Paris Restaurant Strategy

[DodinBouffant]

I posted this on a previous thread so please excuse the duplicity but thought a new thread might yield more responses.

It is good to see Biche au Bois noted as one of only a few gastronomic choices in the Bercy area. I have enjoyed 2 great meals there and will be enjoying another on Nov 6th, shortly after digesting lunch from La Regalade(Becosse peut-etre?).

I try to visit Paris twice a year and have never ever limited myself to a particular neighborhood where I may be staying for my dining options(my primary focus on these visits is to dine). I find that all of Paris is easily accessible and would hope the poster would not limit himself to the environs of his hotel. His requests for info on Gagnaire and ADPA do suggest he is willing to leave the Bercy area.

That withstanding I might suggest L'Avant Gout which is nearby Place d'Italie, which I don't think is too far from Bercy.

I am actually venturing to Le Perreux for the first time on one of these trips(which is actually outside of Paris), a breakthrough perhaps?? Where's the limit for a lunch or dinner trip but also being able to return to your hotel in Montparnasse...Reims? Cancale? Lyon?

Seeing as this is my first post in this forum I might as well ramble for a moment and see if I can get some help. I try to do these trips twice a year and I do find myself returning to some of the same restaurants over and over(enough to be recognized on some occasions), more often than not because I am accompanied by first time visitors to a city that I love and I want them to have a very favorable impression of the gastronomic delights of Paris. I have been dissapointed by some restaurants and surely won't return. I have no fear of trying new places but when someone else puts their hard earned cash and faith in me, I have no choice, I feel but to return to favorites.

This trip has me struggling slightly with my itinerary. I've got 5 1/2 days, so far 2 lunches planned leaving Sat/Sun day open for market gazing etc. I've got 5 dinners planned, but of all these reservations, I've got only one new restaurant on the list. Monday lunch is open for the chance of possibly sneaking in somewhere myself(after metroing myself all around Paris gazing at menus). Tuesday is Armistice day with a return flight to the States at 4pm(time for lunch? anyplace open?). Caveat: The two friends accompanying me this time have fairly shallow pockets, personally I don't care what I spend as long as the amount spent provides a good/great ratio of cost to enjoyment.(just my luck the euro is so strong against the dollar)

I am fairly confident in my ability to get myself around Paris efficiently. Does anyone have any particular strategies they may recommend that I can add to my strategies to help me experience more/newer places in short periods of time? It isn't like the states(and I am glad it is not) where you can visit 3,4 or 5 restaurants in a night sampling etc, so maybe there is some info I am missing out on.

Any help?

--------------------

Je celui aimerais de tout!

[Bux]

I find that when making restaurant reservations in Paris, I tend not to pay much attention to where I'm staying, but when I make last minute choices, I invariably look close to my hotel. There are pros and cons to both methods, but Paris is such an easy city in which to get around that if one wants excellent food, it's not reasonable to limit oneself geographically. When the weather is good, we've enjoyed very long walks back from restaurants late at night. We have no problem using the metro late at night, although they don't run all night long. Cabs are plentiful and a restaurant will be happy to call one for you. There is a caveat about calling for a cab--the meter drops from the time the driver answers the call. I've found that the charge on the meter when the cab arrives is often more than the amount added while I'm in the car. Of course the initial charge accounts for some of this.

Enjoy Les Magnolias--I assume that's the reason for your trip to the burbs. I am one of the few who wasn't convinced by my meal there, although I think the chef was serious and talented. It's just that I found his combinations unconvincing. I felt he was still designing each dish, whereas chefs such as Gagnaire and Adria had finished the experimentation and were presenting fully developed works. As I said, others found the food convincing and inspiring, so you should try it with enthusiasm. At worst, it will be stimulating and make you think about food in a serious manner and at best it will be a memorable meal.

I think your question about lunch or dinner out of Paris is too vague. For one thing lunch is a far different matter than dinner. Leave at 9:00, have lunch from 13:00 to 16:30 and arrive back in Paris at 21:00 in time for a light dinner, but I don't think you want to have dinner at 21:00 and arrive in Paris eight hours later. So I see two separate questions. Even then, if the destination is a possible day trip, why wouldn't you want to stay overnight? Hotels in Paris are no less expensive than elsewhere in France. You're apt to get more for your money in terms of a hotel room, why rush back to Paris after spending the whole day traveling? Actually, room and board in the provinces is apt to be be a better value.

I'm not sure what kind of advice anyone can give about experiencing "more/newer places in short periods of time?" One can graze in Paris today in a way that was relatively unknown a couple of generations ago. There are excellent wine bars, oyster bars, and what I--and Parisians--are apt to think of as tapas bars, but there's only so much one can eat and the tapas bars are not the sort of places they are in Donostia, where it's the custom to bar hop. In terms of knowing about the latest places to open and the hot new places in town, fresh_a has been great about posting news, but Paris is a city the lives for news of food and restaurants and most of it makes the press very quickly. This site is a good resource for those who may not read all the French papers and journals, but how much does it matter when there are already too many places to cover in a short month in Paris.

The only advice I may have--and it's been repeated all over this site--is that any diner in a restaurant where the food is taken seriously by the chef and staff, will do better as he manages to convince his waiter that he really appreciates the food and is not just there because the restuarant appears in guide books with a high rating. It's easier if you speak the language, but even language is not always a barrier.

[OAKGLEN]

Hi Dodin, I have enjoyed your reviews on Chowhound. I f you are feeling flush, try a limo service. We found one that is only about 50% more than comparable taxi rates; Write to Dany at Amadeus.driver@wanadoo.fr. He has a small company, about 5 or 6 cars, I believe. You get all the extras like carrying bags up and down stairs etc. And he will be waiting outside while you try all those great restaurants in rapid succession! JP

[Margaret Pilgrim]

Dodin, I have posted this before, but it always seems to be new to someone. If you go to Les Magnolias by train, make sure you take the E RER train to Le Perroux, not the A RER train to Nogent. The E train will take you within several long blocks of Les Magnolias; the A train's stop in Nogent is a mile+ away. Enjoy.

[Bux]

The E train will take you within several long blocks of Les Magnolias;

Sure, but just try driving from the train station to the restaurant. We couldn't find the restaurant, but did find the train station. We tried getting directions to the restaurant and the first person we asked started to tell us how to go and about halfway though she decided you really "couldn't get there from here." It seemed all the one way streets were against us. She did point us in the general direction and we made a big loop and zeroed in a second time and ran smack into the restaurant while we were still looking for the right street. We were a little late for our reservation, but as it appeared tables were not rebooked, there was no problem and we still finished lunch in time to make it to CDG for our flight. It would have been terrible to have missed the flight. Missing lunch was out of the question.

[DodinBouffant]

Margaret, I viewed your previous post about the E RER and have it noted in my files, thank you so much for reposting to be sure I would see it. That is very considerate.

You mentioned picking up the E RER at Havre Caumartin but my map shows it originating at Hausmann St-Lazare which is connected to HC, probably just a short walk either way, just wondering if there is a big difference. How long did the train take from origination. Also, any idea what time the RER stops going back into Paris?

Bux your comment about missing the flight etc was hilarious and I wholeheartedly agree...that being said, my flight back is at 4pm, that means be at CDG by two which means taxi or train by 1:15(probably taxi especially if some purchases have been made). My flight back is on a Tuesday(Armistice Day). I will probably feel this out a day or two upon arrival especially with extra closings due to the holiday...should I rush through a good lunch at a reputable spot(assuming one is open) or leisurely enjoy the day packing up on food goodies to eat on the flight back? The time constraints definitely make it a tough call.

[menton1]

Does Les Magnolias provide luggage racks for their diners?

[hollywood]

Here's where I meant to post this.

Here's some recent Wells' picks in Burgundy. http://www.patriciawells.com/reviews/iht/iht.htm

You could certainly make it to Reims and back for lunch at Les Boyer--but it would be a hassle. The new Robuchon place might be worth a look and since there are no reservations you could be flexible on timing.

As for the shallow pockets, there's the prix fixe at L'Os a Moelle and the seafood at Taira.

Edited October 31, 2003 by hollywood (log)

[Bux]

Menton, I didn't see luggage racks in les Magnolias. We had ours in the car.

DodinBouffant, it's a real luxury to be able to time a flight so that one leaves with a good meal under one's belt. It doesn't always happen that way. On our last trip, we woke up in San Sebastian and drove to Biarritz to catch our flight home. We had last minute shopping along the way and the flight left too early to have a big lunch. We grabbed some savory quiches and salad at a spot we knew in Bayonne, but also bought some cured meat in San Sebastian that morning and cheese and bread in Bayonne. The latter was both for the flight and to bring home. The lomo (cured pork loin) and cheese were far better than the meal they served on the plane, which mostly went uneaten. In fact we didn't finish all the chevre we intended to eat on the plane. I'm not sure if I followed my own advice here or not, but we fared pretty well. Take whatever advice you can here.

A word on our quiches. There's a charming little place with outdoor tables in Bayonne. The name is Tarte Julie and they offer fantastic quiches with orignal fillings. They also offer great dessert tarts. All of these are large and served in good sized slices. We knew this place from a visit years ago and were pleasantly surprised to see it looked the same and offered the same quality. A word of warning. Earlier on our trip this month, we ran across a place by the same name in Paris that appeared to offer a similar menu of savory and sweet tarts and salads. We didn't know if they were part of the same chain, or which came first, or even if they had any connection in spite of the obvious suggestion they were connected. The place in Paris was truly disappointing. The crusts were soggy and the slices unevenly reheated in a microwave. In Bayonne they use a gas fired oven. The service in Paris was disconnected as well. It's up near the Gare Montparnasse and pass it by if you see it. It was the mistake of our trip. Truth to tell, it didn't look that appetizing and it was the memory of the place in Bayonne that drew us in.

[Margaret Pilgrim]

Dodin, I just pulled up the RATP itinerary site , plugged in St. Lazare and Le Perreux, and the departure time of 20h, and got the above information on a pop-up, including a super map that shows the station opening onto Blvd. de la Liberte, which deadends at Les Magnolias front door on Avenue Bry. The site told me that there is a 3 minute walk from Gare St. Lazare to the RER station, a 25 minute trainride, a 1 minute walk through the Le Perreux RER station, for a total travel time of 29 minutes! These Frenchmen are amazing! I didn't stay around long enough to ask them when the last train is. As I remember, it is around 12:45am, but this is old and sketchy information.

Edited October 31, 2003 by Margaret Pilgrim (log)

[menton1]

I will probably feel this out a day or two upon arrival especially with extra closings due to the holiday...should I rush through a good lunch at a reputable spot(assuming one is open) or leisurely enjoy the day packing up on food goodies to eat on the flight back?  The time constraints definitely make it a tough call.

Having to leave at 1:15 will only give you 75 minutes for lunch.... that's lightning fast for a restaurant in France, could potentially take away from the experience having that time anxiety....

Stocking up on goodies is a good idea, except that Nov 11 is a major holiday in France, and many of the good places (Fauchon, Hédiard, et al) are probably closed, and most likely they will do a 4-day weekend.

A dilemma....

[Louisa Chu]

Most businesses will be closed on November 11th - especially the little restos - we at ADPA unfortunately will not. I just gotta say I get heartburn when I hear about visitors' dining itineraries - bonne chance!

Edited November 1, 2003 by loufood (log)

[DodinBouffant]

I just gotta say I get heartburn when I hear about visitors' dining itineraries - bonne chance!

I may have been stricken with the "Crise de Foie" for a 1/2 a day last year(which caused me to miss a lunch reservation at Hiramatsu) but I'm not so sure I've been plagued with too much heartburn in Paris. The antacids they sell in Paris (Rennie) suck so if you need some good stuff from the states(Tums,Zantac etc) let me know and I'll be happy to be the mule...anything for the food!!!