Souffle Help

[JohnRichardson]

So last night I made my first souffle. Chocolate, to be specific. My recipe was basically this:

base:

3 egg yolks, 1/8 cup sugar, 1/8 cup flour tempered with 3/4 cup just-simmering milk simmered with a scraped vanilla bean, then 3 oz (should have been 4 but I can't divide by 2 :) of 70% chocolate and a splash of port. Let the base cool, then 3 egg whites and a pinch of salt whipped to soft peaks, folded in 1/3 thorougly to color the base, then gently folded in the rest. Into buttered & sugared dishes and into a 400 degF oven, which I lowered to 375 after about 3 minutes. At about 22 minutes I pulled them.

Tasty (aside from needing more chocolate), but I didn't get a lot of height. They crept up to about 1" over the top of the ramekins, but that's it, and between taking them out of the oven and serving they fell to just over the top of the rim (does that mean they weren't done, or is that just how souffles are? They seemed done). Got a nice crust on them and they were good with vanilla ice cream, but they weren't exactly the-earth-moved.

I think next time I might try an extra egg white or two. I made mayo later, and I could have done that earlier and saved the 2 whites from that. But other than "more egg whites", does anyone have any suggestions on how to get volume from souffles? It doesn't seem like anything was fundamentally screwed up in my technique, so it might just be one of those things like biscuits or pie crusts where after you do it a few times you sort of get a feel for it. Can I use frozen whites (I make a lot of mayo, but I hardly ever have a use for the egg whites) to boost it beyond equal parts yolks-in-the-base and whites?

[Wendy DeBord]

Welcome to eGullet JohnRichardson!

I once worked at a club were chocolate souffles were their most popular banquet dessert, so I've played around a bit with these. There are a couple ways to make a chocolate souffle. You can make a base as you did or you can use almost straight melted chocolate with whites.

When you make a base, it's typically a pastry cream. That pastry cream dilutes your chocolate flavor so you have to punch up your chocolate flavor, in my opinion. I typically use Bo Friebergs recipe for chocolate souffles because of it's reliability and flavor. He begins with a pastry cream base and adds additional cocoa powder and chocolate liquor to enhance the melted chocolate taste. I personally like the additional cocoa powder because it really does punch up the flavor and the liquor gives it a bit more complexity but still keeps you on the chocolate track. When I've added other liquors I find you must be very cautious because they easily compete with the chocolate flavor instead of punching it up.

Souffles made by melting chocolate, folding in yolks then beaten white do have a stronger chocolate flavor then souffles made with a base. But I think they taste less interesting and complex. You get a big chocolate bang like a chocolate mousse but the quality of your chocolate is really all you get, so it needs to be a statement and eaten by people who like dark or bittersweet chocolates to be appreciated.

At one time I went thru a series of tastings with one member seeking the perfect chocolate souffle. Her perfect version. I got in a couple high end chocolates for this. I made souffles with and without bases and in the end she (and the kitchen staff) liked the souffles enhanced with cocoa powder and using average mid range chocolate.

A couple things to consider when making these:

They aren't nearly as fragile as some people suggest. I open the oven during baking to view them, with no negative consequences. I can judge when their done by looking at them. The top should be dull (no longer shinny raw) and certainly not dry or cracked looking.

You must not over whip your egg whites, you exhaust them and dry them out. It's better to slightly under whip them for a better rise.

I fold my whipped whites into my base using a whisk. I find it does a perfect job folding in.

You do need to handle your souffles gently after they are removed from the oven. Setting them down hard on your counter will begin their deflation.

I bake mine at a steady 375F. until done.................typically about 25 minutes for a soup cup sized portion.

When I've eaten other peoples souffles I've often found them improperly baked. Too many people want to bake it on too high of a heat, too quickly. The exterior shouldn't be done while the center is still a molten cake, underbaked looks shinny wet in the center. To tell when it's over baked it will deflate really quickly when broken with a spoon into a mass at the bottom of the cup.

It's hard to say if your frozen whites will work as well as fresher whites. Lately I can't get any volume out of the purchased egg whites we buy in cartons. That's due to the addition of preservatives where as your own frozen whites won't have that. But I'd test your whites and start over if they don't give you the volume fresh ones do.

[nightscotsman]

Wow, Wendy - thanks for sharing your souffle experience with us! I completely agree with your tips on not overbeating the whites and making sure to bake completely.

We made souffles several times in school, but the recipe we used was one of the rare ones I didn't care for. The texture was closer to a warm angel food cake.

When I did a short trial at Charlie Trotter's we did about 100 chocolate souffles and I really liked their version. If I remember correctly, the base was just yolks, melted chocolate, and creme fraiche, with a bit of sugar added to the whipped whites to keep them flexible and prevent overwhipping. The creme fraiche seemed to add flavor depth and help keep the baked product moist and creamy.

[nicolekaplan]

souffle secrets 101

1."never" use frozen whites, they whip too quickly and dryly and guarantee failure

2. start your whites on a very slow speed and don't increase until they are almost finished

3. whip to soft peaks

4. dishes should be buttered, sugared and frozen until needed, pipe your batter into frozen dish and bake right away

5. dishes should be buttered and sugar all the way to the top, do not clean the "lip"

6. bake at 375 in a convection, higher in a home oven

no matter what recipe you use these tips should improve your souffle making instantly

good luck

[jackal10]

a) Leave out the flour. melted high quality chocolates, fold in the yolks, add some booze or extra sugar if you like, fold in a little of the whites (not too stiff) to lighten the youlk mix, then fold it into the whites. DOn't beat out all the air

b) Prepare the ramekins well - melted butter and then sugar the inside. Clean the top edge after filling

c) The key to success (not often known) is bottom heat. Preheat a thick pan, or put a cool pan on the shelf above. Convection ovens work better than fan ovens for souffle.

d) Some like adding a "surprise". I like a small cube of bread soaked in some liquor in the bottom of the ramekin before adding the mixture.

e) You can play great games at table - break the top an pour in cream or other good things, or a quenelle of chocolate sorbet...

One inch rise on a one inch deep ramekin is good. Souffles will collapse as they cool, especially if they are under cooked.

[Carolyn Tillie]

You can also look through the eGullet Culinary Institute class on Soufflés -- taught by your's truly...

[JohnRichardson]

Thanks for all the help. The recipe I used was based on something from Food 911, but I modified it a bit based on the eGCI course.

I suspect that a., I underbaked by about a minute and b., I wasn't gentle enough with the folding. Possibly also I needed one more egg white. Should it be equal parts yolks & whites, or a bit more white? They weren't overwhipped though, I whip egg whites by hand unless I have 8 or 10, then I use the stand mixer. My kenwood seems to have a hard time with small quantities... A cup of whipped cream is about the minimum practical amount with it. The eggs were very fresh free range eggs.

Next time I'll actually measure to see how much of a % increase I got. I'd say it might have almost doubled, but it didn't come way up over the rim like you see in pictures. Maybe I should fill to almost-full instead of 2/3 full?

[jackal10]

Curiously, it will work better with not so fresh eggs.

Yes, you must fill the ramekins to the very top.

I would not get hung up too much on the ratio of yolks to whites; 1:1 works fine. More important is the ratio of base to whites - if you use just melted chocolate and whites, then the expading foam doesn't have to lift all that flour and milk..

[JohnRichardson]

Curiously, it will work better with not so fresh eggs.

Yes, you must fill the ramekins to the very top.

I would not get hung up too much on the ratio of yolks to whites; 1:1 works fine. More important is the ratio of base to whites - if you use just melted chocolate and whites, then the expading foam doesn't have to lift all that flour and milk..

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I'm-a try it again tonight. I have a chocolate craving. I might try the cocoa-powder recipe from egci (w/ scharfen bergen), or I might use the rest of my scharfen-bergen 70% and 8x% (82 I think), and try the previous recipe I used again just so I'm not changing too much stuff.

I'm going to be upset if mine DID turn out right the first time and I just didn't fill the ramekins enough, the recipe clearly stated "2/3 full" and I thought I remembered that from egci too, although clearly now I see that was not correct.

[Wendy DeBord]

The freshness of your eggs in no way inhibited your rise, that's not an issue.

I fill my bowls to about 1/2" from the top. If I fill them all the way to the top they spill over while baking. If I fill them 2/3's of the way they only go about 1/2" over the lip when fully risen.

You can tell when you break open your souffle if it's cooked right. Exactly how did yours look?

As your learning how to make these trial and error will teach you a lot. Go ahead and fill some to the top of your container, see what happens. Fill them to several different heights and learn what gives your the best height. Bake a whole batch at one time and pull one out every few minutes. Open them up and look inside as you go. Save them up and compare them. You'll be able to visually see what time works best in your oven with your recipe.

I don't know an exact percentage of whites to base. I think that would have to vary according to your specific recipe. Too many whites and your diluting your flavor.

[JohnRichardson]

Well, cooking-wise, it was almost perfect. Maybe another 45 seconds or a minute, to give it a little more crustiness, but that might have been too far. It did fall a little when I served it, but when I broke it open it seemed done. Mostly just a presentation thing, I didn't get that super-high visual thing that says "ooh! souffle!", but they tasted great.

I didn't get 'er done last night, I was all cooked out by the time I'd finished the Frog Comissary Carrot Cake, and some peanut brittle... Maybe this weekend. I'll post pics of the ol' cake if I can figure out how, it is easily the best-looking cake I've ever made.

The freshness of your eggs in no way inhibited your rise, that's not an issue.

I fill my bowls to about 1/2" from the top. If I fill them all the way to the top they spill over while baking. If I fill them 2/3's of the way they only go about 1/2" over the lip when fully risen.

You can tell when you break open your souffle if it's cooked right. Exactly how did yours look?

As your learning how to make these trial and error will teach you a lot. Go ahead and fill some to the top of your container, see what happens. Fill them to several different heights and learn what gives your the best height. Bake a whole batch at one time and pull one out every few minutes. Open them up and look inside as you go. Save them up and compare them. You'll be able to visually see what time works best in your oven with your recipe.

I don't know an exact percentage of whites to base. I think that would have to vary according to your specific recipe. Too many whites and your diluting your flavor.

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[ruthcooks]

Chocolate souffles never rise as much...due to a heavier base, I think. When I make a Harlequin Souffle, half chocolate and half vanilla, the vanilla side always rises higher.

I serve a lot of individual chocolate souffles when making dinner for four. The original recipe made four, but they never rose to suit me so I doubled the recipe for 6. Now I have two souffles as leftovers, and really enjoy them cold with whipped cream, maybe better than hot.

For the little something in the middle of a liqueur souffle, try pound cake soaked in Grand Marnier.