Australian restaurants

[Tim White]

Dear Ozmouse

on the question of good food providores - try the Foodies Guide to Melbourne $26.95 - a local bookstore should have one - but apart from Springvale -for fresh & Asian produce - I'd consider moving

As for the question - I've never been to Vancouver - and it would seem difficult to compare a place with a trend.

If we were comparing places with places - I'd suggest the answer is that both Vancouver and Melboure are both recognized food places - that are emerging as food cultural centres but with all things - its a work in progress and the quality goes up & down where ever you are. And as places proud of their food culture - they both have a long way to go. We both seem to be fighting against large scale farming, shopping & distribution, against lowest common denominator food & food produce etc - we probably both struggle with the tyranny of distance for quality international produce etc

And I have to ask - is Vancouver the new Sydney? No longer content with an interstate rival do we have to have an international one?

[ozmouse]

Dear Ozmouse

And I have to ask - is Vancouver the new Sydney?  No longer content with an interstate rival do we have to have an international one?

←

Now that is a great question, and perfect foil to balance the to and fro we are trying to communicate. I agree with you 100%! Tim for Minister of Food portfolio i say! diplomat and food raconteur!

yes i do have the book tim. and yes i am well aware of the culinary desert -bonbeach- i am living in. the food shops are woeful. (note to self: remember you are 5 houses from the beach!)

i used to live in mentone (sunbeam bakery & turkish shops for bread) , and while that was not the best, i was just closer to the suburbs i usually shopped in.

sigh i remember the days FOODCHAIN was in church street Brighton. I could walk into there, and they had almost everything you wanted (albeit expensive). And if they did not, talk to dept mgr and special order 24/48 hours! I knew they would be not last within 2 months of opening. I was just too good!!!

[vandan]

we all know that you guys got us hands down on the wine front, but from what i hear its the opposite on the beer front, specifically local "cottage" breweries and brew pubs, like steamworks and dockside brewery at granville island, any comments ppl?

[Tim White]

we all know that you guys got us hands down on the wine front, but from what i hear its the opposite on the beer front, specifically local "cottage" breweries and brew pubs, like steamworks and dockside brewery at granville island, any comments ppl?

←

Now beer - that's a topic to get hot blooded parochial Aussies ranting!

Actually you might be surprised. Australian boutique beers are worth the trouble to find. Yes we have a few dominant brands in each state that are brands rather than beers - rumour has it that CUB (the owner of Fosters only has one beer - it just puts them in different tins)

About 20 years ago there was an attempt at microbreweries lead by Phil Sexton at Matilda Bay Brewing Co (the original redback brewery) - it was trendy hip etc and coincided with an upswing in the availability of imported beers - which was soundly brought to heel by the big boys buying most of them up - and Matilda Bay became a CUB/Fosters asset.

Today however there appears to be a re-emerging group of microbrewers around town. In Melbourne, Holgate, Grand Ridge, Little Creatures to name just a couple of the top of my head have a good range of handcrafted ales, lagers etc. In fact I think Grand Ridge recently one a number of awards at a worhthile International Tasting.

What is different this time round is that the beers are being made by passionate brewers not marketing gurus.

And one should not forget Coopers - the Sparkling Ale from Adelaide has always been considered one of the World's great beers - Michael Jackson always rates it highly

Other new developments - Stefano de Piero has just launched an artisanal beer from Mildura (what next!) and Slow Food Melbourne are about to release a Snail Ale handcrafted in inner Melbourne

So are we better - who knows - who cares - but you might want to try a good handcrafted or even better handpulled beer next time you are down under - and they won't be like Fosters or Moosehead - you might have to search for it but they seem to be here to stay.

[Shinboners]

One thing that is a problem in Australia although only from my selfish perspective as an eater is the Customs Authorities. There are some things which we can't import in Australia such as unpastuerised cheeses and more recently Puy Lentils.

←

Someone with a far more accurate memory than me might be able to confirm a story (I may have read it in Epicure in the last couple of weeks) where it seems that people will soon be allowed to import unpasteurised cheeses.

[ozmouse]

Indeed it was only last week in epicure.

The Age Epicure - jan 18th

and the same story is repeated in the saturday australian page 3

Edited January 23, 2005 by ozmouse (log)

[Shinboners]

- rumour has it that CUB (the owner of Fosters only has one beer - it just puts them in different tins)

Just like the Duff Brewery in the Simpsons.

Although in defence of Fosters, they do make the special effort of watering down the beer for sale at the footy. So much so that you could almost be forgiven for thinking that you're drinking American beer.

<ducks head>

Edited January 23, 2005 by Shinboners (log)

[ozmouse]

we all know that you guys got us hands down on the wine front, but from what i hear its the opposite on the beer front, specifically local "cottage" breweries and brew pubs, like steamworks and dockside brewery at granville island, any comments ppl?

←

So are we better - who knows - who cares - but you might want to try a good handcrafted or even better handpulled beer next time you are down under - and they won't be like Fosters or Moosehead - you might have to search for it but they seem to be here to stay.

←

i agree with Tim, there has been a recent surge in new beer labels, that are quite niche marketed. not by the marketing dept, but good brewers. I know alot of them always faced supply demand problems when one of the labels takes off becuase of a trend.

In addition to the labels listed by Tim, I will add the seasonal range of beers by cascade (1 per season) as well as Boags. Boags, cascade (not the heavy) and coopers are usually in my fridge.

I usually try a new label everytime im at the store. Coopers has an vinage extra strong ale out now 7.5% alcohol! not one to slam down quickly.

I did not know the coopers/jackson connection. (learn something new on egullet everyday!)

When i first arrived in the country, the majority of beer avail was not like a canadian pilsner. alot of bitter ales - vic, melb, xxx et al. I know i was'nt drinking many of those. but they have fallen by the wayside abit for more pilsners.

What is the top selling/ beer in aus?? good question? or top ten.... anybody know?

Tim mentioned the imported labels. yes when they arrived on the market, eveyone was putting there nose up at the expensive snobby beers. alot of parocial talk around the barbies!! They too have taken a big junk of the market (globalization again). Is'nt heineken a sponsor of the australian open?

So that is a question i have? Why are the 'premium' imported beers cheaper than our domestic premuims?

oh yeah... caffery's (sp?) on tap at the irish pubs is DELISH!

[cnspriggs]

Great to see activity on this board! I do miss the active posts in the Vancouver board and hope to see more food talk here (especially all you Adelaidians hiding out there!!!) Also I find it interesting the number of comparisons of Melbourne to Vancouver. When in Vancouver I'd really only heard Vancouver compared to Sydney.

Fi Fi La More since you have eaten at Vijs and this is the restaurant I miss most in Vancouver I was wondering if you could recommend a place (Sydney or Melbourne is fine) that you think is as good. Here in Adelaide I've only really found places that have stereotypical Indian food without much creativity.

I too am impressed you paid the prices at Urban Fare for lamb! Other than treats, I stuck to Stongs daily meals.

As a general question, when did Australia first ban unpasterised cheese? It would be great if that rule changed!!! I sure miss Les Amis du Fromage in Vancouver.

Ozmouse I was looking for fresh chorizo and have since found someone that can get me some. I'm in full agreement that regardless of the city it often takes quite a few Km's to get what you want. Oh and I did also enjoy chocolates at Cacao!

Overall I would agree that Australia gets better produce and rightly so as you grow so much of it here. Since Vancouver/Canada must rely on imports for a lot of it's produce we don't always get the freshest choices. However, I believe that the products that are grown locally in both Vancouver and Australia are of equal excellence (except perhaps the strawberries... :) though I am still hopefull to find good ones). I think this is the crux for most food things anywhere in the world, buy local and seasonal and you will get better goods.

As for the beer, I have been quite happy with some of the microbrewery beer in Aussy. Just like to see more of them! And to rescind a bit on my rant, I have found some excellent Australian wines that aren't too oaky/jammy. Overall though I still think Canada gets a better international selection, if poor quality service!

[PCL]

In reply, the sister city thing was raised a couple years ago I seem to remember, but I could be hallucinating. It's not a culinary thing, it's one of those international goodwill pairing things. From my experience in Vancouver, it's a very similar city to Melbourne.

Foodwise, loved the steaks. Salmon was cool 'cos I caught my own, but then again, I get to do that here too, like Snapper & Flathead from the Bay, Trout and stuff in the High Country, the occassional rabbit when I get to play sniper.

In the wine stakes, not all is oaky and jammy. Really. There are numerous 'boutique' winemakers out there who are starting to make what they themselves would like to drink. I'm content with what we get now.

Produce-wise, I've never had a problem. I don't care about the km's, that's part of living in a great spread out land. Half the fun truly is in the journey. Even better when you have to go off-road, so anyone knows of any inaccessible producers/markets let me know!!

But in terms of banned foods, what really really gets up my goat, and where Canadians have an advantage, is the availability of foie gras. It's a fucking shame really that we don't get the real stuff. I think geographically, Hongkong might be the closest destination if you want to indulge. Though, someone I know, who has no name, and I probably dreamt it, did produce a single whole liver from a goose one year. It was an honour to eat it, and it was good.

[SBonner]

Many thansk to you all in regards to my first question comparing the culinary scene of Vancouver with yours...it opened a number of eyes of some Vancouverites as well.

Thank you all for your input and I'm looking forward to my first visit to Australia later this Autumn.

Cheers,

Stephen Bonner

Vancouver

I'm just finising up a bottle of Petaluma Chardonnay then off to the local brew pub for some B.C. IPA

[vandan]

btw also keep in mind when doing comparisons between van and cities there as to which city has more of this or more of that , melbourne has about 1.5 x our pop and sydney at least twice or more