wd-50 2004 - 2007

[vivin]

Right. Just too forward for my palate.

I go to WD not just to exercise my mind but also to satisfy my palate. There were two desserts that I remember - one tasted like castor oil and other had some combination of avocado and some other strong taste that was completely revolting.

Technically, they were well executed. But please, don't just try to shock me into saying they are good.

[vivin]

I went on their web site to see if I could remember what I had. It was the Argan oil in the dessert - White chocolate cream, black sesame,

argan oil, carrot. The second was probably Soft chocolate, avocado,

licorice, lime. If you have had them and like them, your palate is obviously more forward than mine.

[Nathan]

I liked the desserts...but then I liked Stupak's work at Alinea as well.

but I don't normally like desserts and I heartily dislike sweet items...so consider that a major caveat.

[ulterior epicure]

I liked the desserts...but then I liked Stupak's work at Alinea as well.

but I don't normally like desserts and I heartily dislike sweet items...so consider that a major caveat.

←

Are you sure your sweettooth isn't growing, Nathan?

Edited November 28, 2007 by ulterior epicure (log)

[hapacooking]

I have had the pleasure to dine at WD-50 quite a few times and always found the experience somewhat confusing. Some dishes interesting and some dishes very strange. In my experience, WD-50 is not for everyone.

I had the tasting menu two nights ago and found it to be utterly fantastic. Every dish was very very good. Flavors were well balanced and quite satisfying.

The Knot Foie was super. The crunchiness of the nuts with the tartness of the huckleberries was divine. Whimsical and fun.

The Hamachi Tartare was probably the weak dish of the evening with the sea beans being somewhat overpowering with the dish missing something that I could not identify.

The French Onion Soup was an interesting and delicious rendition that was one of the better dishes of the evening.

I found the Lamb Belly with chickpeas probably the best dish of the evening. The belly was cooked perfectly with a perfect balance of flavors.

A new dish recently introduced was Eggs Benedict which included a deep dried breaded lump of hollandaise sauce with small cylinders of egg yolk with a thin sliver of bacon, was outstanding. A playful spin on the original that was nothing less than spectacular.

Stupak's desserts were also super. The toasted coconut cake with smoked hazelnuts and brown butter sorbet was out of this world. The soft white chocolate with white beer ice cream was interesting with flavors that you you would not expected to work but, in fact, worked perfectly.

Hats off to Wylie, Alex and the crew.

[Todd36]

The reputation remains a mystery to me. I've had dinner there twice, and while its been OK, it wasn't worth the trouble to get there or the size of the check. It reminds me of the original version of Gilt, where I had one dinner. New cooking techniques or ingredient combinations do not necessarily lead to good food. It reminds me of modern art. I often wonder what people will say about Jackson Pollock or Ellsworth Kelly in a hundred years; my guess is not much, because few people will know who they are. With respect to higher end non-Asian restaurants in NYC, my best experiences have been at Bouley, Danube, Daniel, Jean Georges, Perry Street, the former Alain Ducasse, Blue Hill and Per Se. They all have fairly traditional menus and cooking methods---Per Se, which is probably the most "innovative" on the list, was not in my opinion as good s the hype.

[Batard]

You know I had reservations there once -- I think Wylie is a character -- but I get so many conflicting stories about this place I canceled my reservation. It seems either people love it or hate it, but the reviews are so mixed that I am nervous about plunking down $200 (times 3 guests) for the tasting menu. I can go to a lot of other places for that.

[docsconz]

You know I had reservations there once -- I think Wylie is a character -- but I get so many conflicting stories about this place I canceled my reservation. It seems either people love it or hate it, but the reviews are so mixed that I am nervous about plunking down $200 (times 3 guests) for the tasting menu. I can go to a lot of other places for that.

←

You would really have to try it for yourself. If you enjoy creative cooking, you will most likely enjoy WD-50 very much. If you are more traditionally oriented, it may not be to your liking. To me, it is one of the finest restaurants around. It's funny, I read some unenthusiastic reports and I begin to wonder if they have lost "it." Then I go back and have a fantastic meal and I cannot understand the negativity. The place is unique and the food is unique. It is not a cookie cutter restaurant serving all the same dishes that so many other restaurants are. In addition, the restaurant has a sense of humor. If someone is expecting a traditional eggs benedict, that person will likely be disappointed. OTOH, if someone can take that term as a reference point and go with it from there, I suspect that person would be quite pleased with what is on the plate.

You can go to a lot of other places for that money, but in NYC, none of them would be unique the way WD-50 is. The one possible exception at this point would be Tailor.

[docsconz]

The reputation remains a mystery to me.  I've had dinner there twice, and while its been OK, it wasn't worth the trouble to get there or the size of the check.  It reminds me of the original version of Gilt, where I had one dinner.  New cooking techniques or ingredient combinations do not necessarily lead to good food.  It reminds me of modern art.  I often wonder what people will say about Jackson Pollock or Ellsworth Kelly in a hundred years; my guess is not much, because few people will know who they are.  With respect to higher end non-Asian restaurants in NYC, my best experiences have been at Bouley, Danube, Daniel, Jean Georges, Perry Street, the former Alain Ducasse, Blue Hill and Per Se.  They all have fairly traditional menus and cooking methods---Per Se, which is probably the most "innovative" on the list, was not in  my opinion as good s the hype.

←

I would say that Jean-George is much more innovative than Per Se, but neither are in the class of WD-50 in that area. I think people either tend to like innovative restaurants or they don't.

[Todd36]

The reputation remains a mystery to me.  I've had dinner there twice, and while its been OK, it wasn't worth the trouble to get there or the size of the check.  It reminds me of the original version of Gilt, where I had one dinner.  New cooking techniques or ingredient combinations do not necessarily lead to good food.  It reminds me of modern art.  I often wonder what people will say about Jackson Pollock or Ellsworth Kelly in a hundred years; my guess is not much, because few people will know who they are.  With respect to higher end non-Asian restaurants in NYC, my best experiences have been at Bouley, Danube, Daniel, Jean Georges, Perry Street, the former Alain Ducasse, Blue Hill and Per Se.  They all have fairly traditional menus and cooking methods---Per Se, which is probably the most "innovative" on the list, was not in  my opinion as good s the hype.

←

I would say that Jean-George is much more innovative than Per Se, but neither are in the class of WD-50 in that area. I think people either tend to like innovative restaurants or they don't.

←

I'm sure there are quite a few references out there that trace innovation in food---its clearly not

a static area. But I'm not so sure that food trends advance quite as quickly as some would have us to believe. And I don't think the entire menu advances at once. Some things that people think are "new" may not be so new. It's currently popular to add Asian flavors such as tamarind and fish sauce to western dishes. Sounds new, right? Worcestershire sauce is a fermented fish sauce with tamarind and Lea & Perrins have been making it for almost 200 years. Or mashed potatoes with lots of butter, that's new right? Ever read James Beard's recipe? To me, a restaurant like the original Gilt or WD-50 is contrived. Newness for the sake of newness does not a better dining experience make.

[Gabe Q]

While I have not been to wd-50 myself to eat I have also heard a lot of mixed reviews about it. I do plan to visit soon, but maybe will opt for a la carte.

I recently talked to a friend of mine from Spain who is a chef de partie at elbulli. And he told me that the day before thansgiving, he along with another chef de partie from elbulli and friends from mini-bar in DC went there and they did not like the food at all. And these are obviously people that are used to working with and tasting all sort of cutting edge cuisine. He felt that the food didn't have any depth of flavor and was maybe trying too hard to be "out there" instead of putting the flavor factor first.

But I think food like this is very personal and it will affect everyone differently. I will probably go try out a few dishes soon and see what I think.

Edited December 9, 2007 by Gabe Quiros (log)

[twodogs]

whoa,

that is not a fair statement. while you may like or not like the food, bringing in and summing the thoughts of what others felt and using their resumes as proof of good taste is, well in poor taste.

go to the restaurant and eat. like it or not, make the decision yours. and if your associates care to comment on their meal let them do it in their voice.

[Gabe Q]

While I didn't say this in a way to make sound wd-50 sound bad, maybe it could have sent the wrong message. I am definitely an advocate for this type of cooking, and so I want to see places like this triumph. I just thought I'd share the experience of other people from the industry whom I know, that don't even know about egullet. But not to use it in a negative way, but as an unviased opinion.

[dougw]

I get a little weary when people get overly critical of Adria's disciples. I read once where someone stormed out of Trio after the third course because she "just wanted a steak." Maybe that was in Ruhlman's book.

Anyway, we'll have to see where this kind of thing takes cooking in the future. It may be just a cool phase, or it may lead to things that change the way we all eat one day. I look at it like music.

In jazz, for instance, people tried a lot of things in the 60's and 70's to experiment with the form. Some of it was successful, but much of it was not. Given time, it became clear which was which.

I feel the same about Adria. Dufresne and Achatz. Bottom line is, the food tastes great and is made by experts.

[dougw]

Also, saying that El Bulli doesn't put flavor first is factually inaccurate. In fact, what Adria intends to do is MAXIMIZE pure flavors by using these new techniques. The pea ravioli is a perfect example. It's peas wrapped in peas. Keller does the same thing with his soups, giving you the utter essence of a carrot or turnip, but he puts it in a bowl, or espresso cup as the case may me.

Anyway, there's plenty of places to get a traditional meal. If you dislike something new, at least consider the possibility that it may be something you have to bring yourself to understand. Using a music comparison again...I think about John Coltrane.

If you played some of his music to an inexperienced listener, it might sound like nonsensical cacophony. But if you allow yourself to spend time with it, like all great art, it will reveal things to you and enrich you far more than having music like Corrine Bailey Rae or the like spoonfed to you. That music is fine, but it doesn't require the listener to bring anything of themselves to the experience. But if you spend time with Stravinsky or Coltrane, it will give much more to you as a result of your investment.

Food is no different. Most people wouldn't dream of eating a dirty fungus that a dog or pig rooted out of the ground. But those in the know understand the beauty of it.

Edited December 10, 2007 by dougw (log)

[LPShanet]

Also, saying that El Bulli doesn't put flavor first is factually inaccurate. In fact, what Adria intends to do is MAXIMIZE pure flavors by using these new techniques. The pea ravioli is a perfect example. It's peas wrapped in peas. Keller does the same thing with his soups, giving you the utter essence of a carrot or turnip, but he puts it in a bowl, or espresso cup as the case may me.

Anyway, there's plenty of places to get a traditional meal. If you dislike something new, at least consider the possibility that it may be something you have to bring yourself to understand. Using a music comparison again...I think about John Coltrane.

If you played some of his music to an inexperienced listener, it might sound like nonsensical cacophony. But if you allow yourself to spend time with it, like all great art, it will reveal things to you and enrich you far more than having music like Corrine Bailey Rae or the like spoonfed to you. That music is fine, but it doesn't require the listener to bring anything of themselves to the experience. But if you spend time with Stravinsky or Coltrane, it will give much more to you as a result of your investment.

Food is no different. Most people wouldn't dream of eating a dirty fungus that a dog or pig rooted out of the ground. But those in the know understand the beauty of it.

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I totally agree. What Adria is known for is isolating the essence of a product (for example, olives) and making an item that tastes even more like an olive than the original olive does. If that's not about flavor, I'd have a hard time imagining what is.

[fendi_pilot]

I had the tasting menu in November and loved it. I had been there before for both dinner and desserts and always really enjoy the food, the playfulness, creativity, and finesse of Wylie's cooking. The wine pairing was mostly very succesful ( there was one Pinot Noir I didn't care for that much) and the pours very generous. I actually shared the wine pairing with my girlfriend and we both left feeling good, not overly full or hammered but in great spirits.

The atmosphere is really low key, while the staff is really knowledgable and attentive. One of the waiter's we had also worked in R & D for the kitchen, which surprised me. Also the crowd is always interesting to me as it's not people I would ever expect of being into more adventurous food.

If you are on the fence about going, I would definitely go and order a la carte. For the quality and inventiveness of the food I think it is very reasonably priced. The desserts are really outstanding as well, and as someone who doesn't love overly sweet desserts, are a brilliant blend of the sweet and savory, often with some unusual elements. The pale ale ice cream dessert mentioned a few comments above was one of the best conceived desserts ever !

[docsconz]

FWIW, I don't think the depth of flavor comment was directed at Adria, however, I have never found Wylie Dufresne's cooking to lack depth of flavor either.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Host's note: to avoid an undue load on our servers, the wd-50 topic has been split.  The discussion continues here.]

Edited April 20, 2014 by lesliec
Added host's note (log)