Bux

I met a wine maker in the Cotes du Rhone. Parker had just given his wine a pretty good rating and he was pleased that his bank was pleased. He noted that winemakers in the area speak of "parkerizing" their wines. I.e., making them to Parker's taste. As for CAD empowering architects, it's hard to imagine Gehry's Guggenheim being built without a computer to put it on paper.

Les Andelys rings a bell. Is it not far from Giverny where Monet's garden is? My guess is that the nearest vineyards are towards the Loire. It's not so far away. Certainly one could easily get down, buy wine and return between lunch and dinner. If you're lucky enough to see them over there, try to get to Givery. Unfortunately the gardens get very crowded with tourists. Once a week, I think it's on Mondays, they let artists in to paint. You have to make an advance reservation. They let me in to photograph. It was quite wonderful because the gardens were almost deserted save for a few painters and one photographer. I enjoy sake as well as syrah, although I know even less about sake than I do about syrah.

Let me just sign in as a member of the sweetbread eaters--but you all knew that. Right? My 1961 U.S. English language edition of the Larrouse Gastronomique says: I'm not at all sure this is accurate or correct. It appears they missed the pancreas, but nevertheless, I cite an "authority."I once asked a waiter in Spain for information about the ingredient listed as the stuffing in a braised lamb dish. As she didn't know the words "sweetbread" or "ris" the description I got was the gland that is found only in the young animal. It was, by the way, an unexpectedly rich and delicious dish that made my day.

One of the more interesting things I read in an article linked to on the site is that a rather small percentage of potentially related cases in this country are even checked to see if they are related to Mad Cow disease. Thus reports that it's not appeared here may be reports that we're not looking all that closely. In the article, in the The Wall Street Journal on November 28, 2001, Steve Stecklow says "a close examination of America's mad-cow safety net shows some possible flaws" and goes on to make that seem like an understatement. On the other hand, I've not always found the WSJ to be accurate. I may be overly sensitive to being quoted way out of context by one of their feature writers on the health hazards of raw fish which I routinely eat. Nevertheless there's lots here for those interested in research on the subject. You have to take both sides with a grain of salt, but the scare mongers may be no less credible than the government experts who say there's no reason to worry. Anyone who reads the New York Times regularly should already be aware of flaws in the US efforts to absolutely prevent the problem in the US.

I was going to pop in with the comment that on our last trip to Washington we ate at Jaleo and I recall enjoying it. That trip was some time ago, but I was remined of it as the relative we visited then, just visited us a few weeks ago. Robert however, has raised the stakes above that of a restaurant recommendation thread. The influence of large and influential cooking schools is an interesting question, but not without the chicken and egg consideration. How well do the schools reflect the chefs who teach there and current trends and how much do the set the style of the food for graduating students. Whatever the answers are to that, the rise in interest in chefs. restaurants and food across the country contributes both the standardization and to the importance of the major schools. My guess is that great chefs will more likely be influenced by other great chefs and they will also follow their muse. It's the middleground that will be homogenized. The effect is not unlike MacDonald's which in the end is boring, but which many claim raised the level of food reliability for travelers in uncharted territory. If I read Robert correctly there's MacDonald's, Bennigans, and the individual restaurants of the CIA grad chefs in that order of quality, but the level of expectation is almost known before you enter.

I don't think food sites are any different from any other site, with the exception of those sites designed as destination entertainment sites. Information is central to the reason for the visit and design is the means to get that information to the user. By "design" I'm not referring to the esthetic or decor of the site, but the structural layout and ease of navigation as well as clarity of what's on the site. If a site is pretty or ugly, I'd certainly feel free to offer my subjective opinion, but if a site is designed in such a way that I can't find what I want, it should well be criticised. I suppose you may feel I'm twisting your words, but sometimes I think people have the wrong idea of what design is all about--and designers are among the most confused. There's nothing worse than a pretty site that's poorly designed. ;)

Salt cod puree in a roasted piquillo pepper is a Basque specialty and available in many tapas bars in the Basque area, but the best I've ever had were served as a first course in a hotel-restaurant in Ainhoa, France. More fascinating (to me, at least) is that we had an hors d'oeuvre at AD/NY of brandade de morue that had bits of roasted red pepper in it and it never occurred to me until now, that Ducasse wasn't being creative. He was just adapting the traditional Basque flavor combination. Danielle, I wasn't thrilled by meals in Madrid either, but it was some time ago. I strongly suspect that one has to do one's research before hand. Again there's a palate shift that has to be made when going from France to Spain. Oddly enough I think it's a much harder shift to make than sort we have to do when we eat Asian foods which are really far more different. Maybe it's that we don't expect to have to make the adjustment and expect Spanish food to be just like the French and Italian food we know better. I wish someone with greater experience in this area of Europe would comment on this even if it was to shoot my theory down altogether.

The square behind the Palace Hotel? I remember a street that ran just adjacent to the hotel that had lots of bars. Generally speaking a youngish crowd, but mixed to some extent. Mostly they were bars with tapas. The beverage was the reason to be there, not the tapas. Although I recall enjoying many a slice of bread with something on it, I was rpimarily there for the beer. You can't mean the Plaza Mayor. That's where I am told the best tapas bars are near. My wife was in Madrid quite a few years ago and a cousin and her husband took her on a tour. Each place had a specialty, or even just a single offering. When we were there together, my wife tried to remember where each place was. They were outside the plaza not in it. Some of them were quite good, but I don't think I've had great food in a tapas bar. It's about nibbling and drinking. There was one place, at tiny place, on a main street not so far from the Palace that had a wonderful wood panelled interior and, as I recall, silver plaques on the street. They served exquisite ham and chorizo, but even the inexpensive places serve good ham. I've also found that everything about tapas varies from region to region. In Galicia, you cannot get a drink, or a glass of wine without being offered a bite to eat, be it a slice of sausage or cheese on a round of bread, or a few olives. Once we had a couple of glasses of wine when we arrived in the province and a tray of sausage, cheese and bread was put in front of us. When we asked for the bill, we told the guy behind the counter how many we had taken. He laughed and said they came with the wine. In most other places you pay for every bite. In some places tapas are tiny and in others they can be more substantial. I suppose the Basques are the kings of tapas, as well as generally known to be the best cooks. The scene in the old part of San Sebastian is a don't miss, but it's more something to do than it is competition for a great meal. Then again, if you know where to go, that may be different. When our daughter was at Berastegui for lunch, he told her which bars were best known for what foods and she may well have had better luck. The new square (it got that name centuries ago) in Bilbao is an excellent place for tapas. There are several bars around the perimeter and one that's special in the far corner (that may depend on how you enter the square) with tables outside. Still it's a convivial thing and more about something to have with a drink than the height of gastronomy although the various ingredients may be superb be they ham, or seafood. Certainly its not all rubbery fried calamari in a greasy leaded batter, although some random sampling might convince you that it is just that.

Every forum, sometimes called a "board" as in bulletin board on eGullet needs a coordinator and it needs to prove it can sustain enough traffic to warrant a separate section. I'm less surprised that there's little interest in Spanish food, although I'm saddened by that, than I am in the fact that there's little interest shown in the food of Italy. My initial introduction to food in Spain was spotty at best and my reaction was less than positive. The food has changed, but I think my sophisitication has changed even more. Still it takes a bit of adjustment every time I cross the border to make the mental adjustments that allow me to enjoy and appreciate the food. In spite of the enthusiam I've developed in the past three or four years, I'm not sure I'm qualified to host a board on Spain. Most of my recent eating has been in the north and I don't have a good idea of the country as a whole. That's not to say there is a whole. Spanish regional cooking seems stronger than French today. France is becoming homogenized. I remain a beginning student, but nevertheless a booster of Spanish food. This is not to say I'm an expert on French food, but I feel more comfortable with discussing it in greater detail. As for new boards, that's not going to happen until eGullet.com introduces the new software. I can only say that as the conversations get better and better Jason is also working on improving the structure. I'm quite impressed at how far this venture has come in so short a time. As for this thread, if it's moved, I will leave a link at this location. In some ways it makes sense here just as it makes sense for me to combine a trip to southern France with one to Northern Spain. One particular charm of Spain just south of the Pyrenees, is that while regional cooking is well developed, so is haute cuisine. There are three star restaurants that are as fine and as interesting as those n France and they are clustered closer together than in other parts of Spain.

The whole wine paring thing is interesting and it's like any other pairing. Some things go well together and some less so. Much of this is subjective and some of it is cultural. You'd put salt on your fires, but probably not sugar. On the other hand you might put ketchup, which has both salt and sugar, on your fries. It's not necessarily a white/red thing. Maybe my favorite wine with some sort of food might be a particular red wine, with another red as sceond, but in third place, or maybe first when the mood strikes it's a particular white. Red and white are too broad a categrory separation and all reds are not similar, nor are whites. Shriaz/syrah to sake? Doesn't even begin to compute in my mind. Far worse than red and white wines. As A. Balic notes, all varietals produce different wines in different climates and with different winemakers. Some grapes have stronger characteristics than others, but they can all be overcome or hidden with the right (wrong?) sort of winemaking anyway. I'm curious about the local winemakers in Normandy as I've never seen a vineyard in Normandy. I suspect it's wine from some other area in France. Lots of Frenchmend drive to a wine area to buy from a winery direct. Often the winery has no outside sales. I have friends in the Languedoc who buy a lot of wine in large plastic tubs from local winemakers and rebottle it in screw top Perrier bottles for the season. Sometimes they're given local wines by their neighbors who have vineyards. When they help in the harvest they get even more.

Steve and Wilfrid, it was l'Huitière. There are other restaurants in Lille, but l'Huitière seems to be "the" restaurant in town. In terms of food, I had the turbotin wrapped in a potato crust and served with a cream and truffle sauce. It was not the most elegantly packaged fish in potato I've had, but it was magnificent comfort food. It was the sort of place where I had no compunctions about forgoing the kitchen's talents and just ordering oysters for a starter and the sort of place where I knew the oysters would be good. My wife ordered the rougets. She expected maybe two or three and out came five. She's a light eater and was disappointed. They were also, as I recall, a tad overdone. The carrot and caraway seed garnish was not to her taste although I liked it. The wild mushroom melange was room temperature and I would have expected it to be hot. For a first course she had crayfish and sweetbreads. That was probably very good. She wouldn't let me near it to taste. The cheese tray looked good, but the portions of food were too large for me to try the cheese. We had one dessert, an exceptional (and large) raspberry soufflee with a glass of raspberry sorbet on the side. Overall it gave the impression of a very good institution rather than a chef driven restaurant. Our waiter was an older professional and terrific. I loved the way he asked if we preferred to speak French or English, but starting in English and switching to French as he read our minds. His patience with my French was wonderful as the evening went on. Eventually the conversation came around to the WTC attack and I found his expressions of sympathy and concern to be sincere. When I speak of the elegance of the place, I should note that it's not Parisian. To my senses it's a more democratic business men's elegance rather than one of pseudo royalty. I found it an atmosphere that encourages conversation with your waiter. It's sort of the best of a fine restaurant and a classy brasserie, if I'm at all making myself clear. I found it very Flemish though I have little perception of what I should have expected from Flanders. As further explanation, all I can say is that I've had better food before and I've had that kind of food before, but the restaurant seemed unique, although maybe evocative of something I couldn't quite place. Wilfrid, that may not be what you needed to hear, but it was nice to be needed. ;)

It appears to me that what Steve is saying is that Philly is under-rated. I don't see how any fan, booster or just proud citizen can ever complain about being under-rated. It just means Philly is better than people think it is. It's really not a comment on how high, or low, it's rated. I don't know the city very well. I had one of my best meals in Le Bec Fin recently and a great breakfast at Carman's, but that's not enough to make me any sort of authority, nor are those two places enough to make a citiy's reputation. They should at least put it on the map. Unfairly or not, and I assume it's unfair for many reasons, Philly has long been the butt of many jokes. I believe the oldest one goes something along these lines. I just won second prize and was awarded a two week vacation in Philadelphia. The first prize winner got a weekend in Philly. While it's not PC to tell ethnic jokes, lawyers and Philadelphia are still fair game. My assumption is that along with lawyers, Philadelphia can take it. Hey, I grew up in Brooklyn during WWII. Ever see a war movie where the guy from Brooklyn wasn't the butt of all jokes? The joke would only lose it's humor if Philly were truly a handicapped city. And if anyone wants to award me a two week expenses paid vacation in Philadelphia, I'm accepting. By the way, I would place S.F and Chicago in a separate tier just below N.Y., but maybe that would be based on heresay. A lot of subjectivity in all this and I found it interesting that N.O. did not appear on Klc's list. Nor did Las Vegas.

I'm not sure members looking for information about Spain will look in the France board, but for the moment we'll continue here. This software creates such great pigeon holes, but there seem to be so few pigeons here. We all roost where we are comfortable or maybe just where we are when the thought strikes. You will find lots of posts about French chefs and restaurants on the General board. It's a pity you didn't have a month to spend in northern Spain. Even devoted francophiles such as we are, have come to learn that some of the worlds greatest restaurants are in and around San Sebastian. Arzak's nondescript exterior and homey interior bave no hint of the finesse of his three star food. I'm all too curious to hear how it's going since his daughter moved into the kitchen. Our most recent meal in the area was Martin Berasategui in Lasarte. Hidden away in a noncommercial residential neighborhood of large private homes it was rather difficult, but rewarding, to find. While the menu was full of odd sounding dishes--garlic ice cream for example, the food was remarkably satisfying and exciting, and not the assault on my palate one might fear. We also stayed at the Lopex de Haro and as I recall it was, as you describe it, a most civilized place. In Blbao we ate at Goizeko Kabi. It came recommended and had one Michelin star. My recollection was that the meal was uneven. They had a tremendous menu, and coming from France with little experience in dining in Spain, poor choices may have been partially to blame. We also arrived early, at about nine pm as I recall. There were two other tables already occupied, but English was being spoken at both. The restaurant was filling up as we left and we had noticed that the tapas bar across the street was still jumping with what we assume was a pre-dinner crowd when we had arrived. The star of the meal may well have been Laminas fina de bacalao, a carpaccio of fresh cod served with strips of roasted red peppers--an updated presentation of classic Basque ingredients. A plate of white beans with chorizos and blood sausage ordered by one of our companions was one of the cheapest things on the menu and emminantly satisfying, but the brown sauce and the bechamel sauce served with a very tasty canelon de pinchon (cannelloni of pigeon) stuffed with shredded pigeon and covered with melted Idiazabal cheese, were thick with starch and dull to my palate. A boned pigeon was roasted to rare perfection and served with it's own juices. Three fruit purees served with slices of tender roast roe deer were quite complementry, but again I found the bown sauce a bit overpowering. Desserts were interesting. A helado de pan de centeno (rye bread ice cream) with a spice breadwas a bit too grainy to be judged completely successful, but the tostada flambeada al anís, a thin slice of very rich French toast flamed with anise and served in a pool of natilla (Creme Anglais) was very successful. I knew those notes from a few years ago would come in handy. The Guggenheim is a destination attraction, but the subway is also of interest. It was designed by the British architect, Foster. We're told the glass tunnel entrance cocoons are referred to as "Fosteritos" by the locals. Catalunya is another, or maybe I should say the, hotbed of great cuisine in Spain. Perhaps it's always challenged the Basque cuisine, but it's a center of creativity at the moment although most of the activity may be outside of Barcelona. I think I've noted some very successful meals in Barcelona elsewhere on this site, and both the Adria brothers and Santi Santamaria have been mentioned in other threads including the one devoted to the greatest chefs of the century. These should be familiar names to food lovers. Ferran and Alberto Adria operate El Bulli which gets its share of press. Santamaria has El Raco de Can Fabes in San Celoni about a half hour north of Barcelona and a longer drive than I cared to make after a wonderful lunch. Both of these are deservedly three star establishments, but the second has managed to stay below the radar of the popular press. They are also quite different in style. We also had several meals along the way between San Sebastian and Barcelona that were eye opening. Restaurante La Cocina Aragonesa in Jaca, was as much Basque as Aragonesa, and a complete surprise as it had no stars. Rodero in Pamplona with a star in a city with three one star restaurants was less of a surprise. What was surprising was the nouvelle sophistication in what I remember from my college days of running the bulls as very small provincial town. Now it's a big provincial city, but with good food. We also discovered that there are some good wines in Navarra and Catalunya. Moreover, Spanish restaurants seem to price wines far less agressively than American or French restaurants or maybe it's just that the wines are so much cheaper in Spain than they are when they get here.

Let's do it in public and see if we can draw others into the conversation. This site deserves to have enough threads to support an Italy and a Spain food and travel board.

Every dish you describe sounds wonderful to me. Why is it just a one star restaurant? That's a rhetorical question. It appears you agree with me. How have the guest rooms held up. The last time I was there they showed some deterioration that was going to be hard to fix without destroying some of the character and some of the deterioration was almost built in to the design. For the latter, sliding walls 15 feet long provided access to tiny closets, but the weight of the doors meant they had great inertia when they hit the stop. Eventually the door stops ripped out of the floor and wall tearing pieces with it. The wonderful unpainted plaster with fiberglass threads walls are probably a bad idea at the baths where they absorb water and quickly begin to show mildew. I suppose it's inevitable that these walls will patched and then painted to cover the patch. Perhaps it will look fine and in the end, the original finish will not be missed. Did you also get to Spain on this trip? I know you asked questions about Spain before you left. It's been my big disappointment with eGullet.com that there's not been any good conversations about Spain and it's food.

This is a very interesting point. One would think the French are so much more interested in cooking if the number and quality of food magazines is any indication. And much like the kids in France are so much smarter--they all speak French by the age of 6--these cookbooks all feature French food, which seems so much fancier. ;) I have noticed however, that over the years more and more frozen and processed ingredients are appearing in recipes. The range of food/cooking and food/travel magazines is quite impressive however. We have nothing here like the GaultMillau magazine. Come to think of it, we also don't have anything quite like the GaultMillau or Michelin Guide. How much comes from the fact that his English is just not quite perfect. ;)Someone asked me the other day if he was as charming in the flesh as he appears on TV. If I was a chef, I'd want him impersonating me in public.

For the record, we made our purchase at Porto Rico on Bleeker Street between 6th Avenue and MacDougal. Thus we paid sales tax and had to take a cab to bring it home as I underestimated the weight and size. It also meant we got a pretty fast exchange on a defective model. We bought the last one in the store, but they had others in the warehouse and we picked up the replacement the next day. They were good about the exchange even if they needed a little verbal convincing that we had given it an honest try. I would definitely deal with them again on the basis of this purchase. I agree with Klc, Whole Latte Love has a good site and coffeekid.com is the site we used for further information when we abandoned our Rancillo manual. Reminds me of my daughter. She never wanted to know if she was trouble to raise. She just wanted to know she was worth it. ;) So it's the all Arabica that's giving us a problem with the crema? Could Louie, at DiPalo, be right all along in suggesting we purchase the less expensive blend of Danesi over the all arabica gold package?

I think that was Shaw who said something about GT, but I suspect it was about the menu at GT and not at all about the extent of Tom's talents.I won't hold it against you that you confused us. We agree all the time, even if it's only to agree to disagree. ;)

Steve - That reminds me that I shouldn't make predictions. The more outlandish they are, the greater the likelihood, it's already been done. Hank - I don't recall Steve's using the word "correct" to describe a meal or a restaurant's cooking, but that's a word I hear commonly used in France to describe a sort of faultless, but uninspired cuisine. I'm more or less under the impression that soupe de poissons and the soup for bouillabaisse are much the same. Differences would be in the style of the restaurant or the quality of the restaurant. My impression could be off base. On the same subject, my understanding is that a bourride and a bouillabaisse differ mainly in that the former is served with aioli and the latter with rouille, but this may be a matter of sloppiness in restaurants that want to serve both with ease. Can anyone offer a more definitive opinion or reference. My reference to "reference" drove me to the Larousse Gastronomic which lists several "bouillabaisses" unrelated to the one of this thread. Some are clearly adaptations such as "bouillabaisse de l'océan" and "bouillabaisse à la Parisienne, but there are two authentic provencal recipes that have nothing in common with the one we know. One is a dish of spinach and potatoes and the other a dish of potatoes in fish stock. Both have eggs added at the end. By the way rouille is never mentioned in the Larousse under bouillabaise.

I first discovered the charm of Bayonne on a side trip from Biarritz, its glitzier neighbor. On later trips, I've only passed through. As I've never had time for a meal there, it should be clear that I couldn't have had time to go to a museum either. ;) There is the Musée Bonnat, which is rated two stars by Michelin. It shows the work of Bonnat (1833-1922) and his own collection which he left to the city. The collection contains work from the 14th century through his contemporaries, but I don't see Zurbaran mentioned in the green Michelin guide. There is reference to a pathetic Job by Bonnat. It's not entirely clear if that's a pathetic painting of Job, or a painting of a pathetic Job. I'm almost tempted to add that any Job worth doing, is worth doing well.

Are you sure they were squabs? ;)

I haven't really been watching the count on sites far ahead of us, but my assumption is that many of the leaders are still collecting votes at some good rate. Maybe not, but if they are, it means we will pass them as a slower rate that we passed the guys behind us. I may have to start voting for more sites along the way. Suvir Saran's sight is next and he's contributor here. I don't mind passing him, but I'd hate to leave him in the dust. We should support member's sites, assuming they are on the list and deserving of support. They can ride our coat tails, or is it apron strings?

Bayonne is a neat town with a neat outdoor market on, I believe, Saturday morning. I remember tables full of cepes. You can buy excellent versions of gateau basque in the adjacent covered market. The Moulin de Basilour (I think that's the correct name) has a stall there. There seems to be some argument as to whether the cherry jam or cream fillings is most traditional. It's got to be the black cherry jam. Artisanal black cherry jam is one of the great local products worth purchasing. Nothing like it with some local sheep yogurt. Bayonne and neighboring Biarritz is also a center of some pretty good chocolate, courtesy of the Spanish Inquisition. Chocolatiers fled Spain. On the whole the makers and eaters of ham had no reason to flee Spain at the time and on the whole, I think Spain's hams are better than Bayonne's although I recall an article in a GaultMillau magazine about one fine ham maker in Bayonne. With the common market, the European Economic Community and European Union, you're seeing many more Spanish products for sale in France and in the Basque country, the border is disappearing as a cultural divide. The French Basque shops selling local products will even have wines from Navarra displayed as regional. Nevertheless the local ham is worth celebrating.

That's pretty bold and nosey. We paid about 踰 for it. Other details include the fact that we returned the first one. My suspcion is that the thermostat was defective. Results were very uneven, which is not to say it's very easy to get even results with a machine in working order, but the temperature variations were considerable and the noise was unbearable. There might have been something wrong with the pump. We've been having that kind of luck. A brand new toaster wouldn't pop up with the cancel button either last week. They just don't make them like they used to do. The toaster has a wide slot that will take whole bagels or a 10" long baguette, so that's an improvement. I suppose that's for the toaster thread.Miss Sylvia is by no means an automatic machine. Slight variations in the amount of coffee, the grind and the tamping pressure will throw you way off course for the perfect cup of espresso. I don't think we've ever produced a crema that rivals a neighborhood bar in Italy, but we usually get a better cup of espresso than in most restaurants. My wife has been making the coffee and it's an involved process of heating the various parts, letting off steam to warm the head and drain the jets as well as tamping the coffee with 30 pounds of pressure. A bathroom scale under the apparatus is helpful until you get the hang of what 30 lbs feels like. The instruction manual is almost uselesss, but there's a great web site with lots of great infromation on how to use this and other machines. I think Klc gave the link in the other thread. If you dont really care about a cup of espresso or have to ask the price, it's probably not for you.

It seems like only yesterday that we were on page four and worried about getting dropped. Now we're on page two and although page one is probably going to take longer, psychologically it seems much easier to achieve.