Muddling, Muddlers, and Muddled Drinks

[Gabriel Lewis]

I understand the idea behind using crushed/bruised ingredients like fruits and herbs etc. I just don't see the point of a seperate tool. I'm guessing you don't work the ingredients too vigorously if they are being crushed in a glass.

What I'm asking is: why the seperate tool. Wouldn't it be easier to just bruise the ingredients in a mortar and pestle? You could do large quantities for multiple drinks and you wouldn't have to worry about breaking the glass. It might be little harder to clean or avoid cross contamination though. It is just a case of seperate evolution for the bar?

I don't really know anything about bartending, so maybe I'm just missing something.

[Chris Amirault]

Same concept as a mortar and pestle, but with greater retention of the ingredients you want. For example, a tool with good surface area that can squeeze citrus rinds will release far more oils into the mixture than a hard shake, but those oils would stick to whatever surface on which they were released. With a muddler, that's the inside of your shaker.

[lancastermike]

In addition to overpaying for "fetish bar equipment" (gotta at that one), remember that a pro bartender might be muddling a hundred mojitos or dirty martinis on a Saturday night.  The larger surface area will definitely be more efficient in those circumstances and the expensive bar toy will make up for itself in his tips for not keeping customers waiting too long for their drinks.

You wouldn't use a tack hammer to take down drywall, would you?  NO!  The biggest baddest sledgehammer you can swing is best.  This is a similar situation.

Mike, for your home use purposes I'm sure the $6 one works fine.

They really are pretty great.  Expensive.  But awesome.  Like a sledgehammer for cocktails.

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Point taken. I must add that I believe it is the skill and use of the tool by the operator that leads to the highest level of satisfaction not the size of the tool. I'm sure the same applies to muddling as well.

[slkinsey]

What are the specific reasons for, or advantages of, bruising/crushing ingredients in the serving vessel?

What I'm asking is: why the seperate tool. Wouldn't it be easier to just bruise the ingredients in a mortar and pestle?

These are variations of the same question. The reason to have a separate tool from what would normally be used in a bar is that there really isn't another bar tool that is good at this function. For muddling herbs, as I said before, you can get by with a bar spoon that has a flat disk on the opposite end. But this won't help you if you want to muddle something like citrus. Try it some time: If you have 4 lime quarters (actually 8ths -- a quarter being a halved lime cut into quarters) in the bottom of a mixing glass, it takes a considerable amount of pressure to squeeze out all the lime juice.

The advantages of muddling the herbs or citrus in the mixing vessel are several: First, as others have pointed out, none of the oils that are extracted through the muddling process are lost, because they're stuck to the inside of the mixing glass. Since a muddled drink is often shaken together with the muddled ingredients and then (sometimes) strained, all of the expressed oils are washed off the side of the mixing glass into the drink. If the muddled items were muddled in a separate container, it would have to be rinsed with the liquor used in the drink in order to capture all the oils. This would be a big pain in the butt. Second, sometimes the muddled items are muddled together with simple syrup, granulated sugar or some of the liquor, which aids in the extraction of oils. Third, for some drinks (the Caipirinha comes to mind) the fruit and/or herbs are muddled directly in the glass in which the drink will be served. Glass mixing glasses are plenty strong enough to handle vigorous muddling without breaking, but if this is a concern, one can always muddle in the metal part of a Boston shaker. I use all metal, so it's not an issue either way.

Muddling definitely makes a big difference. Try making a Daiquiri three ways: First, the standard way, with 2 oz of Cuban-style white rum, 1/2 ounce of fresh lime juice and 1/2 teaspoon of superfine sugar, shaken hard with ice and double strained. Second, squeeze the lime as usual, but throw the squeezed-out lime shell into the shaker and shake it together with the ice, rum, lime juice and sugar. Third, cut lime quarters and muddle half a lime in the bottom of the mixing tin together with the sugar, measure the expressed juice to make sure you have 1/2 an ounce and make adjustments as necessary, then add the rum and ice, and shake as usual. You'll find, I think, that the three drinks are distinctly different due to the amount of lime oil incorporated by the three different techniques. For herbs in shaken drinks, I think muddling makes less sense since the herbs will end up sufficiently bruised by the ice during the shaking process (so much so that double straining is usually necessary). But muddling makes plenty of sense for non-shaken drinks like Swizzles, Juleps, etc.

[Chris Amirault]

Got the absurdly overpriced, evidence-of-my-dementia PUG! today, and it's a wonderful thing. There's something to be said for a handmade beauty like this.

My stomach's still rocky from a bout with a virus, but I'm eager to give it a go soon. Report to follow.

[johnder]

Congrats! Welcome to the club. Make sure you give it a nice mineral oil rubdown every now and then to keep the wood in good shape.

John

[KatieLoeb]

Point taken. I must add that I believe it is the skill and use of the tool by the operator that leads to the highest level of satisfaction not the size of the tool.  I'm sure the same applies to muddling as well.

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Touché! And your point is taken as well.

[Chris Amirault]

As I've been tinkering with the French Pearl (click, s'il vous plait), I've noticed the benefits of muddling the mint in a solution of the liquids, instead of in a dry shaker; the flavor of the mint seems rounder, richer. My rudimentary explanation is that more flavor is extracted from the mint if it has more time for contact with the variety of liquids, each of which can act as a different sort of solvent. It also seems to me that muddling first at room-temperature then shaking with with ice gives two different temperatures at which that flavor extraction can occur.

To be clear: I'm not talking about a Seattle muddle with ice here (which doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me, I'll add). It's more an intermediate step, muddling with just the liquids, not the ice. I can't find any reference to -- or, more to the point, explanation of or justification for -- this sort of technique in Regan's Joy, Wondrich's Esquire Drinks, or DeGroff's Craft. Am I missing something? Sam, do you have a better explanation -- or am I just off my nut?

[KatieLoeb]

...I've noticed the benefits of muddling the mint in a solution of the liquids, instead of in a dry shaker; the flavor of the mint seems rounder, richer. My rudimentary explanation is that more flavor is extracted from the mint if it has more time for contact with the variety of liquids, each of which can act as a different sort of solvent. It also seems to me that muddling first at room-temperature then shaking with with ice gives two different temperatures at which that flavor extraction can occur....

In the Mint Julep seminar I attended at Tales of the Cocktail, Chris McMillian of the Library Lounge at the Ritz-Carlton New Orleans explained that the simple syrup is used as an "adhesive" of sorts, to get the leaves to stick to the sides of the glass, flattened out if possible, and then a gentle bruise can occur. We did an experiment where we took a mint leaf between our thumb and forefinger in each hand. We gently rubbed one, and mangled the other one hard. The gently bruised one smelled sweet and fragrant, the destroyed one was bittered. I'll never over muddle again after that little demo. Makes perfect sense.

The other fascinating part of the Julep demo was the lovely prose Chris recited as he so carefully constructed his julep. It's an ode to the julep written by Judge Joshua Soule Smith circa 1890. It's about halfway down the page HERE. Nearly brought tears to my eyes. I shall never again construct a julep without showing it the appropriate respect.

[slkinsey]

I suppose it depends on what you are muddling and what effect you are going for.

Most everyone muddles herbs together with a small amount of liquid. Usually this is a liquid ingredient that is present in only small amounts (1/2 to 1 ounce) in the recipe, such as simple syrup or citrus juice. This is for several reasons: First, it is messy and difficult to muddle herbs in several ounces of liquid. Second, if you screw something up, you can always dump the drink and start over without having to waste a few ounces of expensive liquor. Third, it is useful when muddling herbs to have something to muddle the flavor into, otherwise you're mostly just bruising the herbs.

Lime quarters and lemon quarters make their own liquid when they are muddled, so there would seem to be little advantage in adding liquid during the muddling process.

Sometimes it's nice to muddle a lemon peel together with a bitters-soaked sugar cube to "abrade" the surface of the peel and extract extra oils. This is a trick I picked up from Gary, I think. Needless to say, liquid isn't necessarily useful in this scenario.

I'm not so sure I think there is any advantage to be gained from muddling tender herbs like mint when the drink will be shaken with ice and strained. I suppose this depends on the ice you're using, but when I shake mint with ice in the shaker, I use big pieces of ice and I shake hard. The mint is pulverised into such tiny little bits that I have to double-strain into the glass. I'm not sure how much more muddled the mint could possibly be, or whether that would possibly be a good thing.

For muddled citrus that is shaken with ice, it's getting plenty of contact with alcohol during the shake and I am not so sure there is any advantage to be gained by using a full measure of spirit together with the citrus while it is being muddled.

I'm also not so sure I think temperature should make such a big difference in the range of temperatures and contact times we're talking about. However, in a home setting, there's nothing wrong with muddling, pouring in the spirits and then letting the shaker sit for several minutes so the flavors from the herbs or citrus can infuse into the alcohol. In a professional setting, I don't think there's time for that sort of thing.

[Chris Amirault]

Thanks, Katie and Sam:

Most everyone muddles herbs together with a small amount of liquid.  Usually this is a liquid ingredient that is present in only small amounts (1/2 to 1 ounce) in the recipe, such as simple syrup or citrus juice.  This is for several reasons:  First, it is messy and difficult to muddle herbs in several ounces of liquid. 

I don't really understand that. I've been muddling mint in 6+ oz of liquid for these French Pearls without difficulty or mess.

Second, if you screw something up, you can always dump the drink and start over without having to waste a few ounces of expensive liquor. 

What do you mean by "screw something up"? I'm not sure what could happen in this situation.

Lime quarters and lemon quarters make their own liquid when they are muddled, so there would seem to be little advantage in adding liquid during the muddling process.

That makes sense.

Sometimes it's nice to muddle a lemon peel together with a bitters-soaked sugar cube to "abrade" the surface of the peel and extract extra oils.  This is a trick I picked up from Gary, I think. 

Yep: it's one I picked up from johnnyd here, in his preparation of caipirinhas.

I'm not so sure I think there is any advantage to be gained from muddling tender herbs like mint when the drink will be shaken with ice and strained.  I suppose this depends on the ice you're using, but when I shake mint with ice in the shaker, I use big pieces of ice and I shake hard.  The mint is pulverised into such tiny little bits that I have to double-strain into the glass.  I'm not sure how much more muddled the mint could possibly be, or whether that would possibly be a good thing.

Interesting question. Perhaps I need to return to the lab....

[bostonapothecary]

when you hit the lab just remember to leave all your superstitions and everything you inheritted behind....

cocktails face alot of inherrited technique some of which is useful and some of which is not....

always think.... what would herve this or ferran adria do?

[jsmeeker]

did some more "muddling" tonight.

The other day, I muddled up some diced cucumber with simple syrup and small pinch of salt. added ice. Poured in some Absolut Citron. Shake. Strain.

Did the same today, but added some mint leaves.

Not bad.

[slkinsey]

First, it is messy and difficult to muddle herbs in several ounces of liquid.

I don't really understand that. I've been muddling mint in 6+ oz of liquid for these French Pearls without difficulty or mess.

My experience is that the liquid has a tendency to splash around, especially if you want to muddle vigorously (e.g., if you're using thyme). It makes it difficult to "tap" the mint lightly with the muddler if you're going for a "gently bruised" effect. It makes it difficult to see exactly what you're doing to the herbs. I typically never muddle in any more than an ounce of liquid, and usually more like a half-ounce. Again, I don't think it makes much sense to muddle tender herbs like mint if you're going to be shaking the mint with ice.

Second, if you screw something up, you can always dump the drink and start over without having to waste a few ounces of expensive liquor.

What do you mean by "screw something up"? I'm not sure what could happen in this situation.

Maybe you overpour something. Maybe you realize you used regular basil when you meant to use Thai basil. Maybe you just noticed that the mint leaves aren't in such great condition. Whatever. This may be more applicable to a professional setting, but I noticed a long time ago that when Audrey would give me recipes she'd say things like "half-half-two" for a drink I thought of as "two-half-half." She said the reason is that you want to make the drink using the cheapest ingredients first, so that if you catch a mistake you can dump the drink before pouring the base, which is typically the most expensive part of the drink.

I'm not so sure I think there is any advantage to be gained from muddling tender herbs like mint when the drink will be shaken with ice and strained.  I suppose this depends on the ice you're using, but when I shake mint with ice in the shaker, I use big pieces of ice and I shake hard.  The mint is pulverised into such tiny little bits that I have to double-strain into the glass.  I'm not sure how much more muddled the mint could possibly be, or whether that would possibly be a good thing.

Interesting question. Perhaps I need to return to the lab....

I always muddle tough herbs like thyme. Results may vary with tender herbs depending on technique, equipment and ingredients. I have all-metal Boston shakers, do only one serving per shaker, use "Kold-Draft style at home" ice cubes, use only the mint leaves (not the stems) and I have strong hands and arms so I can shake very violently. When I double-strain, the strainer catches maybe 1.5 teaspoons worth of fine ice and mint particle slush.

[johnder]

I have been muddling a lot recently -- a lot. PDT has a drink, the Pimms Rangoon which is the bane of my existence at the moment. It involves Pimms, Lemon, Simple as well as muddled strawberries, cucumbers and mint. Given I have probably made about 200 of these in the past few weeks I have been playing around with different methods.

I started out with just the solid ingredients and the lemon + simple and muddled that, I tried muddling with the pimms in the tin, as well as every other permutation. I haven't noticed any difference between muddling with 3.5 oz of ingredients vs. muddling with only 1.5 oz of ingredients. I have noticed a difference between a) not muddling and just shaking and b) muddling with no liquid in the tin.

Given we have pretty hefty kold draft cubes I tried once or twice making a drink, skipping the muddling and just doing an extra vigorous shake, and also tried muddling in the dry tin. Both gave sub par results, both in texture and flavor, specifically around the mint and cucumber, the were both bland and missing the brightness muddling gave it.

So end result -- muddling makes a difference, amount of liquid in the tin, not so much. At least in my experience.

[jsmeeker]

OK..

Muddle #2 for tonight.

Muddled some lemon quarters with syrup and diced cucumber. added ice and some Tanqueray. shake. strain.

It's only OK. Not as successful as the previous drink. really, no cucumber flavor at all. Not sure if it's over powered by the lemon or the gin.

[bostonapothecary]

I have been muddling a lot recently -- a lot.  PDT has a drink, the Pimms Rangoon which is the bane of my existence at the moment.  It involves Pimms, Lemon, Simple as well as muddled strawberries, cucumbers and mint.  Given I have probably made about 200 of these in the past few weeks I have been playing around with different methods.

to make the drink economically viable i'd make a complex lemonade out off all that stuff.... i'd cook the strawberries to get them to expell the juice....cook it with the mint.... etc.... add your acid, sugar.... the only thing i'd keep super fresh is the cucumber.... probably a vigorous shake with mandolined cucumber.... or just add potent cucumber water from an atomizer to the drink....

flavor by any means necessary....

i'd probably also add eggwhites to my complex lemonade to make it extra sexy....

[Chris Amirault]

Thanks, John and Sam. Last night's drink was a White Lady, so I didn't have a chance to practice. Sam, this point made a lot of sense to me:

I noticed a long time ago that when Audrey would give me recipes she'd say things like "half-half-two" for a drink I thought of as "two-half-half."  She said the reason is that you want to make the drink using the cheapest ingredients first, so that if you catch a mistake you can dump the drink before pouring the base, which is typically the most expensive part of the drink.

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Just seems smart.

[lancastermike]

Thanks, John and Sam. Last night's drink was a White Lady, so I didn't have a chance to practice. Sam, this point made a lot of sense to me:

I noticed a long time ago that when Audrey would give me recipes she'd say things like "half-half-two" for a drink I thought of as "two-half-half."  She said the reason is that you want to make the drink using the cheapest ingredients first, so that if you catch a mistake you can dump the drink before pouring the base, which is typically the most expensive part of the drink.

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Just seems smart.

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It makes good sense as Chris says. I always add the base fist. That is how I learned to do it when I was a bartender. I do the same at home these days. Perhaps I should change as the logic here seems sound.

How about you pros? What do you add first?

[KatieLoeb]

I usually muddle my herbs or fruit with simple syrup or juice first, then add everything else. Never really thought out the logic of the expense. For me, it was about muddling into a small amount of liquid that would then carry the flavors into the rest of the ingredients, including the largest volume of base spirit.

The cost argument makes sense, but doesn't really matter if the mistake you make is picking up the wrong bottle, though.

[jsmeeker]

I just made a mojito..

I muddled the lime wedges and mint with simple syrup. Is it better to do the limes and syrup first, then the mint? After reading this thread, I think I may be over working the mint too much.

[Chris Amirault]

I think that releasing the oils from the limes requires more pressure by far than doing the same with delicate mint leaves. So, yes, I'd say limes with some energy (& with granulated sugar, if you've got the time) and then the mint gently.

[bostonapothecary]

I just made a mojito..

I muddled the lime wedges and mint with simple syrup.  Is it better to do the limes and syrup first, then the mint?  After reading this thread, I think I may be over working the mint too much.

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you can probably decimate the mint all you want.... as long as you run it through a cocktail sieve before you serve it....

i usually sieve them to keep my guests kissable....

the bar at la bodequita del medio was probably full of old cigar chewing old men that never had anyone to kiss....

sometimes i cut a round lime twist like for a "ti punch" and expel it into the cocktail....

i don't have to work tonight.... i think i'm gonna go have some cocktails....

[slkinsey]

I have been muddling a lot recently -- a lot.  PDT has a drink, the Pimms Rangoon which is the bane of my existence at the moment.  It involves Pimms, Lemon, Simple as well as muddled strawberries, cucumbers and mint.  Given I have probably made about 200 of these in the past few weeks I have been playing around with different methods.

I started out with just the solid ingredients and the lemon + simple and muddled that, I tried muddling with the pimms in the tin, as well as every other permutation.  I haven't noticed any difference between muddling with 3.5 oz of ingredients vs. muddling with only 1.5 oz of ingredients.  I have noticed a difference between a) not muddling and just shaking and b) muddling with no liquid in the tin.

Given we have pretty hefty kold draft cubes I tried once or twice making a drink, skipping the muddling and just doing an extra vigorous shake, and also tried muddling in the dry tin.  Both gave sub par results, both in texture and flavor, specifically around the mint and cucumber, the were both bland and missing the brightness muddling gave it.

So end result -- muddling makes a difference, amount of liquid in the tin, not so much.  At least in my experience.

I'm not surprised you found a difference between muddling and shaking, considering the nature and amount of muddled product. I'd suggest that shaking without muddling only makes sense when you are using tender herbs, and the herbs are the only solid ingredient in the shaker besides the ice. Things like cucumber and strawberry, due to their structure, need muddling to fully express their flavors (also, one is generally not concerned about potential negative effects of over-muddling, as one often is with respect to tender herbs). Also, considering that the tin presumably contains mint, strawberry and cucumber, it's likely that the it's a little crowded in there for shaking alone to get the job done.

[thirtyoneknots]

OK..

Muddle #2 for tonight.

Muddled some lemon quarters with syrup and diced cucumber.  added ice and some  Tanqueray.  shake. strain.

It's only OK. Not as successful as the previous drink.  really, no cucumber flavor at all. Not sure if it's over powered by the lemon or the gin.

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I could see the strong flavors of lemon zest overpowering the relatively delicate flavor of cucumber here. I've never been much of a fan of muddling lemon wedges, originally because of the seeds, but also because the zest of a lemon is an extremely strong flavor that can be hard to control. If I want that flavor I'd rather muddle a swath of peel in the juice with a little sugar, a la Jerry Thomas' Crimean Cup. That way you could use a smaller piece and control it better. Limes, on the other hand, I routinely muddle in pieces, as I find the contribution of lime zest to be much milder than that of lemon. Also makes a nice show for customers when making Mojitos and Old Cubans.