2008 Michelin elevates restaurants

[MaxH]

The new 2008 Bay Area Michelin restaurant guide was just released. Two restaurants were elevated to two-star ("worth a detour") awards: Chej TJ in Mountain View and Meadowood in St. Helena.

There are now six two-star establishments and one three-star (the French Laundry) in the Bay Area.

Well done!

Press-relase link

[SiseFromm]

It's nice to see Redd got a star. Is the guide for Southern California out yet? I searched but yielded no real results.

[samgiovese]

The List

MICHELIN STARS

Total number One star (*) Two stars (**) Three stars (***)

of restaurants

384 27 6 1

DINING: 384 Restaurants

58 Establishments offering a simple menu

at less than $25

50 "Our inspectors' favorites," establishments

offering a menu with two dishes and a glass of

wine or a dessert at less than $40

Cuisines included in Guide: 36

American Chinese Japanese Seafood

Asian Contemporary Latin American Southwestern

Bakery French Mediterranean Spanish

Barbeque Fusion Mexican Steakhouse

Basque Gastropub Moroccan Thai

Brazilian Greek Persian Turkish

Burmese Indian Peruvian Vegan

Californian International Pizza Vegetarian

Caribbean Italian Portuguese Vietnamese

ONE STAR (*) (by neighborhood)

ESTABLISHMENT CITY NEIGHBORHOOD

Acquerello San Francisco Nob Hill

Ame (new) San Francisco SoMa

Auberge du Soleil Rutherford Napa Valley

Bistro Jeanty Yountville Napa Valley

Bouchon Yountville Napa Valley

Boulevard San Francisco SoMa

Chez Panisse Berkeley East of San Francisco

Coi (new) San Francisco North Beach Area

Cortez (new) San Francisco Financial District

Dining Room at the Ritz- San Francisco Nob Hill

Carlton

Farmhouse Inn & Forestville Sonoma County

Restaurant

Fifth Floor San Francisco SoMa

Fleur de Lys San Francisco Financial District

Gary Danko San Francisco North Beach

K & L Bistro Sebastopol Sonoma County

La Folie San Francisco Nob Hill

La Toque Rutherford Napa Valley

Madrona Manor (new) Healdsburg Sonoma County

Martini House (new) St. Helena Napa Valley

Masa's San Francisco Nob Hill

One Market (new) San Francisco SoMa

Quince San Francisco Marina District

Range San Francisco Mission District

Redd (new) Yountville Napa Valley

Rubicon San Francisco Financial District

Sushi-Ran Sausalito North of San Francisco

Terra St. Helena Napa Valley

TWO STARS (**) (by neighborhood)

ESTABLISHMENT CITY NEIGHBORHOOD

Aqua San Francisco Financial District

Chez TJ (new) Mountain View South of San Francisco

Cyrus Healdsburg Sonoma County

Manresa Los Gatos South of San Francisco

Meadowood, The Restaurant St. Helena Napa Valley

(new)

Michael Mina San Francisco Financial District

THREE STARS (***)

ESTABLISHMENT CITY NEIGHBORHOOD

The French Laundry Yountville Napa Valley

BIB GOURMAND (Under $40)

ESTABLISHMENT CITY NEIGHBORHOOD

A 16 San Francisco Marina District

Annalien Napa Napa Valley

Bar Tartine San Francisco Mission District

BarBersQ Napa Napa Valley

Bay Wolf Oakland East of San Francisco

Betelnut Pejiu Wu San Francisco Marina District

Cafe Gibraltar El Granada South of San Francisco

Celadon Napa Napa Valley

Clementine San Francisco Richmond and Sunset

Cook St. Helena St. Helena Napa Valley

Cucina Paradiso Petaluma Sonoma County

Delfina San Francisco Mission District

Gaylord Sausalito North of San Francisco

Hong Kong Flower Lounge Millbrae South of San Francisco

Insalata's San Anselmo North of San Francisco

Junnoon Palo Alto South of San Francisco

Kokkari Estiatorio San Francisco North Beach Area

Koo San Francisco Richmond and Sunset

Le Charm San Francisco SoMa

Mamacita San Francisco Marina District

Mirepoix Windsor Sonoma County

Namu San Francisco Richmond and Sunset

Nopa San Francisco Civic Center

Olivia Berkeley East of San Francisco

Osake Santa Rosa Sonoma County

Perbacco San Francisco Financial District

Poleng San Francisco Civic Center

Pres A Vi San Francisco Marina District

Rin's Thai Sonoma Sonoma County

Risibisi Petaluma Sonoma County

rnm San Francisco Civic Center

Sauce San Francisco Civic Center

Scott Howard San Francisco North Beach Area

Slanted Door (The) San Francisco Financial District

Slow Club San Francisco Mission District

Sociale San Francisco Marina District

South Park Cafe San Francisco SoMa

Tablespoon San Francisco Nob Hill

Tamarindo Oakland East of San Francisco

Tokyo Go Go San Francisco Mission District

Tommaso's San Francisco North Beach Area

TWO San Francisco SoMa

2223 San Francisco Castro District

Universal Cafe San Francisco Mission District

Vanessa's Bistro Berkeley East of San Francisco

Venticello San Francisco Nob Hill

Willi's Seafood & Raw Bar Healdsburg Sonoma County

Willi's Wine Bar Santa Rosa Sonoma County

Yank Sing San Francisco SoMa

Zuzu Napa Napa Valley

[hzrt8w]

Looking at their list on Chinese restaurants, I am disappointed to not see Koi Palace in there (The "BIB GOURMAND (Under $40)" catagory). Instead, it was Hong Kong Flower Lounge and Yank Sing.

I don't know how these lists are composed. It seems to me as if someone just took the list from last year (or every year) and transfered everything over. Hong Kong Flower Lounge used to be good but has degraded (and more than a year or two). For my money, I would much rather give to:

Fook Yuen (Milbrae)

Zen Peninsula (Milbrae)

Koi Palace (Daly City)

May Flower (Milpitas)

[tupac17616]

way to go, michelin. one of just two bib gourmands in berkeley is now closed...

[Carolyn Tillie]

I don't know how these lists are composed.  It seems to me as if someone just took the list from last year (or every year) and transfered everything over.

Not entirely - Bushi-Tei has had their star removed, thank goodness... as well as Dry Creek Kitchen (another "gee, someone else realized how mediocre this place is" moment)

7 new:

Ame

Coi

Cortez

One Market

Redd

Madrona Manor

Martini House

Edited October 23, 2007 by Carolyn Tillie (log)

[rjwong]

It's nice to see Redd got a star.  Is the guide for Southern California out yet?  I searched but yielded no real results.

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SiseFromm, you sound like you want to be the first kid in your block to get the new Southern California Michelin guide ...

You want to make any predictions? Any 3 *'s?

[MaxH]

Is the guide for Southern California out yet?

Next week if I remember right. They're releasing the different US guides in successive weeks, New York first.

[Carlsbad]

After seeing what they did in the Bay Area, I'll pass on the SoCal edition.

[tupac17616]

After seeing what they did in the Bay Area, I'll pass on the SoCal edition.

what do you see as the biggest mistakes or oversights?

[docsconz]

One star for The Dining Room at the Ritz Carlton and not two? I would have liked to see Canteen get at least a Bib Gourmand if not a star. Also conspicuous by absence are Incanto and Zuni Cafe.

[SiseFromm]

SiseFromm, you sound like you want to be the first kid in your block to get the new Southern California Michelin guide ...

You want to make any predictions? Any 3 *'s?

I'm definitely eager to see the So Cal list! I can't really imagine any 3 *'s though, can you? I think the bigger candidates (Sona, Providence, etc.) will maybe push into the 2 * arena, but my guess is there will be no more than 4 restaurants in the area with 2 *'s. However, I think there will be plenty of 1 *'s (Lucques, Campanille, etc.). What is your prediction? You're probably more aware of the local market and Michelin's standards, so what is your call?

[Carolyn Tillie]

One star for The Dining Room at the Ritz Carlton and not two? I would have liked to see Canteen get at least a Bib Gourmand if not a star. Also conspicuous by absence are Incanto and Zuni Cafe.

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Did you read my recent experience of The Dining Room at the Ritz here? Definitely one star and quite far from two...

Concur on the rest of your sentiments except Zuni -- it really is hit-and-miss with my last two visits more on the miss... A little more consistency is needed there but Incanto is a great shining star in this city.

[Swicks]

SiseFromm, you sound like you want to be the first kid in your block to get the new Southern California Michelin guide ...

You want to make any predictions? Any 3 *'s?

I'm definitely eager to see the So Cal list! I can't really imagine any 3 *'s though, can you? I think the bigger candidates (Sona, Providence, etc.) will maybe push into the 2 * arena, but my guess is there will be no more than 4 restaurants in the area with 2 *'s. However, I think there will be plenty of 1 *'s (Lucques, Campanille, etc.). What is your prediction? You're probably more aware of the local market and Michelin's standards, so what is your call?

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Count me in as someone who is eager as well....I definitely concur with Jason's predictions. I can see Stonehill and Studio maybe getting some consideration in the two star range. I wonder if Marche Moderne is in the mix? I can see that as a two banger....

[docsconz]

One star for The Dining Room at the Ritz Carlton and not two? I would have liked to see Canteen get at least a Bib Gourmand if not a star. Also conspicuous by absence are Incanto and Zuni Cafe.

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Did you read my recent experience of The Dining Room at the Ritz here? Definitely one star and quite far from two...

Concur on the rest of your sentiments except Zuni -- it really is hit-and-miss with my last two visits more on the miss... A little more consistency is needed there but Incanto is a great shining star in this city.

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My recent experience this past week at TDR@TRC was quite positive. I will be reporting it shortly.

I haven't been to Zuni enough to have a strong opinion on it, though my one brief experience was positive. I think the omission is particularly notable given its relative fame and stature. I agree about Incanto deserving more than what Michelin bestowed. It should have at least received a bib gourmand if not a star.

[SiseFromm]

Count me in as someone who is eager as well....I definitely concur with Jason's predictions. I can see Stonehill and Studio maybe getting some consideration in the two star range. I wonder if Marche Moderne is in the mix? I can see that as a two banger....

If I had to guess, I'd say those mentioned in your post are going to see 1 *. I'm not sure any will move into the 2 * range and I think Marche, eligible maybe for a single *, was probably off the radar until the next publication. I would be really surprised to see any 2 * restaurants in Orange County, but who knows?

[AlexNoir]

Count me in as someone who is eager as well....I definitely concur with Jason's predictions. I can see Stonehill and Studio maybe getting some consideration in the two star range. I wonder if Marche Moderne is in the mix? I can see that as a two banger....

If I had to guess, I'd say those mentioned in your post are going to see 1 *. I'm not sure any will move into the 2 * range and I think Marche, eligible maybe for a single *, was probably off the radar until the next publication. I would be really surprised to see any 2 * restaurants in Orange County, but who knows?

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I agree, Jason. I've never been to Studio, but from what I've heard it seems to at least have the "environment" of a two-star restaurant. I can't speak to anything else. I can easily see Stonehill getting one star but not two. Does anyone think any of the other players in OC will be considered for a star (Pinot Provence comes to mind - even though it sounds like the quality has declined recently)? I think Marche Moderne is probably too new for a star, but seeing as bistro style restaurants up in Napa (Bistro Jeanty and Bouchon), I don't think it's crazy to assume MM could get one in the next publication. As for LA, I haven't been to enough restaurants to judge, but I would say that Providence might be the only 2 star candidate. I've heard Sona is horribly inconsistent which has kept me away, but who knows? I'm curious if our resident LA restaurant expert, rjwong sees any other 2-star candidates in the area...

[Carolyn Tillie]

Count me in as someone who is eager as well....I definitely concur with Jason's predictions. I can see Stonehill and Studio maybe getting some consideration in the two star range. I wonder if Marche Moderne is in the mix? I can see that as a two banger....

If I had to guess, I'd say those mentioned in your post are going to see 1 *. I'm not sure any will move into the 2 * range and I think Marche, eligible maybe for a single *, was probably off the radar until the next publication. I would be really surprised to see any 2 * restaurants in Orange County, but who knows?

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I agree, Jason. I've never been to Studio, but from what I've heard it seems to at least have the "environment" of a two-star restaurant. I can't speak to anything else. I can easily see Stonehill getting one star but not two. Does anyone think any of the other players in OC will be considered for a star (Pinot Provence comes to mind - even though it sounds like the quality has declined recently)? I think Marche Moderne is probably too new for a star, but seeing as bistro style restaurants up in Napa (Bistro Jeanty and Bouchon), I don't think it's crazy to assume MM could get one in the next publication. As for LA, I haven't been to enough restaurants to judge, but I would say that Providence might be the only 2 star candidate. I've heard Sona is horribly inconsistent which has kept me away, but who knows? I'm curious if our resident LA restaurant expert, rjwong sees any other 2-star candidates in the area...

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If Michelin considers The Dining at the Ritz a 2-star here in San Francisco, than Stonehill Tavern would definitely rate one star, not two.

For me, comparing the two, The Dining Room at the Ritz would rate one star and Stonehill Tavern would not get one at all, but I'm pretty bitchy that way.

[Swicks]

Interesting....

I guess my understanding of really what makes a 1 vs a 2 is not clear.

I guess my main question is how much of a factor formalness of the restaurant plays into it, looking at the 1's in San Francisco some of them (that I have been to, vary widely in formality.) After some of this explanations I think it definitely makes sense that some of the OC places are in the one range not two.

Edited October 23, 2007 by Swicks (log)

[MaxH]

For me, comparing the two, The Dining Room at the Ritz would rate one star ...

Fair enough as a testimonial, but did you only go there once, Carolyn?

A professional guide like Michelin, if any good, will labor to transcend anecdote to estimate, from enough evidence, a typical diner's experience. I know respected restaurants (like the one above just raised from one to two stars) where anecdotal accounts range widely. Some of them are demonstrably atypical, or even show customer attitude evident in the comments, but these are not factors people seem open to considering when they post (or defend) their resolute opinions. Especially jaundiced opinions. Actually I have more and longer experience with that particular restaurant than almost any other customer, enough to've seen its ups and downs and strengths and weaknesses. Enough therefore to gauge the reviews by the restaurant, rather than vice versa. Enough to spot as misleading a snide comment by one (anonymous, unnacountable) diner, a comment chosen nevertheless for inclusion in a survey-based guide. Enough experience to spot as atypical, even bizarre, some postings on a restaurant-comment site whose incentives include invitation to parties "comped" by some of very restaurants rated (according to both word of mouth and the Wall St. Journal). These sources are what the Michelin must be compared to when criticizing it, for they're the alternatives. (They, and countless bloggers posting opinions from random perspectives with little fact checking, accountability, or sense of need for these things, but lots of opinion.)

[Carolyn Tillie]

For me, comparing the two, The Dining Room at the Ritz would rate one star ...

Fair enough as a testimonial, but did you only go there once, Carolyn?

A professional guide like Michelin, if any good, will labor to transcend anecdote to estimate, from enough evidence, a typical diner's experience. I know respected restaurants (like the one above just raised from one to two stars) where anecdotal accounts range widely. Some of them are demonstrably atypical, or even show customer attitude evident in the comments, but these are not factors people seem open to considering when they post (or defend) their resolute opinions. Especially jaundiced opinions. Actually I have more and longer experience with that particular restaurant than almost any other customer, enough to've seen its ups and downs and strengths and weaknesses. Enough therefore to gauge the reviews by the restaurant, rather than vice versa. Enough to spot as misleading a snide comment by one (anonymous, unnacountable) diner, a comment chosen nevertheless for inclusion in a survey-based guide. Enough experience to spot as atypical, even bizarre, some postings on a restaurant-comment site whose incentives include invitation to parties "comped" by some of very restaurants rated (according to both word of mouth and the Wall St. Journal). These sources are what the Michelin must be compared to when criticizing it, for they're the alternatives. (They, and countless bloggers posting opinions from random perspectives with little fact checking, accountability, or sense of need for these things, but lots of opinion.)

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Max, in the case of my visit to The Dining Room at the Ritz, while it was my first and so-far only visit, the friends with whom I was dining had been there many multiple times and were equally as shocked at the downhill tumble we experienced through the meal. I find their palates very trustworthy and will not discount a second visit on my own, but as there are so many places I still need to eat, won't be rushing back for a second assessment any time soon.

[Carlsbad]

This is California, not France. It's a different world. What Michelin has done is lump most of the good restaurants in San Francisco as one star. That really doesn't help anyone much.

There is no place in California I've been that could compete with the service (or wine list) at Taillevent, and it has been busted to two stars. It's a different world here. Now that Taillevent is gone, the three stars in Paris cost three times what people pay in San Francisco for the expensive places, not even counting the deflated dollar. The French Laundry is what they are looking for in the Bay Area, and priced accordingly- $240 for the tasting menu, with maybe a supplement or two. It's a wonder they even awarded one star to Chez Panisse. I don't think Aqua would be my first choice for two stars, and since I refuse to go to Michael Mina because of what it did to the St. Francis, I don't know about it.

San Francisco is a great restaurant city. The more I go elsewhere, the better it looks. But Michelin isn't going to get what makes it what it is. Los Angeles probably isn't going to fare better. There will be a bunch of one stars, and maybe a couple of two stars.

[rjwong]

... As for LA, I haven't been to enough restaurants to judge, but I would say that Providence might be the only 2 star candidate. I've heard Sona is horribly inconsistent which has kept me away, but who knows? I'm curious if our resident LA restaurant expert, rjwong sees any other 2-star candidates in the area...

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AlexNoir, flattery will get you everywhere, maybe even to Sona ... Seriously, you should at least give Sona a fair chance and find out for yourself.

I doubt that any LA restaurant will get a Michelin 3 *s. As for 2 *s, I hope Providence, Melisse perhaps, maybe even Ritz-Carlton, Huntington. We'll all find out soon enough.

SiseFromm, maybe we can discuss this matter further ... over dinner ...

Carlsbad, you got me curious. What did Michael Mina do to the St. Francis??

[Carlsbad]

To accomodate his restaurant, they ruined the front lobby and took away one of the best bars in the city.

[Swicks]

San Francisco is a great restaurant city.  The more I go elsewhere, the better it looks.  But Michelin isn't going to get what makes it what it is.  Los Angeles probably isn't going to fare better.  There will be a bunch of one stars, and maybe a couple of two stars.

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Definitely agree with this....