Distillery history

[lostmyshape]

egullet made me interested in rye whiskey, and looking into its history i found that it used to be called Pennsylvania whiskey or Monongahela whiskey. well, i live about 1.5 miles from the Mon (as we call it here in Pittsburgh), but i couldn't recall ever hearing about whiskey being distilled here. so i did a little more research and found that pre-prohibition there were dozens of distilleries on the Mon river and the Allegheny river, all producing rye whiskey.

but they all are gone now. most didn't make it past prohibition, but those that did were bought up by big bourbon distilleries in the 1960's and moved south. so, why couldn't they survive in PA? and why aren't there any here now? if rye is really making a comeback (as many here beleive), why don't we all start a place on the mon to make genuine, 100% real Old Monongahela Whiskey?

and why aren't there more distilleries in the US? i recently read that there are around 60 distilleries in this country. why so few? especially compared to the, like, 7,000 microbreweries (we have 8-10 here in Pittsburgh alone... although this is a beer-drinking town)?

i realize that permits and taxes for this business are insane, but i've also read that profit margins can be high. is this an untapped market? if cocktail culture is really coming back in the US, is distilling ripe for expansion?

Noah (dreaming of quitting my job and making whiskey... and gin... and genever... and...)

[lostmyshape]

giving my thread on last bump to see if any historians might bite. thanks.

[Splificator]

giving my thread on last bump to see if any historians might bite.  thanks.

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Noah--

The problem is this is a huge topic with a lot of questions that aren't amenable to the kind of answers one has time for during quick breaks from the working day.

Monongahela rye made it until the 1980s, when National Distillers broke up and Jim Beam got Old Overholt, moving production to kentucky. Why did this happen? I guess the short answer would be Kentucky valued its whiskey industry and Pennsylvania didn't. I don't know why that is.

There are many microdistilleries starting all around the country these days, but for major brands the US doesn't need a lot of distilleries, particularly if they're the size of Beam's Clermont one, which is unbelievably huge (and still manages to make some fine whiskey--Booker's is a case in point).

In short--don't quit your job, but do make whiskey and genever.

[lostmyshape]

thanks for the reply, dave. it's been bugging me since i came across this website (beware: annoying auto-music) about visiting old distilleries in PA. seems like they were everywhere, and now? all gone.

any ideas why the government makes it so hard to distill your own booze? pressure from the big guys (like beam) to keep out competition? or just leftover temperance laws?

i beleive some states are creating a new "craft distilling" category that has less regulations, like micro-brewing. is this true?

i'm sure some of you have friends who do a little home-distilling. is this an expensive hobby? probably not a good idea in a small, city apartment, huh?

and i'm always looking for an excuse to quit my job... don't have the guts to do it, though.

Edited January 26, 2006 by lostmyshape (log)

[rlibkind]

any ideas why the government makes it so hard to distill your own booze?  pressure from the big guys (like beam) to keep out competition?  or just leftover temperance laws?

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I'm no expert on the subject, but heavy government involvement in the industry dates back to the late 18th century, in the first decade following independence, when Washington and Alexander Hamilton imposed an excise tax on whiskey. That was the proximate (though hardly the only) cause of the so-called Whiskey Rebellion in southwestern Pennsylvania in 1794.

[mbrowley]

Noah ~

First off, home distilling is not a particularly expensive hobby; one can build a copper pot still or retrofit a water-heater reflux still for under $250, less than some of the fancier homebrew set-ups. Unless, of course, you get caught. Then, it can be very expensive, depending on who's busted you. Some - mostly local - law enforcement agencies just can't be bothered and may, at most, write a citation and issue a fine. Others take such off-books distilling very seriously and will come down on you with all the weight they muster.

That being said, David's right; there are a few microdistilleries popping up here and there, but nowhere near the number of brewpubs and microbreweries. A few years back Bart Stupak (D-Michigan) presented a bill before the 107th Congress (H.R. 3249) that would have decriminalized home distilling. The bill, not surprisingly, failed. The congressman was a little ahead of his time; Federal, state and local laws and regulations continue to make microdistilleries an expensive and time-consuming proposal.

But some folks are doing it - Dogfish Head in Rehoboth Beach, DE is distilling some very interesting things these days; a vodka, for instance, rum and distiller Mike Gerhart's about to roll out a new iteration of their gin. Clear Creek Distillery puts out some sublime brandies and Chuck Miller's Virginia Lightning from Belmont Farms is sheer corn whiskey moonshine in everything but name. Get a hold of some of Anchor's whiskeys while you're at it.

I'm eagerly anticipating the day when good American microdistilleries are as common as good microbreweries.

There is an enormous groundswell of interest in spirits, licit and illicit and it goes hand-in-glove with a renewed interest people have in knowing where their food comes from and what it’s made of (vide the success of artisanal cheeses and breads, heirloom produce, organic meats, etc.).

The impression I've gotten over the last two years traveling around the US is that off-the-radar distilling (whether you call it home-, folk-, artisan or small batch distilling) is so prevalent that there's not a single patch of settled land in the US and Canada that's not home to clandestine distillers, whether you measure the output in just a few liters a year or by the vanload. Home distilling is much more prevalent now than thirty years ago when most writers were prematurely keening over the death of local whiskeys and mountain moonshine.

Unlike the rotgut makers of old who sold their makings and who may have added mule chop, mill refuse, granulated sugar, antifreeze, chicken excrement (the nitrogen’s good for a mash), carbide and lye to a batch of “pure corn likker,” this new crowd of distillers care very much what goes into the pot because they are the ones drinking it.

The new twist is that almost none of those I interviewed is selling their wares. These distillers are hobbyists and take a BIG cue from the homebrew mindset; openness, sharing, comparing notes, trading information and trying continually to make a better product and to eke out a little more efficiency from their stills. A vastly different mindset from the moonshiners you'd find even ten years ago. Selling is beside the point with this crowd. A lot of them seem to have gotten into distilling from some earlier interest in brewing and winemaking.

It seems to me that small batch distilling is following a roughly parallel path to that blazed by microbreweries in the 1980's and 90's. Yes, beer is a gateway beverage.

Hobbyists are beginning to share more information, some laws are loosening under the lobbying efforts of small (would-be) distillers. Just as big brewing conglomerates weren't thrilled with upstart small brewing companies such as Weeping Radish and Boulevard Brewing Co., the major distilleries don't have much reason to welcome would-be competitors.

Any licensed distillers out there care to comment?

There are procedures in place for applying for commercial permits to distill (unlike beer and wine, not one drop of distilled alcohol is legal without permits in the US). It takes time and money, but if you are interested in the procedures, I'd first contact Bill Owens (there's that whiff of hops again) at the American Distilling institute (www.distilling.com) and then, if you're serious about continuing with a commercial distillery, your local BATT office.

And, once all that’s said and done, you be sure to track me down. I am a friend to distillers everywhere and an absolute sucker for a borrel of good genever.

Matthew

Matthew B. Rowley

thanks for the reply, dave.  it's been bugging me since i came across this website (beware: annoying auto-music) about visiting old distilleries in PA.  seems like they were everywhere, and now?  all gone.

any ideas why the government makes it so hard to distill your own booze?  pressure from the big guys (like beam) to keep out competition?  or just leftover temperance laws?

i beleive some states are creating a new "craft distilling" category that has less regulations, like micro-brewing.  is this true?

i'm sure some of you have friends who do a little home-distilling.  is this an expensive hobby?  probably not a good idea in a small, city apartment, huh?

and i'm always looking for an excuse to quit my job... don't have the guts to do it, though.

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[WHT]

Go to www.batf.gov they have a whole section on the subject. It is a quick read but I will try and summarize it. You need a separate secure building first of all. Then all the paperwork and regulations coupled with the tax implications make it hard to do for most people. Owning a still is a federal crime if it is not licensed by BATF and the IRS.

As some people have mentioned you can build one out of common items. But it takes five gallons of mash to make 1 gallon of product. Wine making on the other hand gives about four and a half gallons for the initial five. Distilling is also a smelly process from start to end. A major reason people get caught is you can’t hide the smell.

Edited January 26, 2006 by WHT (log)

[lostmyshape]

Noah ~

First off, home distilling is not a particularly expensive hobby...  I am a friend to distillers everywhere and an absolute sucker for a borrel of good genever.

Matthew

wow, matthew... thank you for that detailed reply. that's a lot to think about.

just read an article that someone here in pittsburgh won a $160k grant from the state for running studies for the feasibility of distilling PA potatoes into vodka. gives the farmers business and creates a new industry here in town. interesting idea... probably more realistic from a business profitability standpoint than making and selling genever.

thanks for the link, WHT. although wine doesn't really interest me, i've though about brewing beer. but so many breweries do it sooo well. i just decided it was too much work when i could walk down the street to an awesome six-pack shop and choose from almost 1,000 beers. on the other hand, i can only get 1 type of genever and 2 types of rye (both beam products) at the PA state store. seems like a market that could explode!

plus, there's so much romance in moonshining.

retrofit a "water-heater reflux still," huh? i, i mean, my friend might need to PM you.

[graphicguru]

:Get a hold of some of Anchor's whiskeys while you're at it

Where could I find this in NY?