Bux

winemike, I think I understood your points fairly well. My comment about the extensive red wine list was in support of your shock at the waiter's comment regarding wine choices. It was years ago, but I recall having a tasting menu there. One of our party knew Eric Ripert and was very close friends with a chef friend of Ripert's. We were treated well, although I don't mean to imply I have ever not been treated well there, both before and after Ripert took the helm. As we approached the final savory course, we also ran out of wine. The sommelier countered our choice of wines with the suggestion that the next course would go well with a red wine. Actually, it could have gone with either a choice of red or whites, but following our other wines, red was really the better choice for contrast. My bouillabaise comment was just a comment at large and not a criticism. I also sensed that you enjoyed most of your meal very much and that with better, or should I say proper, service, you would have come away pleased. I don't know how close the tables are these days. We travel a bit and use most of our discretionary funds to dine when we are traveling, although le Bernardin has been on our short list for a return visit for some time. I have good memories of it.

Can one call a cab in NYC? I did it once in 1973. I haven't done it since. Can one still do that. I looked for taxi companies in the yellow pages, but it seemed that all I found were car services, liveries and limousine services listed under "taxis." If it can be done, it seems to be unusual. NYC is a peculiar place that way. Le Bernardin is not a fish house in the sense that it ever serves simple unsauced seafood. To cook simple fish or seafood with simple sauce and garnish that compliments the fish rather than with an overly assertive sauces spices or preparation, not only requires considerably greater talent and skills, but a much higher quality of raw product to start with. To imply otherwise, is to only state that you don't understand what restaurants such as le Bernardin are trying to accomplish, not that they fail to to achieve their aim. As such it's little more than a statement of subjective taste and provides no basis for understanding any post to which it serves as an introduction.

Fascinating to hear that about Galician cooking. I don't recall coming across any dishes with chocolate in my short stay in Galicia. As I recall, we ate mostly seafood and drank Albariño except for the odd goat and Godello in our diet. As for rabbit and chocolate, I had a fantastic stew of wild hare with dark chocolate in the Loire.

A leg of the lamb I had in Burgos was more of a snack for one person, albeit a very tasty snack.

My understanding is that the Serrano ham that's currently being imported from Spain, is from pork that was raised and slaughtered in Denmark and cured as ham in Spain. I don't have any substantiation at hand, but I also haven't found any information to counter that understanding.

Laguiole is a town in southwestern central France. It's home to Michel Bras and his inn. (Bras is one of the most highly regarded chefs in France.) They make knives there and every factory in town is entitled to call their knives "Laguiole." There's a difference in quality from one shop to another and not all parts need to be entirely fabricated in the town to allow "Laguiole to be stamped on the product. As far as I know, only "Forge de Laguiole" products are made entirely in the town and many think they are the best. The factory, designed by Philippe Starck, sits just outside town on the way to Michel Bras. Prices of models vary considerably according to detail and materials. Fifteen dollars is cheap however.

As far back as I can remember, Lyon has been known as a city with good food. It hasn't always had the finest restaurants in France or the most well known or repsected temples of haute cuisine, but one usually ate well in Lyon, if not lightly. Tripe in all forms are local specialties. Lyon is also known for its sausages. The indoor Halles de Lyon are a bit less picturesque than the open market on the quay, but it's a wonderful market and has been the subject of several posts in the forum.

Well as abstract advice, I will agree with your point. In our case we have both French and American friends in the Languedoc and they have friends with whom we socialize when we are there and we have our daughter's in-laws in Brittany. Thus we not only get to eat in people's homes, but cook there and shop in the local markets as well. At the same time, we have a professional need to meet as many people in the business of catering to tourists as we can. So that's not a problem either, although it should be noted that chambre d'hote people are also in that same business. It's just the scale that's different.

Strange, as I recall, le Bernardin had a pretty extensive list of red wines--for a fish place. I'd be very disappointed to get overcooked shrimp at le Bernardin. However, I'd also not expect to get a bouillabaisse in New York, or in a haute cuisine restaurant in any city that resembled the original dish in Marseille or anywhere along the Mediterannean coast of France.

I've generally found the kitchen at Blue Hill willing to make substitutions to the set tasting menu to accommodate individual tastes and interests as well as allergies. I've had the tasting menu while others at my table have had some unusual or large numbers of food aversions catered to. In the end, taste in food is very subjective. I hope you're glad you've satisfied your curiosity about the restaurant at least. Sam's question is a good one. Many diners are not pleased to just satisfy their curiosity. If you can articulate your displeasure, it may help others avoid disappointment. It does a restaurant little good to attract diners who will not like the food. When one person dislikes a meal and another likes it, it may have more to do with personal tastes and preferences than with understanding. I also find it interesting to know what restaurants a diner hold in high regard when I read his appraisal of a restaurant, although many diners have a broad range of appreciations.

As I understand it, the Fonz jumped the shark to provide some interest in the show. Can we say that Vongerichten opening a new restaurant is going to spark some interest in Jean Georges or any of his other restaurants? Is there a parallel? Does it spark renewed interest in the chef? Does it keep his name in the news and is that helpful?

I trust I was clear that M. Doubesky never pushed his product at Saint Gayrand, his distillery. Although his prices were high, his product was superb. There was no pressure to buy. I was never sure if he kept opening bottles and producing new glasses out of pride in his work, or to seduce us into staying for the company. I don't know what his profit margin is, but it couldn't be much on our purchase. My memory of the afternoon was one of leaving a table the size of a cardtable absolutely full of dirty brandy snifters. It was a thoroughly hospitable afternoon, but not one for abstainers or even those who drank moderately.

Saturday night at nine o'clock, the place was full and there was a two hour wait. We were only prepared to stay at the bar for no longer than one hour on an empty stomach. I can't offer more of a report than that it looked as if it had been there forever. It looked like a well worn local bar with food. At least I know they got that part right.

There seem to be several Asador Tierra Arandas in Madrid. Is this your favorite for special reason, or just the most convenient? This must be the lamb I had in Burgos. It would be hard to imagine there is any that is much better. In our case, a half lamb fit on a large plate, or to be more honestly believable a small platter. Just enough for two after a generous lobster rice dish. Both the rice and the lamb were split between the two of us. It was a Sunday lunch at the rather upscale but unstarred Landa Palace. The was one of the early clues we had about the relevance of stars when dining in Spain. I forget who suggested we stop here for the lamb, but it was a suggestion we were happy we listened to and one we've passed on, although Victor may have better places to recommend in that area. Maybe next time I'm in Burgos I'll take the detour south to Aranda de Duero. Are you sure the holes and cracks are necessarily a part of a great flan? A poorly calibrated oven serendipitously taught us to bake flan at a lower temperature for a longer time and the result was an exceptionally smooth custurd with no air bubbles. It may be that the cracks and holes are a good sign only in that they're some assurance you're not getting a factory produced flan supplied to the restaurant. At any rate my mouth is watering at the mention of the lamb and the flan.

In all fairness to all, what I tried to express was the opinion not that it was inappropriate in General Foods, but that it would be more appropriate in the France forum. I will move it as soon as I feel everyone who Lucy wanted to see it here, has had that chance. There have, over a period of time, been several messages about markets in Lyon posted in the France forum and this lovely photo essay would be a wonderful accompaniment and a service to those who have read those posts in the past, or who will read them someday. I don't really want to discuss the appropriateness of where to post and thus dilute this thread, but the France forum hasn't been all about what's going on, and where to go what to do or even focused solely on things mainly of interest to tourists.

The least expensive menu these days at le Vieux Pont is 26 euros. I wonder if the daughters were in charge of the place twenty years ago. I can't remember the year we were first there. I know it was before they built the little hotel on the other side of the little river. The Aveyron is a lovely area. I'm not sure of the difference between a gite and a chambre d'hote, but I sense a gite is more of a rental for some period of at least a week, where one sets up housekeeping and the latter is more of an overnight place, or shorter term accommodation. I'm sure there's overlap and some same sense of communion with the region.

Don't get me started on buerre fermier from Brittany. It can be magnificent. We've had some that makes the best French commerical brands taste like mediocre margarine. We've also experienced those small town outdoor dinners with friends in the Bas Languedoc, albeit with more prosaic bands. My only expereince with chambres d'hotes however, is of seeing one whose owner we met by going to his excellent artisanal distillery. We didn't get to see his home until we had the full tour of his computer graphics studio. His specialty was the design of labels for truncated cone packaging as one commonly sees on dairy products--yogurt, cottage cheese, etc. That tour only came after tasting all of his many eaux-de-vie. With each taste came lectures about distilling and the appreciation of fine eaux-de-vie. All of this in slow patient French. After the tasting came more blind tasting games to see which flavors we could distinguish. We did fairly well, by the way, with Mrs. B doing a bit better than I. It was mid afternoon when we started and pitch black when we stumbled out of the distillery into the studio. His home, we discovered when we finally got there and met his wife--who was a bit less garrulous than he, a small clue to his interest in capturing strangers for conversation perhaps--was quite large and upscale if a bit over decorated. I don't recall if it was his bath or the guest bath that had a large sunken tub. I suspect we would have stayed for the night had he also operated a table d'hote. It was a long way to the nearest restaurant and we already had reservations at a hotel some distance away. We were also starving and needed some solid food after a bellyful of spirits. He was a charming man. An early dinner and a "tour" of the distillery late in the evening with a comfortable bed at hand would have been nice.

Fascinating, as we'd have much the same feeling. Oddly enough the small hotels we've enjoyed the most are those where we've had the chance to get to know the proprietors just a bit and where there exists a personal warmth that comes from the owners. Yet I'd fear not being comfortable in someone's home and worse yet, potentially aware they'd sense that. Mostly, I'd fear being captive of someone who's at best a middling cook and wondering if there wasn't a professional kitchen nearby where I should have eaten should I choose a table d'hote. I suppose it's that I think of France as the one country where cooking has risen to the most professional. Restaurants in the US frequently tout themselves as offering home cooking. I've never witnessed that claim in France. Apparently, my fears may not be well founded if Margaret's experiences have been good enough to make her a fan of chambre d'hotes and a repeat user.

Let me add that I've also found Michelin eager to annoint restaurants having more creative chefs, with a star. Creativity seems to get more attention that just quality cooking.

This is an excellent point. Way offtopic in this thread as it's not so much the case in Spain as in the states, so I won't pursue it here and trust others won't either. The more international aspect of your post is very relevent in Spain, perhaps even moreso there than in most countries and particularly the US. Value is an important part of most of our considerations when dining out and value cannot be measured as price divided by the number of stars. The problem with Michelin is that one has no other way to compare restaurants, so, not unreasonably, many of us do seem to find that a two star restaurant at the price of a one star nearby, seems to be the better buy. That's what makes good thoughtful reviews more meaningful than ratings and what makes a site such as eGullet useful. Diners also need to understand that even in a guide that claims to pay most attention to the food, the decor, service, elegance and comfort of a restaurant are going to affect the stars it earns. They will also affect the pleasure of dining in a restaurant. Sophisticated diners need to process all this in their minds.

GaultMillau almost seemed as if it was going out of business last year. The guide appeared to be in trouble and the old GaultMillau magazine ceased publication. Then the Nouuveau GaultMillau arrived on the stands. I only know what I see in public about this. I have to wonder if the Michelin revelations are going to hurt Michelin's reputation and how that may affect the other restaurant guides in France. One of the things I've liked about the GaultMillau magazine, is that in addition to restaurants, the magazine has featured and compared food stuffs such as chocolates, wine, and andouilles with comparative ratings and texts. Most of that is rather academic to me, as I'm not in a position to buy and use most of the products with any regularity however.

vmilor, I wonder if many people don't attach some sort of price heirarchy relative to the Michelin stars. Many are willing to spend morefor a three star than a one star and less yet, for a restaurant without stars. Since Michelin tends to favor cooking over the raw product, restaurants with simple presentations of superb seafood will suffer in comparison to those with fancier presentations, even if the raw materials are a bit less pristine. I don't mean to imply that the Michelin inspectors don't appreciate quality ingredients, just that by themselves they are not enough. This may be one of the many reasons many are finding Spanish restaurants undervalued in the Guia Roja. (Not the only one, however.)

For clarification, AD/NY is Alain Ducasse New York and situated in the Essex House. AD/PA is Alain Ducasse at the Plaza Athenee in Paris.

Apparently milk, butter and yogurt freeze just fine, but most experts agree that heavy cream and sour cream do not freeze well. The University of Minnesota Extension Service seems to be one source that disagrees, at least to some extent. At least this implies some hope for using the creme fraiche in recipes and sauces. It may depend on the intended use after thawing. I don't know why, or if, creme fraiche would go bad. I guess the trick would be to keep other organisms out of the jar. I think I've seen sour cream develop mold.

I assume this whole think with the cling wrap is new technology. I'm an old technology guy. I always line a terrine with a thin layer of pork fat. Some confusion lies in the fact that the earthenware mold and meat loaf are both called a terrine. You could use a thick layer, but no one would eat it and it would be a waste. I've also never made an all veal pate/terrine. In fact, I don't think I've ever made a meat terrine that wasn't at least half pork (if you include the pork fat). You could use all veal but I don't think it would be as interesting tasting. There's also the matter of the fat in the pate. I've seen recipes that call for as much fat as lean meat. That's probably too much for modern tastes, but I like to use the leanest pork I can find and add in minced fat back. I haven't made a pate in a while, but I seem to recall fat being about a third of the weight was best for me. I like to weigh it down as it cools, but be careful not to be too zealous and squeeze out the fat and juices. You just want to compact the meat a little to improve the texture.