Custom Polycarbonate Molds

[Jim D.]

Finally I had an opportunity to use the 17g Cabrellon flattened dome discussed in this thread and to display it alongside the Chocolate World 17g dome I have been using for quite some time (the Cabrellon is on the right in the photo below).  In the photo it hardly seems that both molds have the same capacity.  The Cabrellon is a large mold.  If I had ordered custom molds, I would have had them made a few millimeters smaller in diameter and a few millimeters taller, but the difference in price between buying this mold vs. having one custom made is, of course, quite substantial.  At first the size of the new mold made it look out of place, but since I use molds of many different sizes (including a half-sphere that is only a couple of millimeters smaller), it doesn't seem so odd when it has been placed in a tray.  It is more difficult to fill than I expected.  I use it for bonbons with multiple layers, and when a layer is one of those ganaches that is quite viscous, it is tricky to spread it over the diameter of the mold before it becomes too thick.  As I hoped, bonbons release more easily from the mold (to be expected from its shorter height and slightly sloped sides).  All things considered, I am glad I found the mold and have ordered more of them in time for holiday production.

 

Edited October 8 by Jim D. (log)

[pastrygirl]

Glad you found something that mostly works. Did the two pieces end up being the same weight in reality?

[Jim D.]

4 minutes ago, pastrygirl said:

Glad you found something that mostly works. Did the two pieces end up being the same weight in reality?

 

The two bonbons in the photo have very different fillings, so weighing them wouldn't help.  I intended to fill one cavity of each mold with solid chocolate, but in the rush of finishing the batch, I forgot.  I will do it with the next batch.

[Rajala]

Yeah, you get quite a large bonbon. It's like a third of a snickers bar.

[Jim D.]

5 hours ago, Rajala said:

Yeah, you get quite a large bonbon. It's like a third of a snickers bar.

 

So far no customer has complained that the bonbon is too large!  That particular filling, by the way, is one I adapted from one of yours.  The first layer is rhubarb pâte de fruit (I found some particularly flavorful local rhubarb), the second is yogurt ganache (this time I flavored it with strawberry rather than vanilla), and the third is a toasted oatmeal crumble.  Thanks for the recipe--and for all the ideas available on your Instagram page.

[Vojta]

Hey @Jim D., very interesting topic as I am on the search for the best mold atm. Could you write a comparison between these molds and Include chef Jugsted's signiture - I am thinking about this one or its 30 mm alternative from ChocolateWorld.

 

Btw I have the flat CW 2207, I can make some test for you if you want. I purchased it bcs it is the only mold which has 40 cavities/mold (apart from hemisphere). I didnt know about the flat top though and I dont like it.

My quote for custom PC molds from ChocolateWorld from 2020 was: 31-38 €/ mold when ordering 100 pieces.

 

On 10/3/2024 at 9:54 PM, Jim D. said:

It is more difficult to fill than I expected

It is more difficult to fill the bonbon on the right? Is that the 17g Cabrellon, what are the dimensions please?

Edited October 7 by Vojta
added quote (log)

[Rajala]

On 10/4/2024 at 1:48 PM, Jim D. said:

 

So far no customer has complained that the bonbon is too large!  That particular filling, by the way, is one I adapted from one of yours.  The first layer is rhubarb pâte de fruit (I found some particularly flavorful local rhubarb), the second is yogurt ganache (this time I flavored it with strawberry rather than vanilla), and the third is a toasted oatmeal crumble.  Thanks for the recipe--and for all the ideas available on your Instagram page.

 

You're welcome! Happy to be able to inspire a bit! (I'm thinking about going to a rhubarb festival in England next year, very strange but interesting haha)

[Jim D.]

On 10/7/2024 at 4:42 PM, Vojta said:

Hey @Jim D., very interesting topic as I am on the search for the best mold atm. Could you write a comparison between these molds and Include chef Jugsted's signiture - I am thinking about this one or its 30 mm alternative from ChocolateWorld.

 

Btw I have the flat CW 2207, I can make some test for you if you want. I purchased it bcs it is the only mold which has 40 cavities/mold (apart from hemisphere). I didnt know about the flat top though and I dont like it.

My quote for custom PC molds from ChocolateWorld from 2020 was: 31-38 €/ mold when ordering 100 pieces.

 

It is more difficult to fill the bonbon on the right? Is that the 17g Cabrellon, what are the dimensions please?

 

Yes, the Cabrellon is on the right in the photo (I included that info previously but somehow deleted it during editing).  When I decided to try to do something about 17g CW domes (CW calls them "cones") sticking in the mold and also allowing colored cocoa butter to stick, I turned to Chocolat Chocolat in Montreal.  A staff member there was very helpful, taking lots of photos comparing the various domes.  I had read that the tall domes tend to have thin sides near the top of the cavity (the area that later becomes the bottom).  Thanks to gravity, the crystallizing chocolate settles in the bottom of the cavity.  So I have developed some techniques for leading the chocolate in the problem area to get thicker, and the situation has improved.  But it occurred to me that a less tall cavity might alleviate the problem without all the fuss.  I already had the CW 2207, which I call a flattened dome, and I am pleased with the bonbons it produces (I do, however, dislike the mold because, to get those 40 cavities, the designer virtually eliminated "margins" around the cavities--and filling the mold always causes a huge mess).  But I wanted a larger version of CW 2007.  That's what led me to consider having molds custom-made.  But what if there is such a mold already available?  That's what led me to Chocolat Chocolat and to Cabrellon molds; the Jungstedt mold was also in the mix.  Eventually I decided that photos were not enough, so I ordered a smaller version of the same Cabrellon mold and also one of Jungstedt's molds.  I made a solid piece of chocolate from each to see what they really produced.  I concluded that the flattened domes lean to one direction or another--either they are very close to half-spheres or they are more like CW 2207.  The Jungstedt bonbon looked very much like a half-sphere.  I have watched Kalle fill these molds, and I don't see how he gets three layers into them.

 

So I leaned toward the 17g Cabrellon 1728 (Chocolat Chocolat had only the 11g version, 6024).  I ordered 10 of the 1728 (Cabrellon's minimum order for export), and that is what is in the photo posted earlier.  As I said, I am not totally happy with it, but it does accomplish my two goals: it is earlier to unmold, and it doesn't tend to have thin spots in the shell.  The only difficulty in filling it is with very viscous ganaches; it's problematic getting an even layer spread around the large diameter of the cavity.

 

Here is the summary info you requested about these molds (all "flattened domes"):
 

Jungstedt's mold:  4 x 7 layout, 11g, 31mm diameter x 18mm tall

Cabrellon 6024:  4 x 8 layout, 11g, 29mm diameter x 18mm tall

Cabrellon 1728:  4 x 6 layout, 17g, 35mm diameter x 20mm tall

Chocolate World 2207:  5 x 8 layout, 14g, 30mm diameter x 19mm tall

 

In your quote from CW for custom molds, you don't include the initial cost for the metal die from which the individual molds are manufactured.  The die is the expensive part.

 

If you don't like the flattened domes, then what other design are you thinking of?

[Vojta]

On 10/8/2024 at 11:16 PM, Jim D. said:

In your quote from CW for custom molds, you don't include the initial cost for the metal die from which the individual molds are manufactured.  The die is the expensive part.

 

No, no: 31€/mould includes the tooling and the 3D modeling. I divaded the fee by 100 pieces and added it. Note it is from 2022.

 

On 10/8/2024 at 11:16 PM, Jim D. said:

eliminated "margins"

I agree. The 40-cavity molds have no edges and require a piping bag or there is a mess. It could be solved with a depositor though. However I wonder if such a density of cavities doesn't inhibit cooling. I usualy have few bonbons stuck inside CW2207.

 

On 10/8/2024 at 11:16 PM, Jim D. said:

Jungstedt's mold:  4 x 7 layout, 11g, 31mm diameter x 18mm tall

Cabrellon 6024:  4 x 8 layout, 11g, 29mm diameter x 18mm tall

Cabrellon 1728:  4 x 6 layout, 17g, 35mm diameter x 20mm tall

Chocolate World 2207:  5 x 8 layout, 14g, 30mm diameter x 19mm tall

Maybe could you share photos of all of them. I like that Cabrellon 6024 has one more row, however the weight is probably about 9 g only (comparing Jungsted and CW2483)

To the list I add:

1 Hemispheres 9 g for 30 mm diameter, 13 g for 35 mm diameter, 17+ g for 40 mm diameter

2 Pavoni PC5046: 4x6 layout, 10 g, 33 mm diameter x 13 mm tall - it is a 'hemisphere' with a smaller curve, spectacular size

3 CW2483: 4x7 layout, 10.3g, 30 mm diameter x 18 mm tall - it is the same as Jungsted, like hemisphere on a stand, I fancy its standard 30 mm diameter

4 Martellato MA1927: 4x7 layout, 11 g, 26 mm diameter x 23 mm tall - it is a hemisphere with straight cylinder underneath, basically like Jungsted, just much taller

5 Cylinders: 10 g, 29 mm x 14 mm or 12.5 g, 30 mm x 16 mm - I don't know how to mould these, they are always stuck. I guess it is the opposite to your problem? 

6 Dome CW2471: 4x7 layout, 15 g, 29 mm diameter x 24 mm tall - dome shape with concave sides, everyone is using this shape

On 10/8/2024 at 11:16 PM, Jim D. said:

tend to have thin sides

 

 

On 10/8/2024 at 11:16 PM, Jim D. said:

what other design are you thinking of

I want 11-14 g. I want a hemisphere with slight bottom, because hemispheres tend to flip. I would love something between 2 and 3. My other moulds are 30 mm diameter, so makes sense to keep the size, doesnt it?. I have to say I am tempted by (2) or something with a diameter of 35 mm. That would truly stand out from competitors.

And if I could temper like a god, I would go for CW1754

Guys I would be thankful if you could help me to mould (5). It is always stuck (there is a 'wet' circle in the middle). The flat top is too thin.

This is great talking haha. Thank you!

 

 

Edited October 12 by Vojta
added (6) (log)

[Jim D.]

@Vojta I didn't photograph a bonbon from the molds I was considering (I made my decision for the Cabrellon and then ate all the examples!).  I might be able to get to that after I finish my current batch.

 

The dome labeled #4 in your photo is what CW would call a cone; it looks just like my 17g CW dome.  I looked up its weight, and it's the ever-popular 11g.

 

I am not at all surprised by the misbehavior of #5.  I have been attracted to it many times and have seen beautiful bonbons come out of it, but that flat bottom is bound to cause the wet circle.  That happens with some magnetic molds I use.  I would think the only "solution" is to decorate it in such a way that the design disguises the imperfection.  #2 is a good example of an extreme flattened dome.

[pastrygirl]

On 10/8/2024 at 2:16 PM, Jim D. said:

CW 2207, ... to get those 40 cavities, the designer virtually eliminated "margins" around the cavities--and filling the mold always causes a huge mess)

 

2 hours ago, Vojta said:

The 40-cavity molds have no edges and require a piping bag or there is a mess.

 

I found a pic online & wow, those are super close together.  I dislike all the chocolate that gets on the top of the mold when the cavities are far apart, I'm trying to picture how this is messier.  Greater volume of chocolate & instead of each cavity draining individually they run together?

 

Do you mean a piping bag for the fillings?  How else do you do it?  I pipe everything. 🤷‍♀️

[Jim D.]

4 minutes ago, pastrygirl said:

 

 

I found a pic online & wow, those are super close together.  I dislike all the chocolate that gets on the top of the mold when the cavities are far apart, I'm trying to picture how this is messier.  Greater volume of chocolate & instead of each cavity draining individually they run together?

 

Do you mean a piping bag for the fillings?  How else do you do it?  I pipe everything. 🤷‍♀️

 

I think he meant using a piping bag to make the shells--you know, the way people do it in videos (when they are making just one mold).  When filling the mold with a ladle, there is no space between cavities for the chocolate to flow, so most of the extra flows over the edges  It's when I turn the mold upside down that the mess becomes really bad.  The mold is heavy when it's full, so holding it upside down and scraping it is particularly difficult.   5 x 8 is a bad idea!

[pastrygirl]

40 x 14g - a pound & a quarter per mold is a lot of chocolate!

 

I recently got some tiny molds for samples, it was weird how light they were.  I hope I never have to polish them, I'd need to use my pinky finger or maybe a q-tip.

Edited October 10 by pastrygirl (log)

[Jim D.]

28 minutes ago, pastrygirl said:

40 x 14g - a pound & a quarter per mold is a lot of chocolate!

 

I recently got some tiny molds for samples, it was weird how light they were.  I hope I never have to polish them, I'd need to use my pinky finger or maybe a q-tip.

And a lot of chocolate these days costs a lot of money.

 

I saw those samples.  I don't see ever cleaning them.  Isn't there a limit to the insanity of chocolatiers?

[Vojta]

17 hours ago, Jim D. said:

The dome labeled #4 in your photo is what CW would call a cone; it looks just like my 17g CW dome.  I looked up its weight, and it's the ever-popular 11g.

 

I am not at all surprised by the misbehavior of #5.  I have been attracted to it many times and have seen beautiful bonbons come out of it, but that flat bottom is bound to cause the wet circle.  That happens with some magnetic molds I use.  I would think the only "solution" is to decorate it in such a way that the design disguises the imperfection.  #2 is a good example of an extreme flattened dome.

I did edit my post. Added (6) - that is a classic dome. For me the difference is that dome (6) has curving sides all the way from the bottom. (3), (4) have a hemisphere sitting on a cylinder with straight (parallel) sides, the curve starts higher up.

 

The wet circle is too big of a issue for me. I have about 15% bonbons stuck in the mould unable to unmold without freezer. Any tips?

 

17 hours ago, Jim D. said:

I think he meant using a piping bag to make the shells--you know, the way people do it in videos (when they are making just one mold)

Yep, exactly. Other way is a depositor if you have the volumes and budget.

[Jim D.]

1 hour ago, Vojta said:

I did edit my post. Added (6) - that is a classic dome. For me the difference is that dome (6) has curving sides all the way from the bottom. (3), (4) have a hemisphere sitting on a cylinder with straight (parallel) sides, the curve starts higher up.

 

I see your point.  I would not want to work with #4--it has those straight sides that (for me) make domes difficult to use.  I can't imagine having the bonbons drop out of that mold without resorting to counter-banging and freezer-popping-into.