Dave the Cook

but sure to share your notes. no less that 1 page, double-spaced. 12 point font. use of thesaurus and abstruse literary and architectural references optional. Extra points for comparing the taste of the wine to things you wouldn't dream of putting in your mouth: start with rocks (and pebbles), leather, varnish and ink.

Not to go off-topic -- well, OK, it is off-topic, but Varmint will just have to get over it: For the oblivious among us, or just for me, please explain this. (My sister-in-law loves this wine.)

I freeze it if I'm pretty certain I won't use it in, say, six weeks. It's not so much that the fat will go rancid in the 'fridge, it's that fats, even in closed containers, are great at picking up the aromas (not to mention downright odoriferous compounds) and tastes that waft about the enclosure. This is not to say that freezers can't harbor some pretty stinky stuff, too, especially since, in most designs, the two compartments share the same air. Frozen fat is just less susceptible.

Just out of curiosity, what do you think that would bring on eBay?

Right. But as it turns out, pint of water-based liquid (stock, wine, juice) weighs pretty close to a pound, and sometimes that's helpful to know. Edit to add: avoirdupois.

Then a pint's a pound (etc.) ? Remember? "A pint's a pound, the world around." Well, that was the "etc." part. But it's not always true. A pint of duck-butt pinfeathers won't weigh the same as a pint of slippery kidneys, for example.

Coquille: don't let Sam make you feel guilty about not having bacon fat in your freezer. I'd bet he's got friggin' pigeon fat in his freezer. The guy collects fat the way most people collect belly button lint (which by the way doesn't go in the freezer, but in a Tupperware container in your pantry, lest it dehydrate in the low temperatures).

Then a pint's a pound (etc.) ? Good to know. Thanks.

I think this says more about the sort of people who vote in Citysearch polls than it does about Chicago tastes or Midwestern interpretations. Look at the Citysearch results for any decent metropolis (you might start right here on eGullet), and you'll see that chains predominate. Edit to add the nearly superfluous observation that Chicago has a significant Italian-American population, and many excellent Italian restaurants. IMO, it's one of the better cities in the US for Italian and Italian-American dining, with or without Maggiano's (which, btw, is owned by the same company that owns and/or operates Chili's, Macaroni Grill, On The Border and a number of other chains, and is based not in the Midwest, but in Dallas, Texas).

That's exactly it -- -- and as egregious an example of copyright infringement as I've ever seen. Edit: no reflection on guajolote, who merely found it.

It's similar, except in the J&J recipe, the breasts are boned and the filets are separated from the carcass. The wing tips are used for stock, and the remaining two joints are separated. In other words, you've got 12 pieces. But as I recall, the cooking is pretty much the same, though the veggies are added for the braising portion. Duh. Someone with the book handy can probably be more helpful.

I'm into duck! I've done Julia's recipe in J&J; I'd like to try Jacques' Skillet Duck. And while I'm not an unabashed fan of Martha, I'm tired of her taking hits from people who would rather trash her than understand what she tries to do (yes, I used to be one of those people, too). Edit: thanks to Maggie, for helping me see the real Martha.

VD Stew.

I suspect Lenore would spell the last item: Poe Boy wouldn't she?

Yes, and it makes a wonderful sauce. But it's not really the neutral base that Matthew's looking for, I think.

Well, you can try it yourself and see if it makes a difference to you. If there was only one way to do a dish, we'd only need one cookbook! Yes, you could think of it that way. But another way to describe it is that you're replacing water (something without much flavor and no body, which you evaporate in the process of reduction), with stock, something that has a lot of flavor and body. Also, wine is full of compounds that transform at temperatures below the boiling point, so the intense application of caramelization isn't necessary to effect a change in flavor. You underestimate yourself, I think. Certainly a word like "layer" can mean different things to different people, but much, much better cooks than I (Pepin and Prudhomme, to name a couple) have employed the word, even in referring to rustic dishes like Boeuf Bourguignon. In my opinion, there can be a lot of sublety in Coq au Vin or Crawfish Etouffee; since the basics are pretty much a given, it's the subleties that separate a good version from a great one. You can look for it, but if you seek a chemical reaction sort of thing, it's not there in this dish (meaning Beef Burgundy), other than the how temperature affects wine esters. However, acidity certainly contributes to flavor in Beef Burgundy, as well as many, many other dishes. I wasn't clear about what went into the pouch in Jacques and Julia's recipe: a good handful each of chopped onions and carrots, a head's worth of smashed garlic, and the usual thyme, bay and parsley. It's a pretty healthy bouquet garni.

The pumpkin does add some flavor, but it's deceptively mild. I've seen a number of people take a piece of sweet potato pie thinking it's pumpkin, and never notice the difference. Yes, you can puree fresh pumpkin (just in case you didn't decide a second ago to substitute sweet potato pie), but it won't taste the same as good-quality canned pumpkin, unless you're growing one of the varieties of sugar pumpkin. I'm sure that processors blend different varieties and carefully control specific gravity in the interest of product consistency, much like orange juice producers. Evaporated milk is not sweetened. It's simply fat-free milk that's been reduced by 50%, something you can easily do yourself. (The sugary stuff is called "sweetened condensed milk.")

I was going to offer the same thing instead of reconstructing my "all the futile ways to attempt improvement of Libbys recipe for pumpkin pie" post. Sources tell me it's available at Waitrose. Is that any help?

slkinsey can probably provide a more comprehensive answer, but I'd be willing to bet that the heat capacity of the oil, plus the huge output of that burner (most are in the range of 160,000 BTU, more than ten times the output of most home rangetops) easily trumps the pot material.

OK, I had a long post full of all the stuff I've tried, but it's useless. Canners get the best of the pumpkins, and grow special varieties that consumers can't get. Just use the recipe on the back of the Libby's can. Traditionalists love it, because it's the one they grew up on. And for Thanksgiving, that's not such a bad thing.

I think it's a moot point. I can't recall ever seeing one that wasn't aluminum. You're out of luck, unless you've got a Nomex suit. Just kidding -- don't fry a turkey in the rain without some kind of roof or other sheltering structure. Even then, keep in mind that water can make things like concrete and metal really slippery.

I did everything but the fried pie. However, I did get an apple filling cooked down, so I'm going to give it a try later in the week (Mrs. Dave is dubious: "You mean like McDonald's?" "Not necessarily dear. More like the thing that made McDonald's think it was a good idea." "Hmmm.") The flounder (no sole) was about two millimeters thick, so I went with orange roughy. The thickness (about 3/8") was just about perfect for getting a good crust in the required cooking time, but it's kind of a lumpy filet, and a better crust formed on the flatter, ugly side than on the nice side. I, too, liked crisping the parsely with the hot butter, and it made a really cool sizzling sound -- bonus. G is also right about the sauce on the pilaf, and it worked on the asparagus, too. I found myself mounding up forkfuls of random food, swiping it through puddles of sauce, and stuffing my mouth. I've never made profiteroles. I've done a fair amount of duck, but never the recipe up for consideration.

I agree. I tried to say this in the first paragraph of my post, but for some reason, the concept of "layering" eluded me. Thanks, fyfas. Thank you for the clarification, Brad; I get it now. This is why the recipe in Julia and Jacques' book does the onions and mushrooms as a completely separate step. They don't even do a standard mirepoix. They dump aromatics into a cheesecloth pouch which is removed after the simmering, and the separately sauteed 'shrooms and onions are added just before service. It's an elegant method, in my opinion, and completely sidesteps the discoloring problem.

Two reasons to add wine first, I think: 1) So that it's concentrated and somewhat thickened, which eventually will help you achieve the proper sauce consistency with the smallest amount of thickeners; 2) Heat that is high enough to promote reduction also creates a lot of more complex flavoring compounds, adding depth and interest to the sauce. If you added the stock at the same time, you'd expend a lot more energy to get the same effect, and the wine would be no more concentrated than the stock. Since wine is essential to the dish, you want its flavor to stand out. marie-louise and Bux are right: virtually any liquid with a low concentration of dissolved solids will do the job of deglazing. Water, stock, vinegar, and many fruit juices work, but things like milk won't -- in fact, they'll leave their own glaze. Brad might have a point that acid in the wine helps a bit. In my opinion, the effect is not enough to limit yourself to only wine if you've got something else in mind. Besides, fruit juices and vinegar are acidic (stock is usually neutral to slightly alkaline). I'm not sure about the idea that acid will set the color of mushrooms and onions. Certainly it's a effective trick for some color compounds, but maybe that's not what Brad meant. Given sufficient heat and time, most (though probably not every last drop) of residual alcohol will evaporate. Most Beef Bourguinonne recipes call for a full bottle of wine and a covered simmer. In these cases, and especially if you're simmering on the stovetop instead of in the oven, the alcohol evaporates, then condenses on the lid of the pot and drips back down into the stew. Only when you lift the lid do you break the cycle. The initial reduction during deglazing is not enough to evaporate all of the alcohol, either because you don't dump all the wine in at once to deglaze, or you aren't likely to leave it uncovered long enough for full dissipation to occur. (I'm basing this on a study I read a couple of years ago that unfortunately I can't put my hands on. It said, in brief, that even an uncovered simmer of two hours didn't evaporate the alcohol entirely. I was surprised, but the study was pretty convincing.)

I'm in. I dunno 'bout apple, though. That artificial lemon sounds mighty tasty. (I'm kidding.)