Pastizzi Construction

[IndyRob]

Courtesy Chattacha @ Wikicommons.

It's been over 40 years since I was in Malta and experienced my first pastizzi. This was probably followed by at least 50 more. I honestly can't remember a single other foodstuff while I was there. For those that may not know, pastizzis are ricotta and egg filling (among others, like a pea & meat filling) in a Pâté feuilletée-like pastry. Puff pastry produces a rough facsimile, but it falls far short of the real thing.

I've occasionally been trying to make proper pastizzi ever since. Every so often I've searched the internet. I know I've been lead down the wrong path several times, but now it looks like more credible info (and videos) are available. There are even travel packages now where you can go to Malta and be schooled on site. But I don't think I want to go quite that far.

I originally thought that the ricotta mixture was important, but I've since decided it isn't the critical element. I've made my own ricotta from cow and goat milk, but in testing one of my failed attempts at making the pastry, I found a little bit of the essence hiding somewhere in the decidedly non-flaky pastry. The secret is in there, I'm sure.

I'm gearing up to make another attempt and want to try to minimize the mistakes. I found two videos that appear to corroborate other....

Commercial Aussie Operation....

Someone's Grandma...(much longer)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8454701352872277913#

So now come my questions. It looks like the four in the first video is "BAKERS EXTRA FLOUR" which does seem to be an Australian product. It looks like the second is using King Arthur Unbleached All Purpose. Would these be roughly equivalent?

Would one want to develop gluten in the dough?

It doesn't appear that any special precautions are taken to keep things cold. Wouldn't this be desirable? Maybe they're working so fast that it isn't an issue.

The pastry layers are made by rolling the dough into a long snake which is cut up. At around 0:58 in the first video, it looks as though a thumb is plunged into the cut edge of a piece which then is worked into a cup-like shape into which the filling goes. Does this technique exist elsewhere in pastry making, or is it unique to pastizzi?

[JTravel]

I'm looking forward to following this thread. I need to learn about pastry making, and I love ricotta.

[Lisa Shock]

Looks like it's related to an Italian pastry called Sfogliatelle, or sometimes lobster tails in the US. This is generally a sweet pastry, but the dough technique appears to be the same.

[IndyRob]

Looks like it's related to an Italian pastry called Sfogliatelle, or sometimes lobster tails in the US. This is generally a sweet pastry, but the dough technique appears to be the same.

Yes, this looks like a similar method from another earlier pastizzi video. I likened it to strudel (stretching dough over a whole table). It had the same melted butter application that I thought a little dubious.

I tried it and I think I made two mistakes. First I failed to cut off the edges. Then I failed on the forming of the cut pieces. In this vid it's clear that he mashes down on the cut end to make the disc which is then formed around a filling...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr-yaD1Gc1Y

[ETA] Ooops, that one didn't want to be embedded, but this one sort of unifies the whole theme....

Edited January 2, 2011 by IndyRob (log)

[CanadianBakin']

I'd never heard of pastizzi and I've never seen them for sale but they look amazing!!

[rooftop1000]

That definatly looks like a Sfogliatelle...I got the Carlo's Bakery book for Christmas (Cake Boss) and Buddy gives the recipe and technique in the book. He also says that if you master the dough to please move to Hoboken NJ and apply at the bakery

tracey

[IndyRob]

That definatly looks like a Sfogliatelle...I got the Carlo's Bakery book for Christmas (Cake Boss) and Buddy gives the recipe and technique in the book. He also says that if you master the dough to please move to Hoboken NJ and apply at the bakery

tracey

Yeah, I've been looking at a lot of sfogliatelle videos today. There's definitely close relationship. And a lot of slightly different ways to accomplish the same goal.

Here's my favorite vid of the day. A very fastidious formation of the shell (which I think is the key). 3 minutes to show what these pro pastizzi (sfogliatelle) folks are doing in about 5 seconds.

[CanadianBakin']

I'm amazed that they still get such a flaky layered dough after handling it so much.

[rickster]

Nick Malgieri has a recipe in his book, Great Italian Desserts. Not sure if it's still in print.

[Snadra]

My only personal experience of pastizzi is the ones I can buy from the frozen food section at the supermarket (my local shop has a small freezer dedicated to them).

My first thought was the SBS Food website as the footage for the commercial pastizzi operation you linked to came from one of their programs. Unfortunately they don't seem to have any recipes for pastizzi (there are a few other maltese recipes though).

I'm pretty sure that the Bakers Extra Flour they are using is a strong/bread flour like this one, so at a guess, I'd say they must want at least some gluten to develop.

Also: Don't portugese custard tarts (pasteis de nata) have a similar pastry base? Check out

from about 1.55.

[rooftop1000]

I'm amazed that they still get such a flaky layered dough after handling it so much.

While the pastry is Flakey it's not the tender flakey of a puff pastry the layers are fairly firm and crisp there just many many layers.

In the Cake Boss book Buddy describes how he couldn't make them after his father died, then he had a dream where his father was guiding his hands to stretch and stretch the dough and when he woke up he ran right to the bakery and had his first success at making it.

[IndyRob]

Well, five years on, I've gotten pretty close, but no cigar yet.  I know now that I can nail the filling.  My Maltese uncle confirmed that it is cow's milk ricotta, and I've discovered only home made ricotta will do for its low moisture content.  This allows you to add more eggs for more flavor.  Then quite a bit of S&P to make it perfect.  But I haven't yet perfected the ratios.  But I always knew that would be the easy part.  I nailed it once - I know I I can do it again (and eventually repeatedly)

 

Now I'm on to fine tuning the pastry.  The technique is one thing, but I've got it close and is just something I'll have to work on.  But now I'm having a crisis about which flour to use.

 

My latest (and even a bit photogenic) result was with Caputo "00" flour.   But my previous attempt used high gluten flour and wasn't really that different (and might've had a better flavor).  There are more videos out their now, but none of them explain the characteristics of the flour you want.

Edited April 30, 2016 by IndyRob (log)

[shain]

Look over this blog:

http://ladyandpups.com/2015/04/04/how-to-make-cruffin-with-pasta-machine/

http://ladyandpups.com/2016/02/24/zero-folding-pastel-de-nata-a-hybrid/

She seems to get good results and explains well. She uses a mix of bread flour and AP. 

I don't make much pastry, but from my experience making pizzas, the flour strength is not very important in terms of elasticity and ease of stretching, as long as you form a good gluten network. I wouldn't use AP flour by itself, but using only bread flour or a mix of both should be fine. 

The important thing for an easy to roll dough is a long rest time, at least overnight. 

I don't use 00 flour (super fine) but many pizza makers choose it for making very thinly rolled pizzas. 

Also, adding a little fat to the dough helps to prevent tearing. 

Edited May 3, 2016 by shain (log)

[ElsieD]

@IndyRob  I came across this when I was doing a search for cruffins.   Did you master the pastry?

[IndyRob]

1 hour ago, ElsieD said:

@IndyRob  I came across this when I was doing a search for cruffins.   Did you master the pastry?

 

My last attempt was very promising.  I used a pasta machine to roll pieces of dough very thin before stretching it further on the counter, and even further while rolling it into the tube.  And then even further by stretching the tube.  However, I didn't allow the dough to relax long enough after that last step and had problems forming the pastizzis properly.  But they were kinda' OK nevertheless.

 

I only attempt it every 6 months or so.  But the last attempt has me a bit more encouraged and I may take another shot at it soon.

 

[ElsieD]

I am interested in making cruffins and have started a topic in the pastry and baking section.  The dough sounds very similar, essentially a croissant type dough.  I read the article that used a pasta machine and may try that next.  What is your ratio of flour/liquid/butter? I have visions of the dough sticking to the pasta rollers.

[IndyRob]

I looked at a cruffin recipe and they don't appear to be very similar.  Pastizzi dough is more like phyllo.  There's just flour, water and a little oil.  It's about 57% hydration.