated and attended. Food ranged from excellent to mediocre and so did the service. But it was very, very popular none the less. It was in a bright pink building the color of Pepto Bismal, and there were always beautiful flowers inside.

[Helena Robinson]

The property in Whippany that was once home to Le Delice is now Cinque Figlie, formerly of Morristown.

[rozrapp]

John Foy used to own Le Delice in Whippany. It was very well rated and attended. Food ranged from excellent to mediocre and so did the service. But it was very, very popular none the less. It was in a bright pink building the color of Pepto Bismal, and there were always beautiful flowers inside.

Yes, of course -- Le Delice. Thanks, Lady S. I knew I could count on an e-Gulleteer to come through with the name. When we went there the one time many years ago, it would have been a special occasion place for us. So I'm pretty sure we were celebrating an anniversary. As I recall, I thought the service rather snooty, and the food didn't meet my expectations which were quite high because of the restaurants fine ratings and popularity.