Cheeses of Spain & Portugal

[Eric_Malson]

Afuega'l Pitu in Spanish means something like, "This bad-ass cheese is going to burn your gullet when you eat it." Actually I've read that it means "fire in your gut" -- for real. It's a raw cow's milk cheese I can't remember from which region (Hell?).

Fat Guy, I'm so glad there's another Afuega 'l pitu fan around--it's been one of my favorite cheeses for years, and was thrilled a couple of years ago to realize you can find it in NYC with some regularity.

I have read that same hypothesis as to the origin of its name in cheese books, and can tell you that it's completely incorrect. They got the meaning of both words in the name wrong.....afuega 'l pitu (which is from Asturias, as madrileño pointed out) is bable, the Asturian dialect (somewhere between Portuguese and Castellano). "Afuega" is the bable equivalent of the Castellano "ahogar", which means "to choke" or "to drown", and "pitu" is bable for chicken or rooster. "Afuega 'l pitu" can, therefore be translated loosely as "chokes the chicken" (I love that!), presumably because chickens can't eat it without choking to death (due to its dry-yet-gummy texture....apparently chickens are so stupid they'll eat anything, even if it kills them). I've spent a LOT of time in Asturias and got this from one of my Asturiano friends.

Edited March 9, 2003 by Eric_Malson (log)

[wingding]

I haven't been to Spain,but am always on the lookout for different Spanish[and Portuguese]cheeses in New York.My favorite,so far has been Suspiri di Cabra[whisper of goat],a semisoft cheese that appeared at Murrays' last year.Also Azeito from Portugal.In N.Y.,Fairway and Murrays' keep bringing in new and different cheeses from Spain,so stay tuned.Or maybe save up for a plane ticket...

[Eric_Malson]

My favorite,so far has been Suspiri di Cabra[whisper of goat],a semisoft cheese that appeared at Murrays' last year.Also Azeito from Portugal.

I've never tried the Suspiri de cabra you mention...I must look for it.

I'm assuming the second cheese you mention is queijo de Azeitão, a really spectacular Portuguese cheese. For my money, the big winner of Portuguese cheeses is queijo da Serra, from the Serra de Estrela mountains. It's sometimes a bit hard to find, and I've yet to try a really good one here (and it tends to be too expensive--a problem that the queijo de Azeitão shares--compounded by the fact that it's not really practical to buy slices....one pretty much needs to buy a whole wheel--about 3 pounds). But if you can find a good ripe one--a really ripe queijo da Serra should run all over the plate--grab it. You won't be disappointed!

Edited March 10, 2003 by Eric_Malson (log)

[Aquitaine]

I have begun research on the British preserved called damson (plum) cheese and am looking for any information you might have regarding fruit *cheeses* in general. I understand that it is typically a farmhouse tradition and may generally have gone by the wayside. Damson cheese is similar to membrillo (Spanish) and cotignac (French) quince paste, in that it is sort of a fruit preserve cooked long enough to dry firmly and be cut into slices.

I've started other threads related to this topic:

• In the UK forum: Fruit cheese / Damson cheese, Seeking info: UK tradition -- http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?act=ST...f=9&t=18619&st=
  
• In the Latin American forum: http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?act=ST...T&f=42&t=18627&
  
• In the France forum: Cotignac / quince paste, Research / traditions -- http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?act=ST...T&f=10&t=18630&
  
• In the Italy forum: Fruit *cheese* / Quince paste / Cotognata, Research / traditions -- http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?act=ST...T&f=39&t=18623&
  

The cookbook author Joyce Goldstein writes:

Wine and Cheese Pairing…Cotognata, quince paste infused with cinnamon or citron, is a specialty of Apulia, but you can find many Spanish imports as well, sold under the name membrillo. Apulian pear, quince, and fig pastes from the Azienda Agricola Marzano in San Pietro in Vernotico, near Brindisi, are made from only fruit, sugar, and pectin, and they are delicious. [Goldstein, Joyce Esersky. Enoteca: Simple, Delicious Recipes in the Italian Wine Bar Tradition. San Francisco: Chronicle Books, c2001. ISBN 0811828255.]

I know lots about the French and Italian quince pastes -- molded into beautiful forms in Sicily -- and next to nothing about other fruit pastes... Would like to learn more about artisanal membrillo, historical traditions, regional and social variations... My apologies for not knowing Spanish, except for what I can guess from French and Italian...My initial questions are these:

• What is the Spanish word or phrase for this item, i.e., generic (*dulce de xxxx*)? In Latin America fruit pastes seem to be called *ate de xxxx*... Is there a difference in meaning?
  
• Is membrillo now just upscale consumer’s find, or do you know of a tradition of farmhouse fruit pastes?
  
• When you buy a *good* version, is membrillo usually sold in a box or by the slab?
  
• Do you know of artisanal sources?
  
• Regional variants (e.g., spiced, citron or lemon peel added, etc....)
  
• Historical sources? [other than the "Libre de Totes Maneres de Confits," or the "Manuscrito Anonimo"]
  
• What do you know about Spanish fruit pastes made with other fruit?
  
• Is membrillo popular in Portugal, and what is it called if not membrillo?
  
• Cheese: Most commonly mentioned as an accompaniment to Manchego and sometimes to queso blanco or other fresh cheeses. Any thoughts?
  
• Have you heard the expression "Romeo and Juliet" in terms of the pairing of membrillo and queso blanco (or perhaps another fruit paste, such as guava, and another cheese]?
  
• Have you ever seen molds used to make quince paste?
  
• Ever hear of it in context of the Medieval concept of *epices de chambre* -- presented to royalty in an elaborate box...
  
• Any thoughts about other sources of information about this? I am wearing out the pages of books in the New York Public Library and culinary libraries around me...
  

Thanks in advance!

Edited March 21, 2003 by Aquitaine (log)

[Bux]

Dulce de xxxxx

Pasta de xxxxx

Just saw some dulce de naranja in a shop window in Madrid. It was an upscale shop (Lhardy to be exact) and the dulce de naranja appeared to be homemade. First day here, so we're jet lagged, but I'll keep an eye out for this stuff. In Puertop Rico, pasta de guayaba (guava) is popular. It's very sweet and usually eaten with a fresh white cheese.

[Chloe]

See also the marmalade topic at http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?act=ST...17063&hl=quince

Quince paste/cheese is part of the "national heritage" in Portugal, where it is still commonly made at home.

There are various recipes for making quince cheese lighter or darker + modern less strenuous recipes. When home-made, it is normally stored in bowls covered with greaseproof paper; there are often set out to dry in the sun. There is also a traditional recipe for little "bricks" of quince cheese.

Fruit (and other) cheeses are also made with bananas (in Madeira), pears, pumpkins, tomatoes, apples, peaches, apricots, potatoes, and carrots.

Chloe

Portugal

[Aquitaine]

Thanks, Bux and Vanessa.

Bux -- Dulce de naranja is pretty unusual, I think. ....I just came it for the first time in a book I was checking into at the Brooklyn Public Library. I can't for the life of me put my hands on the pages at the moment, but stay tuned...

Next time you pass the upscale shop, if you think of it, please check for me whether it is sold in a tub or in a "brick," as Vanessa writes.

Vanessa -- Any chance of recipes or referrals to recipes for the pastes made with the other fruits? (As for the tomato, I've seen only a couple of southern-French recipes -- e.g., Michel Bras -- and Steven Raichlen's recipe for something from Santo Domingo which I don't think is actually made into a paste...) Also, in Portugal are these all typically eaten with cheese, or only some flavors, or is it idiosyncratic? Particular cheeses favored (e.g., mild, fresh, young "cream" cheeses?) Does stuff made in Madeira vary considerably from other regions? (And, pardon my ignorance, but is Madeira akin to Paris for France and London for England, or is that Lisbon or another city, i.e., the cosmopolitan center of the country?

Dulce de membrillo / dulce de bimbrio (Spanish for quince, or at least one word for it) appears also to be a Sephardic treat. Several Sephardic cookbooks I've looked at recently point this out. The example I last found is from Rabbi Robert Sternberg, who writes:

"Dulce de bimbrio originated as a Sephardic specialty; it traces its origin back to Spain. It was most likely brought by conversos (Jewish converts to Catholicism) to the Spanish colonies in the Americas. Many conversos settled in these colonies, particularly in Mexico and the Caribbean islands, to escape the Inquisition, which was less oppressive there than it was in Spain itself. Some of these conversos practiced Judaism in secret.

The dulces (sweets) can be made with many different kinds of fruits. Quinces (bimbrios) were particularly popular in Spain because the large amount of pectin in the fruit aided in its jelling. But bitter oranges, apricots, and apples were also used to prepare this sweet. In the tropical climates of the Caribbean islands and Latin America, fruits like guayas and mangoes grew in abundance and were readily used to prepare dulces by Jewish cooks. Today, jellied pastes made of these fruits (dulce de membrillo and dulce de guyaba) are commonly found throughout Mexico, Puerto Rico, Cuba, and other Latin American countries. The guava is especially loved because it resembles quince but is much sweeter and has a heady, "roselike" aroma.

This sweet was also brought to the countries of the Ottoman Empire by Sephardic Jews and today is popular in many Middle Eastern countries....

....Dulce de Sharope (Sweet Lemon Confection) -- This unusual confection comes out of a body of recipes prepared in Turkish and Greek homes that was adopted by Sephardic Jews when they settled in the Ottoman Empire. There is an art to the preparation and presentation of this type of dulce. Made from every kind of fruit that grows in the Mediterranean, the dulces are used to extend hospitality to special guests...."-- Sternberg, Robert. The Sephardic Kitchen: The Healthful Food and Rich Culture of the Mediterranean Jews. New York: HarperCollinsPublishers, c1996. -- pages 292-293

I believe these dulces (what is the Spanish plural?) are VERY much related to the glyko / spoon sweets of Greece, Armenia, etc.

As for "ancient" history of quince marmelade, Andrew Dalby writes:

…The old harbour city of Cydonia, later Khania, in western Crete, had two significant exports. The quince (Cydonia vulgaris), the aromatic apple-like fruit called by the Romans cotoneum, is known in Greek literature from the sixth century BC. The Latin name derives, by way of an intermediary language, from Greek kydonion (melon), literally 'apple of Cydonia'. Using the Greek name, Calpurnius Siculus calls them cerea Cydonia sub tenul lana ‘quinces, waxy beneath their soft down' (Eclogues 2. 91). Quince orchards and nurseries of Roman date have been identified in the fields around Cydonia.... [then Dalby writes a short bit about Roman quince wine...]

...In later times the most widespread use for this fruit has been in what the Byzantine Greeks called kydonaton 'quince paste, marmalade', still popular in several Mediterranean countries. The first recipes for this go back only to the sixth century AD, but it is a linear descendant of quince honey, melomeli, for which a recipe follows:

Remove the seeds from quinces and pack them as tightly as possible into a jar that is then filled with honey. It is ready to use after a year. It tastes like honey wine, and has the same dietary effects. (Dioscorides, 5. 21) -- Dalby, Andrew. Empire of Pleasures. London; New York: Routledge, 2000. pages 152-153....

I've been going quote-happy, I'm afraid, but others have written such interesting stuff and I get excited when I read it and want to share! I posted something about quince on the marmalade thread that you referred me to, Vanessa. Thanks for that, too....

The decline in popularity of the quince coincided with the fall in price of sugar and the increase in demand for jam by the British public towards the end of the 19th century, if I remember my reading...the introduction of a commercial pectin making it possible to preserve all sorts of other fruits without having either to first create an apple pectin stock or to find large numbers of quince to throw into the pot -- either of which had traditionally been used as means of ensuring a gel (since many fruits and berries are too low in pectin to gel)....

Edited March 24, 2003 by Aquitaine (log)

[Vanessa]

Aquitaine - you seem to have confused Vanessa & Chloe. A Freudian slip?

v

[Aquitaine]

Too many pots (aka threads) on the fire -- going back and forth between marmelade and membrillo threads. (I can't even imagine being in a professional kitchen!). Sorry, Vanessa. Even sorrier, Chloe....but thanks everyone!

[Chloe]

To start with:

Perada - Pear Cheese

1.5 kg pears

1.250 kg (castor) sugar

2 dl water

Cook the pears whole unpeeled, peel when still slightly warm and sieve the pulp. Cook the sugar and water to "ponto de fio" (103 centigrade, 29 Baumé) and add the pear. Continue to cook, stirring, to "ponto de estrada" (110 centigrade, 37 Baumé). Fill bowls, cover them with gauze and let the perada dry in the sun. Once dry, cover with greaseproof paper or cellophane.

There'll be more when I have a bit more time!

Chloe

Portugal

[Aquitaine]

Thank you, oh, thank you, Chloe!

[Eric_Malson]

My initial questions are these:

• What is the Spanish word or phrase for this item, i.e., generic (*dulce de xxxx*)?  In Latin America fruit pastes seem to be called *ate de xxxx*...  Is there a difference in meaning?
  
• Is membrillo now just upscale consumer’s find, or do you know of a tradition of farmhouse fruit pastes?
  
• When you buy a *good* version, is membrillo usually sold in a box or by the slab?
  
• Do you know of artisanal sources?
  
• Regional variants (e.g., spiced, citron or lemon peel added, etc....)
  
• Historical sources? [other than the "Libre de Totes Maneres de Confits," or the "Manuscrito Anonimo"]
  
• What do you know about Spanish fruit pastes made with other fruit?
  
• Is membrillo popular in Portugal, and what is it called if not membrillo?
  
• Cheese: Most commonly mentioned as an accompaniment to Manchego and sometimes to queso blanco or other fresh cheeses. Any thoughts?
  
• Have you heard the expression "Romeo and Juliet" in terms of the pairing of membrillo and queso blanco (or perhaps another fruit paste, such as guava, and another cheese]?
  
• Have you ever seen molds used to make quince paste?
  
• Ever hear of it in context of the Medieval concept of *epices de chambre* -- presented to royalty in an elaborate box...
  
• Any thoughts about other sources of information about this? I am wearing out the pages of books in the New York Public Library and culinary libraries around me...
  

Thanks in advance!

I didn't have the brain right now to scrutinize all the replies (too much opera rehearsal today), so forgive me if I repeat previously offered information. I don't know a whole lot about the topic, but I'll answer the questions I can.

As Chloe mentioned, quince paste is a traditional Portuguese foodstuff, although she neglected to mention the Portuguese name for it, which is marmelada (marmelo being the Portuguese name for "quince"). I only ever saw it in "bricks" over there, but I never actually sought it out. I tried membrillo on my very first trip to Spain almost 20 years ago and found it totally disgusting (this sort of thing is just not to my taste at all), so I knew to avoid it in the future! But I can assure you there's nothing "upscale consumer" about it in Spain (and Portugal)--it's quite traditional and can be found homemade in the smallest villages.

Consulting my copy of Cozinha Tradicional Portuguesa by Maria de Lourdes Modesto (a fantastic book), she reminds me of another whole class of dishes (desserts, mostly) made with "doce de abóbora chila (or, more commonly, xila)" which is a marmelade-type preserve made with a special kind of squash, the texture and flavor of which reminds me very much of spaghetti squash. This is usually spiced with cinnamon, at least in the Algarve region. Most unusual of all is her recipe from the Beira Litoral region for "nabada de Semide", which is a sweet, thick paste made from turnips, with a few almonds added. It is stored the same way Chloe describes in her pear cheese recipe (with the addition of a drop or two of brandy).

One of the best on-line sources for Spanish ingredients, La Española, has 3 or 4 different types of membrillo for sale. Their site is: La Española Meats and Spanish Foods

[Aquitaine]

Eric,

Most unusual of all is her recipe from the Beira Litoral region for "nabada de Semide", which is a sweet, thick paste made from turnips, with a few almonds added.

How interesting! I know about various candied squash dishes, and what we call pumpkin, but hadn't heard of turnips. Oh! I just discovered that Modesto's book is available in English translation (at the New York Public library, Humanities Research Division -- just love having the catalog online!), so I'll go check it out. Thanks for the heads-up. Also going over to La Española (new to me; thanks).

BTW, what opera? And what role do you play in it -- instrument (a la Schroeder?) or voice? It's so easy to forget about the enormous diversity of work people do; nice to be reminded that there is life outside office buildings!

Edited March 25, 2003 by Aquitaine (log)

[Elissa]

a moorish tradition too, no? much fish and meat grilled and cooked buried in sand with fruit preserves through out the algarve as well as iraq

have you seen the andalus cookbook adam balic posted?

Edited March 25, 2003 by lissome (log)

[Eric_Malson]

Oh! I just discovered that Modesto's book is available in English translation (at the New York Public library, Humanities Research Division -- just love having the catalog online!), so I'll go check it out. Thanks for the heads-up. Also going over to La Española (new to me; thanks).

BTW, what opera? And what role do you play in it -- instrument (a la Schroeder?) or voice? It's so easy to forget about the enormous diversity of work people do; nice to be reminded that there is life outside office buildings!

I play the piano, and the bulk of my work these days is in the opera. I'm playing for staging rehearsals for a company here in NYC that is doing Mozart's Così fan tutte.....such days get rather long and mentally exhausting.

I knew that cookbook was available in English, although I've never seen it in this country--just in Portugal. I'd be very curious to know how they translate "nabada de Semide" into English. I'm assuming Semide is the name of a town, and "nabada" obviously comes from "nabo", which is the Portuguese word for turnip. "Turnip paste"?? Doesn't quite sound right to me.... If you find out, please post it!

[Aquitaine]

Eric, shall do...Do I assume that you speak/read Portuguese? (So if I run into trouble trying to translate, I might be able to call on you for short spurts?)

[Chloe]

So if the launch of the Opera/Song Festival that I am helping to set up in Ponte de Lima is successful, I should get in touch with you, Eric?

The Maria de Lourdes Modesto book is great - I must get the English translation one, for reference purposes! I think it is one of the best selling books ever in Portugal.

Another recipe from Tesouros da Cozinha Tradicional Portuguesa (Selecções do Reader's Digest, 1984):

***

Bagulhada

"This is a very ancient sweet preserve, very easy to make, and which can make a lovely dessert"

2 kg grapes

1 kg sugar

250 g peeled quince

150 g shelled walnuts

Wash the grapes, remove their seeds, heat them gently in a pan without water and let them cook over a low heat for about 1 hour. Cut the quince into small pieces and add them to the grapes, together with the sugar. Stir until the sugar is completely dissolved and boil to "ponto de espadana" (117 centigrade, 40 Baumé). Then add the walnuts, remove from the heat and store in bowls or sealed jars.

***

Now I must get back to more lucrative translating

Chloe

Portugal

[Chloe]

One job sent off, so before the next one:

***

A Quince Cheese recipe

Marmelada

2 kg quince

1.2 kg sugar

Wash the quinces and, for the marmelada to remain white, cook them whole, without touching them with a knife, so that they don't go dark. When they are cold, peel them by hand, remove the seeds with your fingers and put them through the mouli-légume. Heat the sugar with just enough water to melt it and boil almost to "ponto de rebuçado" (125 centigrade). Add the quince pulp and stir with a wooden spoon until you can see the bottom of the pan. Remove from the heat and stir vigourously until it is cold. You can also make marmelada without cooking the quince pulp. Boil the sugar to a strong "ponto de areia" (141 centigrade), remove from the heat, add the quince pulp and stir until it is cold. Pour into bowl and let it dry until it has a hard surface. If you want to make red marmelada, cut the quince with a knife before cooking them.

***

There are all sorts of theories about making quince paste paler or darker. In this recipe the no-knife theory seems to be messed up by the mouli-legume part ...

Madeira is an island not very far from the Canaries.

I should have been more accurate about the potato sweet - it is made from sweet potatoes (white, not orange, I think).

Quince is cheese is commonly, but not exclusively, eaten with cheese in Portugal, but it tends to be the absolutely boring "Flemish ball" type.

Chloe

Portugal

[Eric_Malson]

So if the launch of the Opera/Song Festival that I am helping to set up in Ponte de Lima is successful, I should get in touch with you, Eric? 

The Maria de Lourdes Modesto book is great - I must get the English translation one, for reference purposes! I think it is one of the best selling books ever in Portugal.

Chloe, if you're setting up an Opera/Song festival in Ponte de Lima, I would hope you would definitely get in touch with me! I actually played a concert in Ponte de Lima 6 or 7 years ago (with a cellist) back when I was living in Lisboa and working with the Orquestra Metropolitana de Lisboa. And who knows in what capacities I might be of service? I know a LOT of repertoire and a lot of singers.....

My other favorite Portuguese cookbook is the 3-volume Cozinha Portuguesa by Maria Helena Tavares Crato (Colecção Habitat, Editorial Presença). However, I only have the first two volumes (not being a big sweets/dessert/preserves person)--the volume most likely to have things relevant to the topic at hand is the one that I lack. It's still widely available.....Chloe, if you run across it, perhaps you could have a look and see if there's anything that might be of interest to Aquitaine.

And Aquitaine, I do speak and read Portuguese, and am happy to be of help if I can. Although, since it seems that Chloe is a professional translator, she may be more helpful!

[Aquitaine]

Hey, Eric and Chloe --

1) Got to the library yesterday. This is Modesto's English version of the "nabada de Semida":

Modesto, Maria de Lourdes. Traditional Portuguese Cooking. Translation by Fernando Naylor. Lisboa: Verbo, 1989. .

page 166...

Turnip Sweet from Semide

Nabada de Semide [from the Beira Litoral area of Portugal]

1 kg turnips; about 500 g sugar; 50g almonds (skinned and grated); salt

Choose sweet, good quality turnips. Peel and cut them into slices. Boil in slightly salted water. Drain and leave the slices of turnip in cold water for 4 days, changing the water daily. In Semide, this is called 'dyeing' the turnip.

Drain the turnips, squeeze them hard in a cloth and crush with a mortar and pestle, taking care to remove all the fibres and any hard parts. Weigh this turnip purée and measure out the same amount of sugar. Normally, 1kg of turnips will give 500 g of purée.

Heat the sugar in a glassful of water and boil until the syrup begins to thread. Then add the turnip purée and grated almonds. Boil as if to make quince marmalade (i. e. until you can see through to the pan), stirring continuously.

Keep the sweet in bowls covered with greaseproof paper dipped in brandy.

I like that "dyeing the turnip" concept! (Is that an accurate translation, Eric?)

2) Thanks for the referral to the Tavares Crato cookbooik, Eric...

3) Chloe, thanks for these new recipes, particularly the "bagulhada" -- what does the name mean, literally? And is this regional or historical? Any preface to it (when you have *free time* -- doesn't sound likely, but...)

4) Exactly what do the following mean (just curious...):

"ponto de rebuçado" [point of _______]

"ponto de areia" [point of ________]

5) Am I missing something here, Chloe? I don't seem to recall seeing aything about this...

I should have been more accurate about the potato sweet - it is made from sweet potatoes (white, not orange, I think).

6) What are these theories about colors of quince marmelade, i.e., "no-knife" ?? I haven't run across that one.

7) What the Sam Hill does "Flemish ball" mean -- is that a Britishism?

Boy, you probably didn't think you'd raise more questions by your postings, did you, Chloe! When you have time....Thanks again!

Edited March 27, 2003 by Aquitaine (log)

[Chloe]

1) Got to the library yesterday. This is Modesto's English version of the "nabada de Semida":

Modesto, Maria de Lourdes. Traditional Portuguese Cooking. Translation by Fernando Naylor. Lisboa: Verbo, 1989. .

page 166...

Turnip Sweet from Semide

Nabada de Semide [from the Beira Litoral area of Portugal]

1 kg turnips; about 500 g sugar; 50g almonds (skinned and grated); salt

Choose sweet, good quality turnips. Peel and cut them into slices. Boil in slightly salted water. Drain and leave the slices of turnip in cold water for 4 days, changing the water daily. In Semide, this is called 'dyeing' the turnip.

Drain the turnips, squeeze them hard in a cloth and crush with a mortar and pestle, taking care to remove all the fibres and any hard parts. Weigh this turnip purée and measure out the same amount of sugar. Normally, 1kg of turnips will give 500 g of purée.

Heat the sugar in a glassful of water and boil until the syrup begins to thread. Then add the turnip purée and grated almonds. Boil as if to make quince marmalade (i. e. until you can see through to the pan), stirring continuously.

Keep the sweet in bowls covered with greaseproof paper dipped in brandy.

I like that "dyeing the turnip" concept! (Is that an accurate translation, Eric?)

The verb used in the original is "corar" which can be either blush/colour/dye or bleach (particularly bleaching damp clothes naturally in the sun) and I think the idea in this case is "bleach" rather than "dye".

I have some slightly different recipes for this Nabada - without almonds. And in one of the recipes a suggestion that if the turnips are julienned it can imitate the "chila" (curcurbita ficifolia, rather than the yellow spaghetti squash, which is cucurbita pepo) jam.

More later! Now I have to finish making supper

Chloe

[Eric_Malson]

4) Exactly what do the following mean (just curious...):

"ponto de rebuçado" [point of _______]

"ponto de areia" [point of ________]

I'll weigh in on this, because I find it interesting. "Rebuçado" means, literally, "wrapped up"--it's also the word for lollipop or those hard, sucky candies in general. "Areia" means "sand".

These are the (rather odd, if you ask me) Portuguese equivalents of the syrup/candy stages in cooking. "Ponto de rebuçado" corresponds to our "soft crack" stage, and "ponto de areia" is "hard ball" stage.

[Aquitaine]

Thanks, Eric and Chloe. Translation is a real challenge; every time I hear simultaneous translation in broadcasts from the United Nations, I'm amazed that anyone can do it!

I know there are words in English which can have two opposite meanings and depend on the context; just can't think of one at the moment -- nor what that class of words is called....

As for the "wrapped up" and "sand" -- there's probably some interesting etymology behind those terms. Or else some rather interesting culinary dish!

I've met only one person who has actually tasted the Italian sweet made from squash -- variously called cocuzzata and cucuzzata, among others. Apparently popular in Sicily, and to her, disgusting. I first heard of it through Elizabeth David's Italian Food, in which she quotes Apollinaire on a visit he made to Benedetto Orfei, a heresiarch living in Rome but who came from Alexandria:

“I visited Benedetto Orfei on a soft May afternoon.…He received me most civilly and served in my honour some old flagons of "vino santo" and certain Roman and Sicilian confections: walnuts preserved in honey, a sort of "fondant" paste perfumed with rose, mint and lemon, in which were buried pieces of candied fruit (orange peel, citron, pineapple), a very sweet quince paste called "cotognata," another paste called "cocuzzata," and a variety of wafers of peach paste known as "persicata."…He stretched out his right hand, seized a wafer of "persicata" which he rolled carefully, and swallowed in one mouthful.…” (Guillaume Apollinaire, L’hérésiarque & Cie. Paris, Stock, 1910)

(I've been going after persicata, too, you can bet! Appears to be a specialty of Lombardy, in particular.)

[Bux]

I can assure you there's nothing "upscale consumer" about it in Spain (and Portugal)--it's quite traditional and can be found homemade in the smallest villages.

For clarification, I didn't mean to imply that there was anything upscale about these pastes, only that one might be likely to find a higher quality, perhaps artisianal, version at an upscale shop in a the capital city. The opposite is also true -- that one is likley to find excellent artisianal quality food products in a rural area where homogenized industrial products have not taken hold of people's tastes.

When I got back to Lhardy, or rather the opportunity to pass by, but not the time to stop, they had changed the window display and were featuring dulce de membrillo rather then naranja. I noted that the rounded corners of the molded dulce and the embedded diagonal ribs indicated a commercial mold or perhaps even a large tin. Of course it could be a house made product in a cheap commercial plastic mold, but I suspected it was purchased by the store in a large tin.

For the record, during the next two weeks of our trip, all of the dulces I ran across were commercial and I did not see any that appeared to be artisanal. On the other hand, I also didn't haunt the types of shops that might make these by hand, if there is any tradition for that. Obviously they are made commerically and there are recipes for home preparation. I have no idea if the other range of hand made commercial product exists. Canned goods, as a general rule, are much more hightly regarded in Spain than I think they are in the US, or in France. I recall an article by Amanda Hesser in the NY Times about a tapas bar in Barcelona that specialized in tapas of canned goods. Before leaving Sevilla for out flights to NY, we bought some tins of hake roe, codfish roe and piquillo peppers to take home.

[Aquitaine]

Thanks for the legwork, Bux. I hope that the "check out the fruit pastes" mission didn't cramp your traveling style. (BTW, I remember that article by Hesser; at the time, I thought it was a pretty funny concept. Now I find myself wondering about splurging for tuna-stuffed piquillo peppers at Dean & DeLuca.... Cheaper than a flight to Spain!)

I appreciate your comment that:

"...one is likely to find excellent artisanal quality food products in a rural area where homogenized industrial products have not taken hold of people's tastes."

My fear is that those spots are becoming fewer and farther between....