Mincemeat Pie

[tjaehnigen]

Mrs. TJ and Mrs. TJ-Mom and Mrs. TJ-Sis are all getting together to try to make a mincemeat pie in the next couple of weeks. They have a recipe, but it fails on how to clearly execute the ingredients in a way that will result in the finest quality mincemeat to go into the pie (the pie and crust and so on are definitely NOT the problem, it's how to create and prepare the mincemeat).

So, if any of you have any tips or sources of info on how to prepare a proper mincemeat filling for a mincemeat pie, including any recipes you're willing to share, PLEASE DO!!!

[jackal10]

So, if any of you have any tips or sources of info on how to prepare a proper mincemeat filling for a mincemeat pie, including any recipes you're willing to share, PLEASE DO!!!

Its in glorious technicolour in the eGCI Autumn and Festive Preserves unit. Click here.

Edited November 11, 2003 by jackal10 (log)

[tjaehnigen]

That link was great. Thanks. However, I still have a question, which I will post here, too (as well as on the question thread indicated on the link you posted)----

I have a question about the mince pie recipe.

There is a reference to the meat part of the 'mincemeat', but it was not included in the recipe. I am interested in creating a completely authentic mincemeat pie -- thus it needs to include the meat.

Got any tips or suggestions? The recipes I have found thus far talk about ground meat, but it does not clearly state if it is to be groud prior to cooking or only after cooking (and whether or not the mixture is to cool first before continuing with the recipe, etc). It also does not give indications as to time needed to cook, or even until a certain event occurs (like 'until the onions are soft' as an example).

So, if you have any tips on how to include meat in the pie and in what manner, I would be very interested in this. THANKS!

[jackal10]

So, if you have any tips on how to include meat in the pie and in what manner, I would be very interested in this. THANKS!

The short answer is add cooked, chopped ox-tongue in the same amount as the suet.

The (very) long answer ...

If you want to be really authentic, I give the original sources. I reproduce below some original recipes from books in my library, that should be safely out of copyright. Let us know how you get on. I've translated the old long s to modern ones. A Neat was a cow. Pippins are apples. A coffin was a raised pie crust, usually hot water pastry.

From "The Closet of Eminently Learned Sir Kenelm Digby Bt, opened by his Son" 1669.

This was originally a sort of notebook, so it is full of additions and corrections.

MY LADY OF PORTLAND'S MINCED PYES

Take four pounds of Beef, Veal or Neat's Tongues, and eight pounds of Suet; mince the meat and the Suet very small before you put them together. Then mingle them well together and mince it very small and put to it six pounds of Currants washed and picked very clean. Then take the peel of two Limons, and half a score of Pippins, and mince them very small. The take above an Ounce of Nutmeg, a quarter Ounce of Mace, some Cloves and Cinnamon, and put them together, and sweeten them with Rose-water and Sugar. And when you are ready to put them into your Paste take Citron and Orangiadoe, and slice them very thin and lay them upon the meat. If you please put Dates on top of them. And put amongst the meat an Ounce of Caraway seeds. Be sure you have very fine paste.

My Lady of Portland told me since, that she finds Neats-tongues to be the best flesh for Pies. Parboil them first. For the proportion of ingredients she likes best is to take equal parts of flesh, of Suet, of currants and of Raisins of the Sun. The other things are in proportion as is said above. You may either put the Raisins in whole, or stone the greatest part and Mince them with the Meat. Keep some whole ones to lay a bed of them at the top of the Pye, when all is in. You will do well to stick the Candid Orange-peel and green Citron peel into the meat. You may put a little Sack or Greek Muscadine into each Pye. A little Amber-Sugar doth well here. A pound of flesh, and a proportionality of all things else is enough for a large family.

ANOTHER WAY OF MAKING EXCELLENT MINCED PYES OF MY LADY PORTLAND

PArboil Neats-tongues. The Peel and hash them with as much as they weight of Beef-Suet and stoned Raisins and picked Currants. Chop all exceeding small, like Pap. Employ therin at least an hour more than ordinarily is used. The mingle a very little Sugar with them, and a little wine, and thrust in up and down some thin slices of green Candyed Citron-peel, An put this into coffins of fine light well reared crust. Half an hour baking will be enough. If you strew a few Carvi comfits on the top, it will not be amiss.

MINCED PYES

My Lady Lasson makes her finest minced Pyes of Neats-tongues. But she holdeth the most savoury ones to be of Veal and Mutton in equal parts very small minced. Her finest crust is made by sprinkling the flower (as much as is needed) with cold water, and then working the past with little pieces of raw butter in good quantity. So that she useth neither hot water, nor melted butter in them; and this makes the crust short and light. After all the meat and seasoning, and Plums and Citron peel etc is in the Coffin, she puts a little Ambered-sugar upon it.thus: Grind much two grains of Ambergreece and half a one of Musk, with a little piece of hard loaf sugar. This will serve six or eight pyes, strewed all over the top. Then cover it with a Liddle, and set it in the oven

About 120 years later, meat in the pie was going out of fashion.

This is from John Farley "The London Art of Cookery" My edition is the eighth of 1796. John Farley was "Principal Cook at the London Tavern", and renowned for his potted and preserved meats.

Mince Pie

Take a Neat's tongue and boil it two hours; then skin it and chop it as small as possible. Chop very small three pound of beef suet, the same quantity of good baking apples, four pounds of currants, clean washed, well picked and dried before the fire, a pound of jar raisins stoned and chopped small, and a pound of powder sugar. Mix them well together with half an ounce of mace, the same quantity of grated nutmeg, a quarter of an ounce of cloves, the same quantity of cinnamon, and a pint of French Brandy. Make a rich puff paste, and as you fill up the pie put in a little candied citron and orange cut into pieces. Put close down in a pot what mincemeat you have to spare and cover it up; but never put any citron or orange to it till you use it.

Or you may make your pie in this manner, which is considered by some the best way. Shred three pounds of suet very fine, and chopped as small as possible. Take two pound of raisins stoned , and chopped as fine as possible; two pounds of currant nicely picked, washed and dried at the fire; half a hundred of fine pippins pared, cored and chopped small; half a pound of fine sugar pounded fine; a quarter of an ounce of mace, the same quantity of cloves, and two large nutmegs, all beat fine. Put all together in a great pan, and mix them well with half a pint of brandy and the same quantity of sack. Put it close down into a stone pan, and it will keep good for months. When you make your pies , take a little dish, something bigger than a soup plate, and lay a very thin crust all over it; then lay a thin layer of meat, then a thin layer of citron, cut very thin; then a layer of mincemeat and a layer of orange peel cut thin. Pour over that a little mincemeat, and squeeze in the juice of half a fine Seville Orange or lemon. Then lay on your crust and bake it nicely. These pyes eat very well when cold; and if you make them in little patties mix your meat and your swaetmeats accordingly, If you choose to have meat in your pies, you may take two pounds of the inside of a sirloin of beef boiled, chopped as fine as possible, and mixed with the rest; or you may parboil a neats's tongue and treat it as above directed.

Scotland was a little more old-fashioned. "Mistress Margaret Dods" (a pen name from Scott's Waverly Novels, keeper of the Cleikum Inn, St Ronan) in the Cook and Housewife's Manual (my copy is 4th Edition, 1829) gives

814 Mince Pies (We reccomend to every young housekeeper to adopt this favourite preparation in the receipt of her own grandmother. This ought to produce the best Christmas pies)

These are made in an endless variety of ways. Indeed every family receipt-book teems with prescriptions. We select what is, after experiment and mature consideration we considered the best formula.

Par-roast or bake slightly a couple of pounds of the fine lean of good beef or tongue. Mince this or scrape it. Mince also two pounds of fresh suet, two of apples,pared and cored, three pounds of currants, rubbed, picked and dried, and a pound and a half of good raisins stoned. Let the things be seperately minced till fine, but not so fine as to run together; then mix them with a pound of beat sugar, and add a teaspoonful of salt, a half-ounce of ground ginger, the same weight of allspice and bruised coriander seeds, some beat cloves and two nutmegs grated, the juice and rind two lemons and two Seville oranges, half a pound of candied lemon and orange peel, and quarter of a pound of candied citron, sliced. Mix the seasonings equally with the meat. Keep the minced-meat close pressed in cans in a cool dry place. Put half a pint of brandy, or pineapple rum into a basin with double that quantity of Maderia or Sherry, and half a pint of orange flower water. When to be used cover pans of any size, small saucers, or a small pie dish with puff or plain paste, and moisten the meat, if hard, with a little of the wine and brandy and fill the pies. Put a cover of puff paste over them, or if plain paste, ice it. Pare the edges neatly, and mark the top with a paste-knife. Half an hour in a moderate oven will bake them. Slip them out of the tins, and serve them hot. - OBS Mince-pies may be made cheaper, and yet very good by substitutung gravy for wine; or by using home-made wine (ginger wine is best), by lessening the quantity of expensive fruits and spiceries and taking any bit of lean dressed beef the larder affords or a piece of double tripe boiled, minced fine.

815 - Superlative Mince Pies Rub with salt and mixed spices a fat bullocks tongue. Let it lie for three days, and parboil, and mince or scrape it. Mince seperately three pounds of Zante currants, picked, plumped and dried, a dozen of lemon pippin apples, pared and cored, and a pound of blanched almonds with a few bitter ones. Mix the mince and add half a pound of candied citron and orange peel minced, and an ounce of beat cinnamon and cloves, with the juice and grated rind of of three or four lemons, half an ounce of salt, and the same quantity of allspice, quarter of a pound of fine sugar pounded, and a pint and a half of Maderia, the same quantity of brandy and orange-flower-water. Line the pans with rich puff-paste and serve the pies hot with burnt brandy. OBS The brandy should be burnt at table, as it is used.

Edited: typos

Edited November 11, 2003 by jackal10 (log)

[tjaehnigen]

Thank you so, so much!!!!

[dillaye]

This is my first post, but I've been reading for a couple weeks and have learned so much! Anyway, I was wondering where suet can be purchased. I'm probably not going to do mincemeat this year, but I do want to make my mother's recipe for Indian Pudding, which includes suet. Thanks.

[Katherine]

Speaking as a person who likes the old-fashioned long-cooked mincemeat...

One year I made a batch adapted from The Joy of Cooking, using fresh fruit, including both apples and pears, lots of dried fruit, spices, and canned sour cherries. No "candied" fruit, only dried. The key ingredient, of course, was lots of pork (the all-purpose meat). It cooks slowly, two hours according to the recipe, and makes enough for about 20 pies.

With all that meat in there, you get to eat dessert for supper.

[Carolyn Tillie]

This is my first post, but I've been reading for a couple weeks and have learned so much! Anyway, I was wondering where suet can be purchased. I'm probably not going to do mincemeat this year, but I do want to make my mother's recipe for Indian Pudding, which includes suet. Thanks.

Usually, if you ask your butcher the day before he starts cutting, he will save you some. Not something often found pre-packaged, but thrown away. A good butcher will give it to you.

[eskimoted]

Good article in the Independent.

http://enjoyment.independent.co.uk/food_an...sp?story=467119

I've made mincemeat over many Xmases and this is pretty much the same as I've done - it tastes good - maybe I add more liquor. If you make it without the meat in it, the mincemeat will keep and improve in flavour. Make it weeks or months in advance.

[MGLloyd]

Good article in the Independent.

http://enjoyment.independent.co.uk/food_an...sp?story=467119

I've made mincemeat over many Xmases and this is pretty much the same as I've done - it tastes good - maybe I add more liquor. If you make it without the meat in it, the mincemeat will keep and improve in flavour. Make it weeks or months in advance.

I jsut carefully read the recipe and thought it looked pretty good. I do have a question however. What is in 'ground mixed spice'? I am unaware of the North American equivalent.

[jackal10]

Its a mix of sweet spices - cinnamon, nutmeg, cloves.

Use pumkin spice or quatre epices, near enough.

Personally i just use nutmeg and ground cloves in equal proportions. I find cinnamon can be bitter when cooked.

[helenjp]

Oh good, a place to ask my question...

"vegetarian suet"...what is it made from? Is it different from solid vegetable fats of other kinds??

I can't get beef suet here in Japan anyway, and I usually use a grated apple recipe (had a nice grape one, when I lived where grapes were cheaper...), but I'm curious about all the references to vegetarian suet that I see on the web.

This year I'm thinking of reviving a recipe my mother used to make, for strange little knobs filled with currants and lots of chopped fresh mint...

[Tepee]

Jackal's thread is AMAZING!

I posted a recipe here some time ago, for mini mincetarts. It's quite good.

[KarenS]

This has been on my production list for a week- when I make (my fourth) batch I will get to a recipe. I use dried fruit, lemon, orange, apples, spices, brandy, sugar (no meat or suet).

Dried:

apricots, cherries, cranberries, pears, currants,figs, raisins