Per Se

[sabg]

I had aslo asked if we could do the 2x2 ( have two different dishes for each course) Our waiter/captain noted our requests, and went back to the kitchen to ask the chef if it was possible. He came back and noted that the 1x1 (i guess it's a 1x1 if there are just two of us and not a 2x2) would be an additional $100 per person.

That's bizarre. We had the 2x2, and the additional charge was only $20.00.

i just want to understand...a 2x2 is when you add an additional dish to course? thanks,

[robert40]

I am going to go out on a limb here and make a assumption based on my interpretation of how the server explained it to us.

There may not be a set price written in stone on this extra menu,meaning the chef is offering what he has on any given night to the people who wish to try as many items as possible.

It also may not be offered every night as our server said she had to ask the chef if it was available that evening.

[docsconz]

The 2x2 was two different tasting menus four a table of four so that each couple gets to share two different tasting menus. Actually the $20 additional charge was for the fois gras upgrade, I believe. We did get additional courses, but I believe they were comped. An additional charge of $100pp for the 2x2 negates my comments about value. I wonder if they meant $100pp for wine pairings?

[docsconz]

It could be that the costs of executing all this additional service need to be recouped and they may have instituted additional charges for enhanced service, especially after reading about the great "value" they were.

[allister]

To clarify, the $100 supplement per person to the 9 course tasting enabled the two of us to have different dishes for all courses except for the fish and meat course. There were extra courses involved, as the total including the amuse and petit fours etc probably brought us to about 17 total courses. We also asked for a wine pairing which was also $100 pp (11 2 ounce pours).

Again, let me reiterate that the food and wine were excellent. It was truly a wonderful experience. I am only curious to understand if there is a set price for the premium, if it is arbitrarily priced, or if there is some type of formula?

[docsconz]

When we ate there on May 20th we did not specifically ask for a "2x2" or for extra courses. We did ask if each diner could have a different tasting menu from the others so that there would have been four different 9-course dinners at our table. They then offered us the "2x2" and the only premium we were charged was the $20pp supplement for fois gras. Not only was the meal wonderful, it was an incredible value. They may have realized that it was too good a value to continue and changed their policy.

[sabg]

To clarify, the $100 supplement per person to the 9 course tasting enabled the two of us to have different dishes for all courses except for the fish and meat course. There were extra courses involved, as the total including the amuse and petit fours etc probably brought us to about 17 total courses. We also asked for a wine pairing which was also $100 pp (11 2 ounce pours).

Again, let me reiterate that the food and wine were excellent. It was truly a wonderful experience. I am only curious to understand if there is a set price for the premium, if it is arbitrarily priced, or if there is some type of formula?

is the 100.00 wine paring a set price? i lwould love to do the 1x1 but i cant do that and the wine. if you could only choose wine OR additional which would you choose? i am thinking add'l courses but would need confirm the price.

[bilrus]

is the 100.00 wine paring a set price?

Our wine pairing was $75 per person and included different pairings for both my wife and me, as we had the chef's and veg menus and have different tastes in wines.

[sabg]

When we ate there on May 20th we did not specifically ask for a "2x2" or for extra courses. We did ask if each diner could have a different tasting menu from the others so that there would have been four different 9-course dinners at our table. They then offered us the "2x2" and the only premium we were charged was the $20pp supplement for fois gras. Not only was the meal wonderful, it was an incredible value. They may have realized that it was too good a value to continue and changed their policy.

for 20.00 i am actually salivating..then i could enjoy the 100.00 wine pairing also. i know however it shakes out it will be memorable, i just dont see myself doing again next month and would like to be able to take advantage of as much as possible and still be able to eat for the rest of the week

[allister]

To clarify, the $100 supplement per person to the 9 course tasting enabled the two of us to have different dishes for all courses except for the fish and meat course.  There were extra courses involved, as the total including the amuse and petit fours etc probably brought us to about 17 total courses.  We also asked for a wine pairing which was also $100 pp (11 2 ounce pours). 

Again, let me reiterate that the food and wine were excellent.  It was truly a wonderful experience.    I am only curious to understand if there is a set price for the premium, if it is arbitrarily priced, or if there is some type of formula?

is the 100.00 wine paring a set price? i lwould love to do the 1x1 but i cant do that and the wine. if you could only choose wine OR additional which would you choose? i am thinking add'l courses but would need confirm the price.

The food and wine were both excellent. I was able to speak with the sommelier and talk to him as to how much I wanted to spend on wine. I am sure that they will work within a price point that you are comfortable with. If I could only choose to do one, I would choose the food. Take into account though that I am not a real big wine person.

[JosephB]

When we ate there on May 20th we did not specifically ask for a "2x2" or for extra courses. We did ask if each diner could have a different tasting menu from the others so that there would have been four different 9-course dinners at our table. They then offered us the "2x2" and the only premium we were charged was the $20pp supplement for fois gras. Not only was the meal wonderful, it was an incredible value. They may have realized that it was too good a value to continue and changed their policy.

I think you're right John. Do you think we received a special price because we announced that we were forum hosts on eGullet?

[Jaybert41]

When we ate there on May 20th we did not specifically ask for a "2x2" or for extra courses. We did ask if each diner could have a different tasting menu from the others so that there would have been four different 9-course dinners at our table.

Did anybody see A Cooks Tour with Anthony Bourdain a few years back on The Food Network when four of them went to The French Laundry?

What was astonishing about that episode was that the kitchen put out four entirely different tasting menus for the table! The guests (Eric Ripert, Scott Bryan and Michael Ruhlman) were all completely flabbergasted that the they even dare attempt something of that magnitude. They all thought that Thomas Keller was a little bit crazy for doing so and were amazed that a chef would take the generosity that far...

That was a VIP Table, for a television show!

My point is, I don't really understand how people can arrive at the impression that they should and/or would go to a restaurant like Per Se or anywhere comparable and anticipate or request "four different tasting menus for the entire table." They offer several menus as it is, with several options and the idea of asking for more options on top of that because you want to see more dishes is a little unnerving. I would want to see more dishes also, but I am happy enough when a restaurant has a tasting menu that looks intriguing, let alone asking for them to cook separate menus for the entire table.

I can understand an occasional substitution for something that you want to avoid, but basically requesting that they go nuts on you and your table seems a little indignant.

[docsconz]

Jaybert,

Indignant? I don't think so. We didn't demand anything. Based upon recommendations from friends and previous postings about The French Laundry and Per Se here on eGullet, we asked if that were possible in a very friendly, understanding way. We were not disappointed nor did we raise a fuss when they very kindly suggested the 2x2. In fact, we would have been happy enough with the regular menu. Nevertheless, the additional courses we were able to taste enhanced our evening tremendously and I can assure you we were very appreciative. Per Se is not your typical restaurant nor do they purport to be. They set an extremely high standard, which I feel they met.

Joe,

Perhaps they did accord us additional respect because we mentioned eGullet. Ifso, that speaks volumes about how far this site has come. As much as I would like to exaggerate our importance, though, I doubt it. I think it is perhaps just as if not more likely that we were the first ones seated for their "hard" re-opening.

[JosephB]

Joe,

Perhaps they did accord us additional respect because we mentioned eGullet. Ifso, that speaks volumes about how far this site has come. As much as I would like to exaggerate our importance, though, I doubt it. I think it is perhaps just as if not more likely that we were the first ones seated for their "hard" re-opening.

I see, we got a real bargain -- what a relief.

[docsconz]

One other point, We did not expect them to "go nuts" on us without having to pay an appropriate tariff.

[bilrus]

I know I've mentioned it before, but one option that does not come with any additional cost is getting the Vegetarian menu in addition to the Chef's tasting menu. It was nearly the equal of the Chef's menu and in several courses exceeded it. They are very clear that the entire table does not need to order the same menu of even the same number of courses.

[Fat Guy]

Standard mise-en-place procedure for a tasting menu, in most any restaurant kitchen, is to prepare everything in multiples. The portions that go out to the tables are split portions: the piece of meat or fish is likely cooked in one pan, by one cook, and then sliced and allocated for service. That's how the kitchen can put out 10 or more courses: each plate that goes out to the table is a part of the whole.

Assuming Per Se follows standard restaurant procedure, there's a world of difference between 2x2 tastings and 1x1 tastings. Or, rather, they are exactly the same, but half the food gets wasted in the 1x1 scenario. Since a table for 2 can order a tasting, and another table for 2 can order another tasting, there is no rational argument for a premium on a 2x2. Whereas, on a 1x1, a premium of nearly 100% could be understandable. Then again, it doesn't sound as though the restaurant has been entirely consistent here either. Perhaps someone will just ask what the policy is and the reasons for it.

[AES]

Ok - my reservation is next weekend so I want to make sure I'm clear on the ordering options....

1. Wine pairings have run between $75- 100+ with a very accommodating sommelier.

2. A table of 4 has these "menu" options.

A. the "regular" menu with all 4 having either the tasting, veg. or 5 course.

B. a different tasting menu for every person at an add'l $100 per person.

and C. -- I think (and hope) -- a combination of the regular menu options (5 course, tasting & veg.) for all diners at the same table at no add'l charge.

My parents are joining us next week. While I love them dearly, they are not the foodies my husband and I are and would probably prefer the 5 course to the tasting, which is what we'd prefer.

Is this in fact possible or am I going to need to breathe even more deeply when I pay the bill for 4 tasting menus with wine pairings in order to get those for us???

[rich]

Ok - my reservation is next weekend so I want to make sure I'm clear on the ordering options....

1. Wine pairings have run between $75- 100+ with a very accommodating sommelier.

2. A table of 4 has these "menu" options.

A. the "regular" menu with all 4 having either the tasting, veg. or 5 course.

B. a different tasting menu for every person at an add'l $100 per person.

and C. -- I think (and hope) -- a combination of the regular menu options (5 course, tasting & veg.) for all diners at the same table at no add'l charge.

My parents are joining us next week. While I love them dearly, they are not the foodies my husband and I are and would probably prefer the 5 course to the tasting, which is what we'd prefer.

Is this in fact possible or am I going to need to breathe even more deeply when I pay the bill for 4 tasting menus with wine pairings in order to get those for us???

I think it's clear you need a 4x4 tasting menu and the price will be determined by Per Se during its 3x3 celebration, which occurs during the 2x2 fortnight after the first crescent moon or on the first Tuesday of the month during a 1x1 eclipse of the sun.

Does that explain it?

[Fat Guy]

AES, the only way you can get an official answer is by asking the restaurant. All the people here can tell you is what they experienced as individuals. The restaurant has no obligation, absent a policy, to honor one table's arrangement with another table, so really a phone call is likely to be your best piece of research here -- and we'd love to hear what you learn.

[Jaybert41]

I think it's clear you need a 4x4 tasting menu and the price will be determined by Per Se during its 3x3 celebration, which occurs during the 2x2 fortnight after the first crescent moon or on the first Tuesday of the month during a 1x1 eclipse of the sun.

Ahh... Glad to see some Biodynamic principles are making their way into the high end New York Restaurant scene. Slow food may take on a new meaning when people start asking for the 6x6 tasting menu...

[AES]

the only way you can get an official answer is by asking the restaurant.

I thought about this after I posted & just did so through the main reservations number (not the reconfirm 877 number). The woman I spoke with confirmed that each person can order whatever menu from the "standard" menu (option "C" in my initial post) without any additional charge.

Anything varying from that (like substitution of a different dish, adding dishes or the like) would be determined on an individual basis.

The best part of this -- I get to go home and say "I told you so" to my husband, who was willing to bet his last dollar on the fact that there was no way we could in fact do this.

[xyz123]

Dined at Per Se last week, this is my experience

The menu was being described to me “ we have the 5 course and the chefs tasting menu

Or If you like we can have the kitchen cook for you” this sounded exciting to me so I let the kitchen cook for me. Unfortunately I got the exact printed chefs tasting menu with 4 different amuse.

The food was a big disappointment.

It lacked excitement. Flavor and presentation were boring. In general the flavors were one dimensional. The food at Per Se is in no way a match for ADNY or Bouley in a off night. ADNY surpasses Per Se in every detail, even though the service at Per Se was excellent but not at the same level as ADNY

I have dined at the French Laundry in 1995, from what I recall it was excellent.

Not sure what the problem with Per Se is, but I will go again in a few months and see if there is an improvement

The Salted butter was not at the right temperature or texture, there was moisture on top of it. It cracked when I tried to scoop some out. The unsalted butter was great

The dishes (plates) they use are too light, every time you place a fork or knife on the dish it makes a very annoying chime-y sound. I heard this sound all through my meal from other tables as well. I have never noticed this sound at any other restaurant.

Salmon ConeZero taste, this signified trouble ahead. The only sensation in my mouth was the smoothness of the salmon and the texture of the cone. But no taste

Eggplant Soup

Boring, again no taste .Don’t get me wrong last year I had a dish called “eggplant parmesan”At ADNY even though this sounded boring it was loaded with flavor and totally blew me away.

Panna Cotta with CaviarVery good

Truffle Custard

Excellent very tasty, the potato tuile coming out of the shell was stale

Razor Clams with Basil

Chewy

Peach Melba “Foie Gras Torchon”Excellent, the Foie Gras was a little too cold and therefore the toast that was brought on the side was useless, it shattered both times I tried to put some Foie Gras on it. The peach a little too sweet.

I was told the next course was Black Bass and that’s what the menu listed as well. But I was served Wild Striped Bass the skin is totally different on the Black Bass from the Striped Bass as well as the thickness and the texture of the fish. But the change did not bother me

This dish did nothing for me. The fancy wording on the menu made it even lass appealing. Bouley uses fancy descriptions for a dish but when you put a bite in your mouth it explodes with flavor

Butter Poached Lobster

Terrible Dish, Lobster tough, morels full of dirt

This is the first time I had Dirty Morels in a upscale restaurant

Stuffed Rabbit Shoulder with “Farcie aux ris de veau”Very good dish but not Excellent, but it was excellent compared with the dishes above

Veal “chateaubriand” the veal came with “sweetbreads” not “ ris de Veau” ;-), that’s how the menu read

Desserts were very very weak

One cheese with apple gelee

Marscapone (that’s how it was spelled on the menu) Sorbet, Good taste bad texture, apple chip on top was stale

Coffee and Donuts, not worthy of it famous stature

Cream Brulee , just boring, burnt sugar on the edge of the plate, a total no no at a fine dining restaurant

Chocolate and Peanuts, very good

Petit fours, so so

Truffles, looked great but packed no punch

I really wanted to love this restaurant, I hope when I return next month it will be better.

[docsconz]

xyz123, interesting report and welcome to eGullet. Since your experience is so much different than mine, I can only imagine it was an off night. I have yet to dine at ADNY, but Bouley has been one of the most disappointing meals I've ever had (at the original). At the new Bouley I had a fine meal, but then thefre have been a lot of negative reports about that restaurant. Nevertheless, given the quality of the kitchen, staff and crew at Per Se, I am surprised that there would be any off nights.

[juuceman]

Then again, it doesn't sound as though the restaurant has been entirely consistent here either. Perhaps someone will just ask what the policy is and the reasons for it.

has everyone eating at per se to date been a rescheduled reservation?? if not, this could explain the variances in service..