Keeping the Crunch

[Darienne]

I have been going back looking through every post I can find about putting crunchy bits: praline, feuilletine, etc, into other ingredients and retaining the crunch factor. The answer has been that only a butter ganache will do this.

So, I have been experimenting with crushed pecan praline in cream...sog (as expected) cream cheese...sog ; and now the latest, butter...sog. I did not expect sog in butter. A butter ganache is supposed to preserve the crunch factor.

My next step is to put the praline into chocolate only. It should stay crunchy? Yes?

Also my next-door neighbor/landlady/friend says to me...'well, how do they keep the crunch in speciality ice creams?' I sure don't know.

All comments and advice gratefully accepted.

(Oh, I am working up to making a gianduja butter ganache and sandwiching it in between chocolate wafers, but in the meantime am fully occupied with playing Ice Cream Lady with my new Cuisinart toy.)

[David J.]

You can coat the crunchy bits in barrier substance.

I dipped carmalized bits of sugar in cocoa butter when I made a "Creme Brulee" truffle and it preserved them. Next time though I would just use a very thin dark chocolate as pure cocoa butter isn't needed and doesn't taste all that great if it is thick.

[Lisa Shock]

You're trying to make a barrier against moisture, which can come from two sources: other items in your products, or, the environment.

Butter doesn't work, unless it's clarified, or anhydrous, because butter is approximately 20% water. Cream cheese is full of water, so is cream.

Cocoa butter and chocolate make good barriers, as long as your item isn't stored above their melting point. Some ice cream makers use this as a barrier -Breyer's has a flavor with chocolate covered toasted almonds. (although I gave up on eating Breyer's since they started using gums in the formula, so my info may be old)

Commercial ice cream makers may be using waxes, alternate sugars like isomalt, and oils to coat their product. Some of these work longer than others.

Good luck with the chocolate, it should hold up for a while if it's tempered.

[Darienne]

You can coat the crunchy bits in barrier substance.

I dipped carmalized bits of sugar in cocoa butter when I made a "Creme Brulee" truffle and it preserved them.  Next time though I would just use a very thin dark chocolate as pure cocoa butter isn't needed and doesn't taste all that great if it is thick.

←

Thank you. I like that...a barrier substance.

[Darienne]

You're trying to make a barrier against moisture, which can come from two sources: other items in your products, or, the environment.

Butter doesn't work, unless it's clarified, or anhydrous, because butter is approximately 20% water. Cream cheese is full of water, so is cream.

Cocoa butter and chocolate make good barriers, as long as your item isn't stored above their melting point. Some ice cream makers use this as a barrier -Breyer's has a flavor with chocolate covered toasted almonds. (although I gave up on eating Breyer's since they started using gums in the formula, so my info may be old)

Commercial ice cream makers may be using waxes, alternate sugars like isomalt, and oils to coat their product. Some of these work longer than others.

Good luck with the chocolate, it should hold up for a while if it's tempered.

←

Thank you for the information.

Now this is too funny. Just now I googled 'barrier substance crunch' and guess what I got? This thread and your answer.

Added: but what about the butter ganache? Does the chocolate factor overrule the butter factor?

Edited February 27, 2009 by Darienne (log)

[Lisa Shock]

The butter factor still outweighs the chocolate factor in the ganache because the water is still present, and, depending on the recipe, the water still represents 3% - 10% of the mass of the finished product.

You may also have disadvantages based on the humidity of your room. Commercial producers often control this aspect of production, it may be too difficult for you to affect any noticable change in this.

Pretty funny about Google, I had no idea that our words got spidered so quickly!!!

[Darienne]

The butter factor still outweighs the chocolate factor in the ganache because the water is still present, and, depending on the recipe, the water still represents 3% - 10% of the mass of the finished product.

But if the butter is still an important factor and crunch is not supported by the presence of butter, then why is it that the crunch of fueilletine is preserved in a butter ganache?

Am I missing some point here?

Thanks.

[Lisa Shock]

I'm sorry, somewhere alnong the way, I assumed that you're tried butter ganache already. I just went and read the thread on the topic. Kerry Beal states that she usually uses a ratio of 1 part butter to 2-3 parts chocolate to keep things crispy. That means she's dealing with 5% - 7% possible water in the mix, and maybe that amount is low enough to keep things crispy. I'd also venture a guess that the mixture may lose a bit of moisture due to the melting and handling.

[Lior]

I don't know what you are trying to make but how about no butter. You can use chocoalte and nut pastes or caramelized nut pastes with the crunchies.

[Darienne]

Thanks Lisa and Lior for further posts on this tricky subject.

No, I have not tried the butter ganache yet, but will today if I can. I will also try just plain tempered chocolate.

What I am trying to do is two-fold.

- an experiment, more or less, with each ingredient or pair of ingredients to work out the 'crunch factor' not only theoretically, but also for my own satisfaction.

- want to make a gianduja ganache with crunchy praline bits in it to use as a filling for a pair of dark chocolate discs. Kerry Beal posted a photo of this confection on Lior's thread on 'Using Gianduja'. (I don't know how to bring something from one post to another.)

Mostly I just crawl/lurch along trying this, trying that, having a series of minor failures as I try each thing, repeat it with better success, etc. I have so little context in which to put any of this, never having spent any time baking in the decades of my marriage. Did not grow up knowing any of this at my Mother's knee. This is all new and exciting to me. So I learn, learn, learn... I had little idea that this world existed.

Edited February 28, 2009 by Darienne (log)

[Lior]

Darienne, I would really consider chocolate with praline (caramelized nut paste) with feulletine. It is great. I make dark choc with hazelnut praline and feulletine, mikl choco with hazelnut praline with bres(caramelized hazelnuts tiney pieces) and white choc with almond praline with nibs. They are one of my favs. You slab it, cut it and dip. If you want like in Kerry's picture, whip up gianduja and then add the crunchy things and then pipe onto your discs. I need to get piping tips and learn how to pipe like in that picture!!! I put coffee grains into my gianduja in my picture on that thread with cocoa covered nuts on the top.

Edited February 28, 2009 by Lior (log)

[Darienne]

Darienne, I would really consider chocolate with praline (caramelized nut paste) with feulletine. It is great. I make dark choc with hazelnut praline and feulletine, mikl choco with hazelnut praline with bres(caramelized hazelnuts tiney pieces) and white choc with almond praline with nibs. They are one of my favs. You slab it, cut it and dip. If you want like in Kerry's picture, whip up gianduja and then add the crunchy things and then pipe onto your discs. I need to get piping tips and learn how to pipe like in that picture!!! I put coffee grains into my gianduja in my picture on that thread with cocoa covered nuts on the top.

It all sounds and looks delicious (this little face does not mean 'raz'; it mean 'yumm')

Thank you for the information and the inspiration. Oh my, one more thing to put on the list of things to make!!!

[David J.]

- want to make a gianduja ganache with crunchy praline bits in it to use as a filling for a pair of dark chocolate discs.  Kerry Beal posted a photo of this confection on Lior's thread on 'Using Gianduja'.  (I don't know how to bring something from one post to another.)

"Crunchy Hazelnut Praline" is one of my most popular truffle flavors:

6 1/2 ounces blanched hazelnuts, Toasted

6 1/2 ounces sugar

8 ounces butter, Room temperature

16 ounces Milk chocolate, Tempered

I carmalize the sugar, pour it out on a Silpat, then break it up and run it through a burr grinder on a coarse setting (rather than a whirly grinder). This gives me uniform cruncy bits and no sugar dust.

Recently I've started using Bob's Red Mill Hazelnut meal/flour instead of grinding whole nuts. Either way give it a nice toasting in the oven to bring out the flavor.

Then temper the chocolate, wisk in the butter, add hazelnuts and crunchy bits and pipe into molds. This recipie will fill about three trays of the standard Geodesic mold.

I like to call this "micro-crunch" as you get lots of little crunches in each bite, but no jaw breakers. I haven't done a scientific test to determine how long the crunch lasts, but so far it all the truffles have been consumed well before failure.

[Darienne]

"Crunchy Hazelnut Praline" is one of my most popular truffle flavors:

6 1/2 ounces blanched hazelnuts, Toasted

6 1/2 ounces sugar

8 ounces butter, Room temperature

16 ounces Milk chocolate, Tempered

I carmalize the sugar, pour it out on a Silpat, then break it up and run it through a burr grinder on a coarse setting (rather than a whirly grinder).  This gives me uniform cruncy bits and no sugar dust.

Recently I've started using Bob's Red Mill  Hazelnut meal/flour instead of grinding whole nuts.  Either way give it a nice toasting in the oven to bring out the flavor.

Then temper the chocolate, wisk in the butter, add hazelnuts and crunchy bits and pipe into molds.  This recipie will fill about three trays of the standard Geodesic mold.

I like to call this "micro-crunch" as you get lots of little crunches in each bite, but no jaw breakers.  I haven't done a scientific test to determine how long the crunch lasts, but so far it all the truffles have been consumed well before failure.

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If I understand correctly, you caramelize the sugar only, with no hazelnuts in it. The crunch is sugar only. I'll look in the grocery store for the Hazelnut meal next.

Thanks.

Edited March 1, 2009 by Darienne (log)

[David J.]

If I understand correctly, you caramelize the sugar only, with no hazelnuts in it.  The crunch is sugar only.  I'll look in the grocery store for the Hazelnut meal next.

Thanks. 

That's correct.

There's two ways of making praline, cooking the nuts in the sugar as you carmalize and toasting them seperately and adding them to the carmalized sugar just before pouring it out.

I decided that it didn't make a big difference and processing the combination was problematic so I keep them seperate. I could be wrong, but I don't see how it could be different from the second method.