Restaurant guide awards preview

[albiston]

On October the 11th Gambero Rosso will announce its annual Tre Forchette prizes for the best restaurants in Italy. On their newly started blog Papero Giallo the chief editor, Stefano Bonilli, gives a few hints on the chefs that will be honoured with the pirze this year.

A few names get explicitly mentioned: Pierangelini, Vissani, Alajmo, Tamani and Santini. The usual suspects, one might add. Maybe more intriguing is the reference to "a squad of new entries". Considering the media coverage some restaurants have recieved from GR itself I wouldn't be surprised if the following would get the three forchette this year: Bill Klapp's favourite Combal.0, Cracco-Peck in Milan and Uliassi in Senigallia.

Just for kicks, is there any other places you think might or should get the prize?

[francesco]

On October the 11th Gambero Rosso will announce its annual Tre Forchette prizes for the best restaurants in Italy. On their newly started blog Papero Giallo the chief editor, Stefano Bonilli, gives a few hints on the chefs that will be honoured with the pirze this year.

A few names get explicitly mentioned: Pierangelini, Vissani, Alajmo, Tamani and Santini. The usual suspects, one might add. Maybe more intriguing is the reference to "a squad of new entries". Considering the media coverage some restaurants have recieved from GR itself I wouldn't be surprised if the following would get the three forchette this year: Bill Klapp's favourite  Combal.0, Cracco-Peck in Milan and Uliassi in Senigallia.

Just for kicks, is there any other places you think might or should get the prize?

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I would definitively add Perbellini (Isola Rizza). Also, Bottura, of Osteria Francescana (Modena) gets consistent raves in the press and online: I wouldn't be surprised if it made it to the top or thereabouts. Personally, I have a weak spot for Arnolfo (Colle val d' Elsa), but that would hardly be a new entry!

Francesco

[docsconz]

I would second Bottura of Osteria Francescana, although I must admit my direct experience with top end Italian restaurants is limited. Nevertheless, I thought his restaurant outstanding.

[katiaANDronald]

Three weeks ago we had dinner at Il Duomo in Ragusa, whose chef is Ciccio Sultano. I think it deserves to be recognised for two reasons - 1. the food is excellent per se and the restaurant atmosphere is all about the food and the wine 2. its extremely brave to open such a restaurant in a smallish place like Ragusa, where there is not really a culture of such top-end restaurants. He has done untold good to the reputation of the region, whose food does deserves to get more widely known.

[albiston]

Three weeks ago we had dinner at Il Duomo in Ragusa, whose chef is Ciccio Sultano. I think it deserves to be recognised for two reasons - 1. the food is excellent per se and the restaurant atmosphere is all about the food and the wine

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You wouldn't, by any chance, care to tell us a bit more about Il Duomo? A little review maybe ?

[katiaANDronald]

You wouldn't, by any chance, care to tell us a bit more about Il Duomo? A little review maybe  ?

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Absolutely, will try and post it at some point today or tomorrow, just a question of finding the time

[CyN]

On this thread both Francesco and Docsconz give high marks to Bottura of Osteria Francescana. The place also gets a rave review from E-Gullet member Desal on Sept.27, 2003 ,as well as more high praise from Frommer's Travel Guide.

Who could resist it? And its right en route for me geographically(Modena) on my forthcoming trip to Northern Italy.

But then I discovered this review on Slow Travel Italy, from Bob of WA in 2003.I"m not computer-savvy enough to create a link so will just quote from it directly.

"Ultra modern food- too trendy and pricey."

"I really did not like this place ...... rather stuffy and hovering as far as the service is concerned...we ordered a special cheese appetizer that was supposed to highlight cheeses of various ages.What we got was a dollup of flavorless whipped foam(like fluffy shaving cream)that was 12 months old cheese,a small scrap of a ricotta-like consistency cheese that was 18 months old,a dribble( really!about 5 to 10 ml) of cheese sauce around the edge that was 24 months old and a single cheese chip( the size of a single potato chip) that was 26+ months old.None of this had much flavor... I would not recommend this place."

Its the nature of the game for restaurants to arouse differing opinions. And any restaurant can have a bad day. Still, consistency should be the mark of a really high-quality restaurant. And I hate to go anywhere where even one customer has been dissatisfied - there are SO many others to choose from.So I am inclined to scratch this joint from consideration, although I could be talked out of it.

Perhaps this should have been in a new thread, I dont know.

[francesco]

On this thread both Francesco and Docsconz give high marks to Bottura of Osteria Francescana. The place also gets a rave review from E-Gullet member Desal on Sept.27, 2003 ,as well as more high praise from Frommer's Travel Guide.

Who could resist it? And its right en route for me geographically(Modena) on my forthcoming trip to Northern Italy.

But then I discovered this review on Slow Travel Italy, from Bob of WA in 2003.I"m not computer-savvy enough to create a link  so will just quote from it directly.

"Ultra modern food- too trendy and pricey."

  "I really did not like this place ...... rather stuffy and hovering as far as the service is concerned...we ordered a special cheese appetizer that was supposed to highlight cheeses of various ages.What we got was a dollup of flavorless whipped foam(like fluffy shaving cream)that was 12 months old cheese,a small scrap of a ricotta-like consistency cheese that was 18 months old,a dribble( really!about 5 to 10 ml) of cheese sauce around the edge that was 24 months old and a single cheese chip( the size of a single potato chip) that was 26+ months old.None of this had much flavor... I would not recommend this place."

Its the nature of the game for restaurants to arouse differing opinions. And any restaurant can have a bad day. Still, consistency should be the mark of a really high-quality restaurant. And I hate to go anywhere where even one customer has been dissatisfied - there are SO many others to choose from.So I am inclined to scratch this joint from consideration, although I could be talked out of it.

Perhaps this should have been in a new thread, I dont know.

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Cyn,

I have never been to the Osteria Francescana, but I cited it as a possible recipeint for three forks from Gambero Rosso because the range of opinions on it is almost unanimously very good. Thus, I can't give you advice coming from direct experience.

However, I don't quite understand your logic as there are NOT so many others to choose from that get more consensus on the positive side (I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong, however). If a few negative reports was enough to disqualify a restaurant, I'd never consider or would have considered El Bulli, Pierre Gagnaire, Marc Veyrat, Michel Bras, you name it. Also, you should consider that this is a restaurant with a strong focus on creative/experimental cuisine. The diner you cite might have expected more traditional fare.

BTW, if traditional fare is what you're looking for, Hosteria Giusti (for lunch only, I believe) is truly excellent.

Francesco

[CyN]

Francesco

My problem is that I already have a 14 day trip planned in detail(see my thread on Northern Italy a couple weeks ago) and adding Osteria Francescana would mean adding on an extra day.

Of course you are right, one bad review shouldnt automatically eliminate a restaurant.But there is a relative paucity of positive reviews(only two that I have seen - I dont count Frommer now that I see their other recommendations) and while I appreciate your thoughts, you yourself are unable to add a positive review of your own.So without more vigorous encouragement, I am not inclined to risk the time and expense of an extra day.

[docsconz]

Francesco

My problem is that I already have a 14 day trip planned in detail(see my thread on Northern Italy a couple weeks ago) and adding Osteria Francescana would mean adding on an extra day.

Of course you are right, one bad review shouldnt automatically eliminate a restaurant.But there is a relative paucity of positive reviews(only two that I have seen - I dont count Frommer now that I see their other recommendations) and while I appreciate your thoughts, you yourself are unable to add a positive review of your own.So without more vigorous encouragement, I am not inclined to risk  the time and expense of an extra day.

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Cyn,

I have been to both Osteria Francescana and Hosteria Giusti, both last November. I found the food at Francescana to be be very creative, flavorful and whimsical in an international style with very strong Italian underpinnings. Indeed Massimo Bottura is a protege of Ferran adria, having worked at El Bulli. I enjoyed it very much.

Here are a couple of photos that should give an indication of what some of the cuisine looks like:

Pork tenderloin wrapped with pancetta with balsamic vinaigrette, raspberry vinegar, onion marmelade, mashed potatoes and brussel sprouts

and

Chianina Toscana over mashed potatoes

It is not classic Italian food, but it still respects tradition. My notes from the visit: "The decor of the restaurant was very modern and smart mixed with some traditional elements such as the ceiling. This is also an apt description of the cuisine , which based on high-quality traditional ingredients is presented in new and creative ways. My favorite dish of the evening (I had a tasting menu selected by the chef) was a leek and truffle tart with generous shavings of black truffle. i considered this dish a true "wow".

The food, decor and service were on a par with other world class restaurants I've been to. If you want traditional don't go. If you want creative flair, I recommend it highly.

[Leslie]

Docsconz,

Thanks for the timely post. We are booked next month at both Osteria Francescana (for the first time) and Hosteria Giusti (for about the hundredth time). Having read the SloTrav item as well as a sharply worded recensione in Tigullovino, we have had some of Cyn's anxiety about the choice of Francescana, but you have bolstered our confidence, adding to Gambero Rosso's 2004 observation that there seems to have been an evolution from pretentious dishes toward a more mature and balanced approach. We'll let you know how we fared. . .

Leslie

[albiston]

Docsconz,

Thanks for the timely post.  We are booked next month at both Osteria Francescana (for the first time) and Hosteria Giusti (for about the hundredth time).  Having read the SloTrav item as well as a sharply worded recensione in Tigullovino, we have had some of Cyn's anxiety about the choice of Francescana, but you have bolstered our confidence, adding to Gambero Rosso's 2004 observation that there seems to have been an evolution from pretentious dishes toward a more mature and balanced approach.  We'll let you know how we fared. . .

Leslie

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Just a word Tigulliovino's restaurant reviews. What you find in this handy source is mainly a collection of reviews submitted to the newsgroup it.discussioni.ristoranti. Having followed the ng since the start it might be helpfull to add that the reviewers are really heterogenous bunch, ranging from well informed and intelligent ones to those that are negatively biased just for the sake of demonstrating restaurant guides are wrong. Worth taking with a pinch of salt.

Leslie, have fun in Italy and looking forward to reading about your experiences.

[CyN]

Docsconz - thanks for your post. Very encouraging.Now I'm leaning toward going.

Leslie-- I am going to hold the whole matter in abeyance until you weigh in on it. You will be bearing an awesome responsibility

I still dont know if you're a he or a she (not that it matters)

[docsconz]

I am confident that you will enjoy yourselves if you enjoy creative cuisine with a respect for tradiotion. Have great trips!

[albiston]

Still in Italy, and with only occasional net access but with a few news and gossips.

The first new tre forchette to be announced, in the newly published GR Rome guide, is Antonio Colonna in Labico (if anyone's interested in the points he got 50/60 for his cooking and 18/20 for the wine list). I met some people more or less loosely coonnected to Gambero Rosso two days ago in Rome and they were raving about his oxtail ravioli in pigeon broth. Might not sound very Italian but the oxtail comes straight from the very Roman dish of coda alla vaccinara.

I have also been told that the tre forchette this year will be 20, with quite a few new entries and old "stars" losing their award from the past years. I'm quite curious to see who will rise and who will fall.

[paulbrussel]

I don't know the others, but I was very much impressed by Cracco-Peck earlier this year - food and excellent wine choice.

E.g. the Uovo al tartufo: simple but very good (although not as good as the similar dish with white truffles that I once had at Gaig in Barcelona).

Most impressive was the Crema di riso, ricci di mare e caffè, which went very well with a chianti (and the wine went extremely well with the coffee!),as impressive as one of the desserts: Miele d’acacia con caprino e tartufo, the latter with white truffle from Alba.

(Since I will lunch there again in a few weeks time, I will check whether the standard has been kept high.)