Dave the Cook

I'm sure they'll keep it open if they know we're coming. Actually, I've already warned the crew of this possibility.

Thanks, Seth. It occurred to me that it would probably help if I could tell you what we want to see and visit, and then we could construct a series of half-day walking/eating tours. I'm collecting wish lists now; see the obvious stuff below. What would be really great is if these could become the basis for a comprehensive eGullet guide to New York. Your scenario plus some other material is a terrific start: You get the idea, I'm sure. As people try out the "tours," we can refine and update, but always with a food-centered perspective: the restaurants, the cookware stores, the markets. Eventually, you guys will never have to do this for a visitor again! On the list so far, in addition to what's already been mentioned: Times Square Rockefeller Center Empire State Building MOMA Central Park/Strawberry Fields The Dakota Broadway/theatre district The Apollo Statue of Liberty, though actually going to Bedloe Island doesn't seem to be mandatory Greenwich Village St Patrick's Museum of Natural History FAO Schwartz There's more to come I'm sure. Thanks, everyone, for helping out. Edit: the Cellphone Walking Tour looks awesome. And thanks for the design tips, Blondie. And the previous thread. I hadn't seen it before; lots of helpful stuff there.

This sounds terrific, Seth -- especially since brick-oven pizza is definitely on the must-have list. But it brings up one of my concerns: how cold is it going to feel out there on the middle of the bridge the dead of winter? Isn't there a restaurant right under the bridge on the Manhattan side? How's that?

All right. I'm jealous. As a fan of Bud, are you going to hit Chinatown in a big way too? You bet. That chicken better watch out.

An absolutely fascinating site, picaman. Thank you.

Don't worry -- go ahead and mispronounce it as frequently as you can -- the ability to get a room full of people to turn their heads and scream "HOW-ston" at you in unison is a lot of fun. I know! This happens in Atlanta all the time, as we also have a Hou(How)ston Street. And we had great fun going the other way when we lived in Houston, Texas. As a fan of Calvin Trillin for many years, I am not about to miss a chance at Russ & Daughters.

Collapsible steamer baskets are number three on my list of cheap kitchen essentials, after wooden spoons and bench scrapers. Not only can you steam in almost any vessel, you can use them as strainers or cooling racks, and to immerse buoyant items in marinades and brines. Plus, they are indispensible in the fabrication of Chicken Inventolux (scroll down about half a page). I can't believe Sam didn't remember this.

A good bit of the accumulated cast-iron wisdom of eGullet can be found here. Scroll about halfway down the page and you'll see my post with several other links. I would be personally remiss if I didn't also point you here.

I think you're right, fifi. I also think good ol' black pepper gets overlooked. To my taste, it lets you cut back on the salt somewhat, and rounds out the flavor. Certainly Prudhomme preaches the layering you're talking about. But he also uses more seasoning than just cayenne, salt and pepper.

I'm very interested, if we can clear the logistical hurdles. (Suzanne: )

PARTY AT DAVE'S! I'll bring pie and pao de queijo.... You serious? I figured we could just do it on the corner of 81st and Broadway. I once participated in a Po' Boy contest like that (ruined a new pair of white Adidas shoes, too -- Ugelisch's roast beef).

I'm not sure the rest of the party is willing to commit to the exacting scientific standards of the BC, so an official meeting is probably out of the question anyway. But maybe a non-voting, audit-type meeting, at one of the contending spots? My legion might be persuaded. Largest? I didn't know that. I'm not sure where churches rank among the sightseeing imperatives of the group, which comprises lapsed Catholics, lackadaisical Quakers and heathens. Certainly we're impressed by spectacular architecture, though. Lox good. Fish goo bad (someday I'll tell you about my introduction to rotten herring). While we're on the subject (sort of), what are the liquor laws, especially as concerns wine and beer? State stores/never on Sunday like Pennsylvania? Grocery stores 24/7 like Texas? Drive-thrus like California?

I'm sorry, Mr. North Cackalacky. Do you have jurisdiction here? (thanks) I have tourist jurisdiction. Plus, I know that you'll be quite impressed with Fairway's offerings. Indeed he will. Or else he's not the man we take him for. Thanks guys, but I'm not sure anything could beat the Raleigh branch of Whole Foods.

Is that the branch of the Metropolitan that has the Medieval stuff? ooh.

This of course has been a dream of mine for quite some time.

I'm sorry, Mr. North Cackalacky. Do you have jurisdiction here? (thanks)

This is great stuff. Thanks, everybody, and especially 'trix for the links. Now for what might be a naive question. We'll have a kitchen. I expect we'll be eating most meals out, but breakfast and possibly late-night snackage will probably be in, for the most part. Where can I get groceries?

I've been looking at maps. Y'all know there really isn't any upper west or lower east to Manhattan, don't you? By my compass, the former is in the Hudson River and latter is in Brooklyn.

Let's not overwhelm them with eGulls. I've already sent an inquiry.

I am perfectly willing to sponsor a bagel-off.

Is that the scene where Bill Murray does his little heel-toe dance while waiting for Sigourney Weaver ("You were the best one on your row!)? I like the idea of NMAI/Stone Street food in conjunction with the ferry. It's exactly the sort of thing I was looking for. I'm trying to grasp the scale here. For instance, how far is it from Lincoln Center to the Museum of Natural History? Is that considered walking distance?

We managed to snag accomodations near Lincoln Center. Walking is no problem, and we're not averse to subways (speaking of which, can anyone recommend a primer on the transit system? Mass transit in Atlanta is 250,000 people in 249,116 cars.) Schlag. Hand-sliced lox and real bagels. Cheap Turks. sigh.

All the Daves (plus Mrs. Dave's sister's family) will be in New York from December 30 through January 4. We'll be doing all the touristy things -- that's Mrs. Dave's prerogative. Mine of course is food. For instance, while we're freezing our thin-blooded Southern butts off on the Staten Island ferry, I want to be able to look forward to a good nosh afterwards. Or after someone loses their breakfast at the top of the Empire State building, I need know the closest place to refill the tummy. There will be five Daves and four others. Consequently, cheap eats might get preference, though we don't mind paying for good food. So: can we put together a series of mini-tours that include a famous landmark, museum or tourist trap, along with a convenient place to chow down in eGullet style? Transportation tips wouldn't be amiss, either, as long as you're at it.

What you say makes sense, fifi, except that all the grits for which I can find ingredients listings are vitamin-enriched. Doesn't this imply that whatever might have been gained from the lye process is now simply being done through enrichment? The thing is, using lye on a commercial scale is messy, expensive, and not a little bit dangerous. If you can obtain the same result through simple steaming and the addition of a few chemicals, why bother with caustics?

Well, I'm confused. One source (not that mine are on the level of Thorne's) said that dried corn was steamed to remove the hull and germ. To me, this means a water-based process. Maybe this is still considered to create hominy as the intermediate product? Or do you suppose that "hominy" is being used for marketing purposes because it sounds authentic and nicely old-fashioned? I'm going to dash off an e-mail to Quaker to see what they can tell us.