tan319

Speaking of French, the restaurant I apprenticed in, Alsace in nature, used salted butter for everything except most pastries. To saute with, everything.

Another question I have is even more fundemental: How do we replicate the experience of eating (even a single dish) at a Spoon restaurant? One ommission I find surprising in the book is any indication of what the menu looks like. In the preface there is the briefest mention of the Spoon concept ("1,2,3...") but nowhere is there a description of how these recipes are intended to be assembled and experienced. Well OK, I've ony had the book for a few days, so maybe I've missed something. Could someone who's actually eaten at Spoon (wherever) describe a strategy for ordering from the menu? Maybe then we could all play along.... ←

Hope you folks don't mind me using this thread to ask about another Ducasse book I've been smitten by, one that features a few of the Spoon desserts, in fact. I'm talking about the 'Desserts et Patisserie' edition of the Grand Livre de Cuisine Ducasse/Roberts book. It's great to get an idea of what those desserts look like plated. Anyways, does anyone know of a plan to publish this book in an English translation? Any info much appreciated, thanks!

No quarrels with what you're saying, cg. My point was more based around the restaurant view, in fact pretty much saying hat a bakery won't afford a younger person the same freedoms. Someone like Neil (nightscotsman), whose "social" day would begin around 12 noon, would be less likely to be rocking into a bar to hang with some friends at 1 pm ( don't mean to assume, Neil, maybe you're a party animal!) than a person who gets off at 11pm and needs to blow off some steam or even talk shop with their chef, etc.Networking is important to just about anyone in the field. When I started off as an apprentice, a career changer very not used to the hours, with all of my friends finishing their evening when mine was just beginning, I ended up having to start my "day" at 11:30 pm, just so I could say something other than "oui, chef" or "caliente, maricone", to someone, know what I mean? Totally into the dedication you speak of, just for most people, all work no play usually spells not long for that job.

First off, congrats, Neil!!! Everything looks fantastic, but I would expect nothing less from your crew And lest anyone forget, it's a crew, a pretty big one, running 24/7. I was surprised to read on one of Neils posts that they're only making 12 to 24 of each item a day. On the freshness issue, I'd say it's 50/50 they carry thru a day, maybe? Fruit tarts would probably be dumped? Great stuff!

When I use Euro style butter I use Plugra. Question: Does Kerrygold come in a gold foil that says 'creme de la creme' on it? I saw a picture of Sam Mason in that Fader article or rather his mise en place and there were pounds of this butter wrapped in goldfoil with that phrase on it with European style butter written on there too. Numerous google searchs still haven't turned up any results. Also, IMHO, DO NOT use salted butter in, say, a lemon curd recipe. I accidentally did once and while it wasn't so bad that I had to bin it, it made me very nervous to serve as I thought it was a bit too pronounced, and I add a pinch of salt to just about everything. I think I mentioned in the other butter thread wandering around the 'gullet that I don't like to use those big european butters in mousses or again, a lemon creme or curd as I find it becomes all about the butter, not the main ingredient.

I would agree about the use of sweet butter although I've seen recipes for shortbreads and "Breton" shortcrusts, amongst a few other things, that use salted butter. I've been spending a lot of time recently with the 'Grand Livre/Desserts and Patisserie" book by Frederic Roberts and Alain Ducasse and there's more then a few recipes that call for salted butter in them. I like to use salted butter in butter pecan ice cream and in chocolate chip cookies, which I always make lately with euro butter.

Wow, simdelish, the hours run too late, that's too bad, sounds like a good gig. I was just in Miami, investigating some prospects, nobody really even starts to go out before 8, very strange. Melmck, it IS weird about the whole social life thing, you would think that 20 year olds would be looking at restaurant life for social scenes. Oh, btw, sincerely hating the whole january"hey, that's great, cut my hours by 10 hours or so a week, that's really helping, especially since those people at that other job I used to have cut my hours by 100 or 150 a month" bakery blues. I'm so out of the whole hourly pay scene, truely sick and tired of getting screwed by seasons and ups and downs.

I forgot to say, and chromedome, you just reminded me of it,, that since I got blown out of my PC gig, and am only working in the bakery, no 2nd gig, I'm more tired then usual. My adrenal glands have atrophied in only a week. Pisses me off!!! edited to add... After giving it some more thought, would anyone else agree that 20 some year olds, especially guys, would find the hours probably cramping their style? As in social life, girls, etc.? Having to go to bed at 8/9/10 to get to work at 4/5am seriously screws that up.

Yeah, it takes a sort of special mentality to dig that whole 4/5am start time. As a pastry chef, I never really start before 8/9am. But one place I worked was so small that I had to start early as hell and be pretty much getting out of there before 8am and that's how I started getting into that rise before dawn. I was pretty enamoured with it for awhile but getting pretty sick of it now. But, one would think that "Bakers" would know that that's pretty much the lay of the land,eh?

Cru! Dude!!!

Boiron fruit purees have catalog/charts available that have very good pate de fruit recipes. All involve apple pectin ( I use the pastry 1/patisfrance one) and I would bet that Hass is using a similar recipe. A refractometer is usually called for too.

Should they have titled this 'Food Network Sugar Challenge'?. I don't see much pastry or dessert going on.The last good feature I saw on this station was Bobby Flays two part Foodamerica chocolate show with Pat Coston and Martin Howard.

'Choads'...

Congrats, nathanm! I really like the 'Hip chefs...' book. If you don't mind, let me know what you think of the Sergi Arola book when you get it. Really intrigued by his style. He opened a Miami branch of his place but i don't think it flew. There's still a profile on the Starchefs.com rising stars page/Miami.

I had seen the lang. recipe, but thought perhaps there were others. You could try backing the sugar down, couldn't you? Also, something I saw the other day in the Spain focused Feb. issue of Food & Wine. Sergi Arola has a book out which is in English, he's the chef from La Broche. There's a recipe for mozzeralla ice cream. They list Kitchen Arts and Letters for it but I would google it. The book is called 'Cooking is Fun'. I first really read about him in a book called 'Hip Chefs, Hot Cuisine'. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...=glance&s=books It features a collection of "Forward" thinking chefs, mostly Spanish or French, the bios are cool,the recipes are in weights and there are a lot of more savory leaning sorbets, gelees and ice creams. You can get it pretty cheap too. If you have access to the El Bulli 98/02 book/cdrom, there are many savory ice creams. Of course, more then a few cheese ones but you get my drift. If you want to investigate that ave.and don't have access, PM me.

This book, whilst being pretty damned expensive, I know has some savory recipes in it. http://www.chipsbooks.com/artglace.htm

Patrick, If I may suggest, use that lemon creme for a napoleon type thing. This looks pretty much like the one I make, in which I emulsify the butter in with a whisk. I've tried my stick blender but thought it beat it up too much. But the end result is pretty much identical. You let it set up overnight/8 hours or so, correct? BTW, I'm lame, I don't have the Hermes book yet. Great work,'y'all!!!

I think you're going to need to invest in some invert sugar, usually goes by the name of trimoline or numoline, google it, you'll find it. less eggs, more dry matter (nonfat dry milk, atomised glucose) even glucose syrup is going to help you get there. Having read some of your posts before, I guess in the 'Sous Vide' thread, I would be tempted to think you might be an owner of the '98/02' book. Many savory ice cream recipe ideas in there (CDROM) to get an idea of what to work with. Also, I trust you've tried the pacojet website? Many recipes there too. And, as Moopheus already knows this about me, a liitle stabilizer never hurt anybody. Good Luck!

A mousse has either whipped whites, sometimes meringued ( in any style:ie: French or Italian, not often swiss), yolks often, and or whipped cream, often only whipped to the 'half' whipped stage or soft peaks. Sometimes it will have all three additions, sometimes only two or even one. I think you would only add gelatine if you were using it in a mold with cake, etc. Also, a lot of newer mousse recipes are anglaise based and I'm wondering if the P.H. "Pro" book has any of those recipes. Those anglaise based mousses seem to always use gelatine, just a bit, in them. Also, when I half whip cream on a K.A., I always bring it to the stage off the machine by hand using the machine whisk. Otherwise it always seems to be over or underwhipped.

Wow, that was fast! No need to apologize in any way. I'm not really talking about anybody "working" out of a cookbook. However, looking at a dish, say, in '98/02' and opening up that 'Rom to see how something was achieved and maybe applying that technique to something of your own is a different thing, and is something I personally wouldn't be disappointed by. When I first saw your website after the F&W 10 best, Chef, and I say this with the utmost respect, I certainly could see some influences in your menu, and that added to my interest in what you do. And I would expect all of you guys to be a totally different experience and that's reflected in menus that I see online of all of yours and other info I see. Keep up the good work.

I got the mag today and greatly enjoyed the article. It was interesting to find that chef Bowles and Cantu know each other somewhat and it's alway great to read about chefG. One or two things strike me as curious though. Bowles is quoted as saying no chef opens the CDROM of the El Bulli book. I realize that that's a generalization (I certainly have spent some time with it) but somehow, I find it hard to believe that everyone stumbled on concepts like powdering frozen substances in Pacojets or even the Alginate/CC formulas at the same time( I have read the interview with chefG where he was turned on to the SA/CC ingredients at a food show the week before the NYTimes Adria article, and believe it). I'm not criticising anyone, just concerned that chefs are too worried about crediting influences to the point where they kind of forget if the cart came before the horse. To me, F.A. and Alberto are going to possibly be as important to cuisine as Escoffier and Careme were (maybe I should duck to avoid that incoming flack too, tarka), and people like Achatz, Dufresne & Mason, Cantu and others are going to contribute greatly also. Perhaps it's already a given that the Adria's have been a major influence but, that paragraph, in particular caught my eye. Congrats to the ABC's though!!!

Is this Chicago mag article on the stands now, ronnie? I'm SOOOOOOOOOOOO there! Thanks for the info!!!

The latest Food Arts mag features pastry chef Joseph Murphy, who is JGV's "corporate" PC, and who came up with the dessrt menu for V. I found the ideas pretty interesting, especially the oft criticized lemon meringue deconstruction, even though the lemon juice soaked shortbread sounds not only kind of weird, but seems to contradict the chefs reason for the deconstruct ("everyone knows the crust gets soggy"). According to the article, the 14 layer cake is gone, as well as the red wine/pistachio ice cream sundae. It pains me to read that these desserts aren't happening by people like Fatguy,etc.

Docsconz. Loved the report and photos as always! Man, the kitchen seems huge. Glad these guys seem to be on their game all of the time. First place I go when I get back there next time.