cabrales

Steve P -- I think the shop in Paris described in the first post of this thread carries certain Bernachon chocolates.

While I cannot recollect the cheese course at Daniel, below is an excerpt from L Brenner's "The Fourth Star" relating to the Grimes four-star review: "Grimes devotes a paragraph-plus to cheese . . . . 'It is highly advisable,' Grimes counsels, 'to study the cheese trolley.' He then goes on to swoon about a Selles-sur-Cher he had one visit, and recounts looking for the same cheese on a subesquent trip to the Loire Valley (he should have looked right on Bleeker Street."

Did you know in [applicable Latin American country/Mexico] they put raw fish and citrus juice together and call it Ceviche? Example involving Chip Butty -- see A Balic thread Does Baked Alaska have too many potential ingredients for an example to be based on it?

Note Dim Sum is not generally viewed as breakfast necessarily, although it can be taken in the morning in certain circumstances. Other obvious examples (with significant simplification, in view of the children) -- Did you know that in China they put rice and water together and call it Congee/Porridge? Note "jook" (not formal translation from Cantonese) is generally congee, and it is generally eaten during breakfast. Did you know that in France they put apples and pastry together and call it Tarte Tatin? Did you know that in Spain they put rice, seafood and spices together and call it Paella? Did you know that in Germany they put cabbage and salt together and call it Sauerkraut? Did you know that in France they put ortolans with their own dripping fat and call it 'incroyable'?

A comparison of NY vs. Paris might be unduly restrictive. French Laundry would, as you note be a significant omission. Furthermore, exclusion of non-Parisian areas of France would exclude a great restaurant like Troisgros. US vs. France might be more appropriate. I don't want to touch that topic, though, although I believe France would unequivocally be preferable

Strasbourg has a well-known cathedral, with an astrological clock featuring various small moving parts. I wouldn't go to Strasbourg except for Buerehiesel (in town) or L'Arnsbourg (taxis are expensive to L'Arnsbourg). I was in Cote St-Jacques in 2001, and liked my meal there. You can access it using the train from Paris to Joigny. If required, I can provide specifics on restaurants in the general region (including Loiseau's La Cote d'Or in Saulieu), once you pinpoint the one or two in which you are interested. I like Cote St-Jacques more than La Cote d'Or. Searches of the board should yield some information on each.

Steve Klc -- That's high praise for eight restaurants in NY. How would you see those NY restaurants relative to, say, restaurants in France, and what are the eight NY restaurants to which you refer?

Dan & Mike -- I'd appreciate learning what egg dishes (non-dessert) sampled at a restaurant have been particularly memorable for you. In addition, your input on when humor can play a significant role in a dish (with any available examples) would be of considerable interest to me.

stellabella -- When you have a chance, could you consider discussing the other dishes in your meal at St John? A refreshing beverage available from the bar, which is not generally listed on the per glass wine selection on the chalkboard, is Brittany cider. It goes well with certain pork dishes that might be available from time to time at St John.

The obvious -- Did you know that in France they put grilled ham, cheese and bread together and call it a Croque Monsieur? Did you know that in Japan they put rice and raw fish together and call it sushi?

Ali-Bab's Gastronomie pratique. Etudes culinaires suivies du Traitement de l'obésité des gourmands is available now as a reprint if you want a thick tome to hold you over in the mean time. Bouland --

Steve P -- While Lesley might want to check, St John does lunch (at least some, if not all, weekdays). It's also possible to call the day of to see whether the menu (bar and restaurant areas have different versions) is subjectively appealing. The menu changes very frequently.

Steve P -- Err, you might be beaten to that by another eGulleteer who is assisting in my "rehabilitation". My condition is, I believe, incurable and perfect for me.

Lesley -- Apologies if the answer to this question is obvious to everyone except me. However, why would you not be considering restaurants that are further away from the area where the museum is?

Steven -- I'd be happy to have a conversation about it, after you identify the restaurants that "should" be on the list of eight based on "gourmet" consensus, but that are not on my list. By the way, I don't adhere to any "gourmet" consensus assessments after I have visited a restaurant. Before visiting a facility, I might review many sources of information on it. After I visit (including through a series of visits over time, if I consider the restaurant interesting to explore), however, it's my assessment that counts 100%.

Here's another example. Depart Paris for Montpellier at 8:24 am, arriving 11:39. After lunch at Jardin des Sens, depart Montepellier at 4:37 pm, arriving 8:05. Again, dinner can be had in Paris. That's 12 hours for each of Troisgros and Jardin des Sens. I'm surprised that there isn't more travel by train to access restaurants. It's one of the best ways to take in alcohol, rest following the applicable meal on the train, and be in another town ready for the next meal.

The non-professional member is free to do that but still needs to be willing to take it on the chin when claiming that Blue Hill is one of the eight best restaurants in New York. Steven -- What do you mean by your reference to "take it on the chin", so I respond properly? If you mean addressing your objections to my inclusion of Blue Hill as one of the eight subjectively best restaurants in NY, I don't see any need to do so. As I have continued to emphasize, it is a subjective assessment that reflects, among other things, the "match" between what a restaurant has to offer and what a particular diner prefers. Just like I have never felt I have had to "take it on the chin" for reporting that I dislike the cuisine of Gagnaire, Ducasse, Veyrat and many others in the context of the French culinary landscape. (Obviously, this has to be taken in context. I would rather dine at Ducasse's Plaza Athenee than Union Pacific, another restaurant I like in NY, for example)

Bux -- For Troisgros, taking tomorrow as an example and based on the SNCF website, one could be leave Paris around 7 am and be in Roanne around 10:30. Routes are (1) Paris Gare de Lyons 7:30 am --> Le Creuset Montceau Montchanin 8:49 arrival, 9:01 departure --> Roanne 10:37 am, or (2) Paris Gare de Lyons 7:00 am --> Part Dieu 8:55 am arrival, 9:08 departure --> Roanne 10:24. In either case, Troisgros is right across the street from the train station. There is time to mill about, walk towards the back where there is a vast expanse of window looking into the kitchen before lunch. After lunch, one can leave Roanne at 3:48 pm and be in Paris by 7:00, or leave Roanne at 5:10 pm and be in Paris by 9 pm. In either case, one has time to take in another meal after resting on the train, if one wanted to.

Steve P -- I'm not sure there is a direct parallel in France, but it wouldn't be the "bistro moderne" to which you refer (cuisine-wise or decor-wise).

Steve P -- I'd disagree with the above quote.

Steve Klc -- Note I do not necessarily take it as a given that professional reviewers have to be held to a standard of relative "objectivity". However, even assuming that were the case, I do not see any need for a non-professional member (whether experienced or not) who posts on the board to be held to any standards, except those of his own choosing and except for not intentionally (or due to negligence at some level) posting false factual information. The non-professional member should be free to adopt a more "objective" style, or one that is more personal and subjective.

A French book I am looking forward to receiving: "La Cuisine Acidulee de Michel Troisgros" (The Cuisine of Acidity of Michel Troisgros), expected to be available in November 2002. http://www.chapitre.com/frame_rec.asp?sess...e.x=5&image.y=3

Lesley -- OXO still has the following restaurants: http://www.squaremeal.co.uk/scripts/restau...t.cgi?rest=1217 http://www.squaremeal.co.uk/scripts/restau...t.cgi?rest=1218 I am uncertain they would "fit the ticket" either. How far are you willing to travel away from the Tate?

Lesley -- There are no acceptable gastronomic restaurants in the OXO tower, in my assessment. The gastronomic and bistro portions of Richard Neat's restaurant in the OXO tower closed, relativley quickly following its opening. If somebody suggested an OXO tower restaurant that was "overpriced", that was likely Neat.

magnolia & hollywood -- There are many day-trips, listed in order of my preference: 1) Anywhere in/around Lyon is essentially a day-trip (for lunch). For example, an excellent day trip would be Troisgros in Roanne. Take the TGV from Paris to Lyons, and switch to a local train from Lyons to Roanne. The journey would be 3.5-4.5 hours each way. That is rather long, and not a "day trip" in the usual sense. Obviously, Georges Blanc can be accessed from Lyon (although Troisgros' cuisine is much better). Paul Bocuse does not offer good cuisine in my assessment, but might offer some type of benefit with respect to historical perspective on French cuisine. 2) The easiest day trip, and my recommended day trip, for a three star restaurant is indeed Boyer Les Crayeres in Reims. There is a direct train from Paris to Reims, and a quick taxi ride will take you to Les Crayeres. Less than 2 hours, if I remember correctly. 3) Roellinger involves a longer train ride than Boyer. I have also not yet implemented the train ride, but the best way woud be to take the TGV to Rennes, and then (a) rent a car for a quick drive to Cancale), or (b) take a local train to St-Malo, followed by a taxi. Driving has the disadvantage of restricting alcohol consumption for the driving party during the meal. 4) Also attractive is a direct train ride from Paris to Joigny, followed by a 5 minute cab ride to La Cote Saint-Jacques of J-M Lorain. Less than 2 hours, if I remember correctly. This might be the second easiest day trip. Lorain only has two stars currently, but probably deserves three. 5) I have left Paris extremely early to arrive at Illhaesern's Auberge de L'Ill in time for a late lunch. Take a train from Paris to Strasbourg (go early, as there is no TGV on this portion). Then switch at Strasbourg for Selestat. Colmar is another train station close to Auberge de L'Ill. Once at Selestat, see if there are any taxis in the queue. Note I did not have a favorable experience at Auberge de L'Ill recently. A better option would be to take the regular train from Paris to Strasbourg and dine at Buerehiesel. L'Arnsbourg is 35-50 minutes by taxi from Strasbourg's train station. 6) Jardin des Sens in Montpellier (yes, in the South) is an easy 3-4 hour (?) TGV ride (no change in trains required) from Paris. This trip is fairly easy as well, involving no change in trains. 7) Pic in Valence/Pyramide in Vienne. These are all accessible by day-trip, although not three-star restaurants.