Foie gras bill introduced in Philly

[glepore]

Wouldn't it be ironic if they can't pass a smoking ban but protect the ducks?

The folks that sponsor these bills should go down to Delmarva to a factory farm for chickens or to NC to a pork farm-that'd open their eyes.

[Vadouvan]

Please tell me this isnt true ?

[jdanton]

Link from the paper...

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/lo...ia/14595786.htm

[Vadouvan]

Kelly takes a more hands-off stance on the other big public-health issue involving legislation and restaurants: an effort to ban bar and restaurant cigarette smoking. An opponent of smoking bans, Kelly says there is no contradiction.

"As far as I know, the cigarette industry doesn't torture anybody," he said.

Hilarious, I love the logic at city hall....

Edited May 17, 2006 by Vadouvan (log)

[wkl]

second hand smoke is like torture in my book.

what an idiot.........

[MarketStEl]

Link from the paper...

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/lo...ia/14595786.htm

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Oh, Lordy, Lordy...

Bad ideas have a way of spreading, don't they?

Joel Assouline, quoted in the story, is right, but that won't make a dime's worth of difference if this gets into too many folks' heads.

As for the "foie gras is a heart attack on a plate" argument: So is a Quarter Pounder with Cheese and a side of fries. Gonna ban those too, Councilman Kelly?

As for secondhand smoke: It may not be "torture," but unlike foie, those of us who don't like it don't have the option of simply choosing not to consume it if we go into places where smoking is permitted.

[Rich Pawlak]

Philly is SUCH a progressive city, aint it? Jeebus.

[StevenC]

Let's face it, pretty soon we'll be able to eat foie gras only in France and Hungary, maybe Italy.

I just wish that the legislators who have worked themselves into such a fit over the force-feeding of geese would focus part of their rage at the horrific treatment of livestock in factory farms across the United States. But then again, small foie-gras farmers don't have the same lobbying budgets as the agribusiness leviathans and the fast-food industry, I suppose...

[JohnL]

Wouldn't it be ironic if they can't pass a smoking ban but protect the ducks?

The folks that sponsor these bills should go down to Delmarva to a factory farm for chickens or to NC to a pork farm-that'd open their eyes.

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Believe me--it won't be long!

This is precisely the wrong reply to what the animal rights people are inflicting on our society.

If one reads the responses to this legislative proposal in the Inquirer article one will see a terrific argument in support of the ban not against it.

From the chef Mr Lee "people... should be able to get what they want."

to the producer of fois gras Mr Assouline (I won't go for the cheap name related joke) who notes that "farming animals isn't pretty."

With responses like these--who wouldn't support the ban!?

Those who say the ban supporters should "look" at other areas of production--factory produced chickens and port etc will one day have their wish granted --not only will fois gras be banned but all meat and animal related products. --extreme?

Well that is the goal of the animal rights folks. This is a war and the first few battles have been decided in their favor.

This is about one key issue--animal rights.

Animals have no rights!

People have rights.

Granting specific rights almost always involves taking away or restricting other rights.

There is a price.

The only effective response to these bans is to present a sound rational scientifically based argument that Ducks and Geese do not suffer needlessly in the production of fois gras. That they are not "tortured."

The other side is presenting a purely emotion based argument.

Emotion will win out unless countered with reason.

[wkl]

chicken won't be banned.

the necessary reforms to make poultry factories more "friendly" for the bird will likely raise the cost of chicken, thereby really pissing off some politician's voting base.

it's so much easier to support banning fg because it really only effects a small population of the voting public.

[dan.]

Drop him a line!

[StevenC]

The only effective response to these bans is to present a sound rational scientifically based argument that Ducks and Geese do not suffer needlessly in the production of fois gras. That they are not "tortured."

The other side is presenting a purely emotion based argument.

Emotion will win out unless countered with reason.

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I totally agree. Meat consumption is not going to disappear in the United States. Foie gras is singled out because it's vulnerable--consumption of foie gras is seen as elitist in America, and hey, don't think its French name has nothing to do with the prejudice against it.

Part of a reasoned response, however, is to point out the public blind spot about industrial agriculture, because such a response illustrates, as you note, the purely emotional basis of the counterargument. Compared with steeres being skinned alive in slaughterhouses and assembly-line chickens stewing in their own filth, the image of a farmer placing a funnel into the calcified throat of a free-range goose may not seem so horrific.

[Megan Blocker]

Besides, he said, foie gras, with 70 grams of fat per 3.5 ounces, was "a heart attack on a plate."

SERIOUSLY?

OK, then I want to see all food with a certain fat content banned.

Don't throw that reason in there, Mr. Kelly. It's not helping your case - if anything, it hurts you, because it opens up even more issues. If the true concern is that foie gras is fattening, then why are you targeting something that such a small percentage of the population eats? How about soda? Or beef? Or bacon?

I understand people who think foie gras is cruel (though I disagree with them and think it's hilarious that they're going after foie and not, say, veal or factory chicken). But by bringing this point in, he has totally undermined his argument.

Edited May 17, 2006 by Megan Blocker (log)

[Holly Moore]

Besides, he said, foie gras, with 70 grams of fat per 3.5 ounces, was "a heart attack on a plate."

SERIOUSLY?

OK, then I want to see all food with a certain fat content banned.

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Perhaps the good councilman should propose a ban on cheesesteaks if he is concerned with fat content.

I can see us returning to the days of prohibition. Gaggles of geese raised in basements. Bath tub foie gras - so named because that is where the geese are slaughtered. Then the mob will get involved - pigeons will be substituted for geese. Pigeon foie gras will not be quite the same, but these will be hard times, and there will never be a shortage of pigeons in Philadelphia...

[Vadouvan]

From the chef Mr Lee "people... should be able to get what they want."

to the producer of fois gras Mr Assouline (I won't go for the cheap name related joke) who notes that "farming animals isn't pretty."

1. CONSTITUTIONALITY

Yes in fact Christopher Lee is correct because at the end of the day, this will eventually end up as a constitutional issue in front of the supreme court. NOT about foie gras per se but about the general right to consume food that isnt produced illegally and meets all the stringent requirements of the US Agriculture department......despite the fact that a few radical crackpots disagree.

It will be sublimated to the same basic arguments indicative of all polarizing social issues in America such as abortion et..al.

At the end of the day, this is AMERICA, fairly simple concept, live and let live, do what you want without harming others. You want the govenrment to tell you what to eat ?

Great...dont bitch about it in America, just move to China or Cuba and live happilly ever after.

2.HYPOCRISY

In a city hailed uniformly as the fattest city in America where people are gorging thier arteries with cheesesteaks and roast pork sandwiches (which I personally eat constantly)....thanks to Holly Moore...... and the high school kids are slowly dying because they are practically injecting themselves hypodermically with high fructose corn syrup......

*ANY* arguments about the health effects of Foie are absurd.

Forget about the meat and oil in a steak sandwich, just the 4 oz of cheeze whiz is far worse than 4 oz of foie gras.

3. PRIORITIES of Philadelphia government ....(In order of importance....emphasised redundancy)

Duck Liver Consumption

High Scool reform

Cop Killers/Murder Rate

Second Hand Smoke

Homelessness

Prison Overcrowding

Crumbling city road infrastructure.

Alleged municipal corruption....

Corporate flight out of the city...

More to come.....

[mrbigjas]

I can see us returning to the days of prohibition.  Gaggles of geese raised in basements.  Bath tub foie gras - so named because that is where the geese are slaughtered.  Then the mob will get involved - pigeons will be substituted for geese.  Pigeon foie gras will not be quite the same, but these will be hard times, and there will never be a shortage of pigeons in Philadelphia...

i had a roast pigeon this past weekend where they kept the liver in with the bird, and i can honestly say that if the liver had been more gras-er i would have enjoyed it more than i did. it was a little pasty.

[Rebecca263]

The real question is why is this Kelly man focussing his campaign on inane subjects like foie gras when there are so many actually important subjects to discuss?

What's he trying to avoid discussing?

Vadouvan listed some important subjects in his post, all of which trump this silly issue of foie gras.

Edited May 17, 2006 by Rebecca263 (log)

[StevenC]

i had a roast pigeon this past weekend where they kept the liver in with the bird, and i can honestly say that if the liver had been more gras-er i would have enjoyed it more than i did.  it was a little pasty.

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You know, if foie gras hamburgers could work, what about stuffing some into a cheesesteak? It could become a new Philadelphia icon. (Having been born there, I say it with love)

[Daniel]

3. PRIORITIES of Philadelphia government ....(In order of importance....emphasised redundancy)

Duck Liver Consumption

High Scool reform

Cop Killers/Murder Rate

Second Hand Smoke

Homelessness

Prison Overcrowding

Crumbling city road infrastructure.

Alleged municipal corruption....

Corporate flight out of the city...

More to come.....

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Thats what is really absurd.. If it is passed lets hope Philly can do a better job with Foie Gras then they do with drugs..

Edited May 17, 2006 by Daniel (log)

[Vadouvan]

You know, if foie gras hamburgers could work, what about stuffing some into a cheesesteak? It could become a new Philadelphia icon. (Having been born there, I say it with love)

They tried that at Barclay Prime, it ended up being an "emperors new clothes disaster of Foie gras, tallegio cheese, "KOBE" which was actually Wagyu beef and a silly tiny bottle of "Champagne" that wasnt from Epernay......ha ha.

all for $100.

Edited to add ..canned truffles

Edited May 17, 2006 by Vadouvan (log)

[MarketStEl]

3. PRIORITIES of Philadelphia government ....(In order of importance....emphasised redundancy)

Duck Liver Consumption

High Scool reform

Cop Killers/Murder Rate

Second Hand Smoke

Homelessness

Prison Overcrowding

Crumbling city road infrastructure.

Alleged municipal corruption....

Corporate flight out of the city...

More to come.....

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Look at the bright side...

Unlike the roads and school reform, we're not likely to have Harrisburg step in to handle the matter.

[Sneakeater]

If laws like that are found to be unconstitutional, I'll eat my hat. There is no more of a protected "right" to eat foie gras than there is to smoke marijuana. Not every stupid or even offensive law is unconstitutional. Not even every very stupid or even offensive law.

[mrbigjas]

If laws like that are found to be unconstitutional, I'll eat my hat.

not if there's a law against it you won't!

[Sneakeater]

If the foie gras law is found unconstitutional, then I'd feel pretty safe violating the hat law as a test case.

[FoodMan]

Kelly's comments strike me as pretty ignorant and half-baked. I love the "Let them grow corn or SOMETHING" comment. He's obviously thought this through.