phaelon56

In this thread I'm seeing what are perhaps coincidences or perhaps veiled references to two concepts that have previously been discussed here at eGullet. One... the "blind" restaurant where everything is served completely and totally in the dark Dans le Noir thread Easy to find. The second idea, the notion of a conceptual restaurant where empty plates etc. comprised the entire experience, took some hard core Googling to find and sure enough... my search eventually brought me right back here (I was reasonably certain I'd read about it here in the first place.) Cafe Ke'Ilu ( the "As If" restaurant) Personally.... it all boils down to what I'm willing to spend my time and money for. A few years ago I went to the New Museum in NYC and saw an exhibit that included, among other things, "Air Above a Pedestal" and "Feces On a Pedestal". Sure enough, the former was self descriptive and the latter was a speck of dried feces smaller than the head of a common pin - both exhibited on rather mundane wooden pedestals painted white. Did I feel gypped, having paid to get into the exhibit? No not at all... there were other works of art in the show that truly took what most of us consider to be artistic "talent". This thread prompted me to look up the artist, a "minimalist conceptual artist" named Sol Lewitt. His Sentences on Conceptual Art includes many ideas that are very apropos to this discussion regarding avant garde cuisine (with only 35 sentences it's a very fast read). I find the opening statement to be most intriguing... To me... that contains the essence of why I have respect for some of the more talented avant garde artists of any discipline, including cuisine. As a highly logical sort I truly appreciate witnessing or experiencing the sorts of expression that other more creative and less logical folks sometimes create. I suppose I'm not wired that way, lack the vision or perhaps can't make the leap of faith necessary to express myself in that way. Regardless... I'm usually unwilling to avoid potentially disappointing experiences and risk missing one of those transcendent moments that the right aesthetic experience can provide for the onlooker or particpant. Whether I'll consider it worthwhile to spend my precious time and limited financial resources to appreciate their art is an entirely different story and contingent on context and my circumstances. But I wish I had the time to hop in the car and drive the five hours to Manhattan to see "The Gates" (which, by the way, is free of charge for the public and was entirely self-funded by the artist). I prefer to remain open-minded enough to reserve judgment on most things until I actually experience them. That includes "The Gates". Would I take a few days out of my vacation schedule and spend the time and money necessary to visit El Bulli? Most likely not due to the limited amounts I possess of each of those precious resources. Will I incorporate a visit to Alinea into a long weekend trip to Chicago in which I'll have many other things on my agenda? Quite likely. But ultimately... for me... if the food doesn't taste amazingly good it's not worth it.

Point well taken but when it comes to eating out in a Southern "meat and three" restaurant, a northeastern soul food place or even the Cracker Barrel (yes I have been there!) it's not unusual to see all the various sides listed under the menu heading of "Vegetables". That includes various forms of potatoes and rice, stuffing, mac 'n cheese... even some stuff that has meat in it! I could almost become a vegetarian with a Vegetables category like that

I did some Googling on this and it appears that Creme de Noyaux is an American phenomenon - or so it appears. Creme de Noix (walnut) was suggested as a possible substitute as was almond liquer (aka amaretto). I should think there must be some French liquer that is what you seek but finding ino on-line is a challenge. Bols makes a Creme de Noyaux and it's quite likely better quality than the Hiram Walker but still very, very sweet.

Or gorgonzola ice cream! I had that in Barcelona once. Ohh it was so good I can still taste it. ← Mario Batali's place Otto in NYC at various times offers olive oil gelato in addition to ones made from gorgonzola and also ricotta. They are all amazingly good.

The coffee rocks. I'm not saying that because I installed the brewing equipment but because the coffee is from Terroir Coffee of Boston. The only coffee from them that I've tried yet is the Guatemala Huehuetango that Glenn is serving as the house brew when Melt opens. I have no affiliation with Terroir and almost wish I didn't have to admit it but it's better than any coffee we roast where I work. If al other factors are equal (e.g. method and style of roasting, freshness etc.) it all gets down to bean quality. Where I am presently roasting we have the best coffee in our region but it's not of the same calibre as this Guatemalan. The rest of the menu and the quality of the ingredients looks really good - I encourage anyone in the area to stop by and take Glenn up on his offer. BTW, there's a small Italian take-out place next door that sells very good bread and also their own home-made fresh mozzarella. I didn't have a chance to try the cheese but it looked very good.

Nice to hear from you again Geetha. We appreciate the updates. Stumtpown Roasters is indeed very good - they actually have a national reputation despitebeing a regional roaster. Check with them to see if they have or can make for you a blend that has mostly Indian coffee but in particular try to get one that includes Monsooned Malabar. It has a unique spiciness and a sort of musty fruitiness that is, to me, unique among coffees. It's a bit much by itself but wonderful in blends. The same is true for some of us in egards to Yemeni coffees such as Moka Ismaili, Moka Harrar and Moka Mattari. They have a wild, winey spiciness that is unique and makes them very good in blends.

I've started a Barista Competitions thread over in Coffee & Tea. I encourage some lively discussion there so we can get a separate focus on the many fascinating issues surrounding the art of the barista and get back to who has the best servcie in DC. So who is it anyway?

In a "SERVICE" thread in DC/DelMarVa forum Bux asked the following question Here's a place to start... Specialty Coffee Association 2005 Barista Competition press release Most of the pertinent details providing a high level overview are available there. I'll start by commenting on the question of In a word - no. The reason being that the highest quality espresso and espresso based drinks being prepared and served around the world today are coming from independent cafes and coffeehouses. I have yet to hear of a restaurant, even one operating at the highest levels of price and quality, that offers truly outstanding world-class espresso. Perhaps the two are mutually exclusive without some fundamental shifts in attituide and perception occurring? There is sometimes a tendency here at eG to discuss the coffee/espresso experience in the context of fine dining. Wouldn't it seem that the only way a true world-class barista experience could be delivered in a fine dining setting would be if a separate espresso/coffee lounge was provided that guests to could retire to after their meal? I should think that the noise of milk steaming, the on/off of the espresso machine's pump and many other factors would preclude having the actual espresso prep area within the dining room. Additionally, we might consider the issues of presentation and speed of serving. Straight espresso itself is a fragile drink with a short window of time in which to truly appreciate its wonders. Properly made milk based drinks such as a tradtional cappuccino or even specialty drinks typically are best served within no more than a minute or two (literally) of their preparation. On a separate note.... apart from encouraging young people to pursue careers and providing an incentive for skills development... do the Barista Competitions serve a higher purpose? Are they at present or could they, properly publicized and promoted, become an important vehicle for educating the public about the exciting changes that have taken place in espresso culture just within the past few years? If so how might this be accomplished?

If by "good" you mean products that allow you to make big buckets on the cheap of Alabama Slammers or Sex On The Beach for indiscriminate college students... why yes of course. They make very good products On the subject of reverse cocktails... not being flippant but genuinely curious... What happens if you more or less reverse the ratios of a classic Depth Charge or Boilermaker? For those sheltered folks who've spent less time in dive bars than some of us these are typically made by dropping a shot glass of whiskey into a full glass of beer (usually cheap draft beer and cheap whiskey). But what might transpire if you took a really good ale, lager, stout or specialty beer (such as some of the raspberry beers, Belgian ales etc.) and put a 1/2 oz or so into a shaken or stirred drink that included conventional distilled spirits as the primary ingredient(s)? Is there such a drink or can you think of some possibilities that might work?

Unless you're stranded at 10:30 PM on a very funky corner of the South Side in front of the 24 hour Walgreen's where I was That's probably why they told me that cabs were not "callable". As a matter of fact, most cabs won't even pick you up on the street in that location unless it's a cabbie who works that side of town regularly (I finally got lucky after trying for an hour and got myself to the Checkerboard Lounge in time for the second and third sets).

I suggest considering Priceline or Hotwire and sticking to the 4* category. You should be able to get something between $50 and $110 per night depending in whther it's HW or PL and what part of downtown you're staying in. Having previously stayed for a weekend in an area not far from where Alinea is located (sort of at the south end of the Loop), I'd suggest staying a bit further north towards Wacker Drive or even up by Lincoln Park or North Michigan Ave. where it's much livelier and more interesting at night and on weekends. This is assuming that you'll make a weekend of it and do a few things other than just the meal. Not sure if the restaurant can make car service arrangements but it is best to check that out. Chicago has a very god public transportation but cabs are not always easy to find in some neighborhoods and I don't think you can call for cab service - they must be hailed on the street (Chicagoans please correct me if I'm wrong or my info is outdated!). Egullet member "thereuare" has a great web site called Better Bidding that explains how to bid intelligently and get the lowest possible prices using services such as PL and HW. It's well worth a visit to do some quick research before your visit.

There's a movement of sorts in the coffee and espresso business - not news to aficionado's or cognoscenti but some of us in the hinterlands (me!) are slow getting exposed to such things. The growing emphasis in recent years on recognizing the value of single varietals vs. blends in drip coffee has evolved into recognizing the importance of the terroir concept. This notion seems to have gained popularity in relation to wine but is equally applicable to coffee varietals. For example... in any given year there may be beans or even a specific lot of beans from a particular estate (or even a section of that estate) that have unique and desirable characteristics. Rather than getting shipped off to the growers co-op and getting lumped in/mixed with beans from other growers, subsequently to be sold under a generic varietal name (e.g. Guatemala Antigua or Ethiopian Yirgacheffe), these better lots are more increasingly becoming available in their undiluted form. Parallel to this development is a growing interest in appreciating the subtleties of such beans by producing espresso shots from a single varietal. There is a long standing tradition of using specially created blends for espresso. Various beans are combined to achieve certain characteristics that may include chocolaty undertones, fruitiness, floral notes, redolence of spices, a certain desirable bitterness etc. More recently there's been a move towards producing espresso from single varietals. If, as Caffe Vivace's David Schomer states it, "espresso should taste the way good coffee smells", we might expect to see enhanced and noticeably distinct characteristics by getting the essence of a single bean in concentrated form. Having read of these trends but being immersed in a cocoon of constant work (both my day job and my coffee job) and routine, I had not gotten around to trying Single Origin Shots. Last week, prompted by a desire to use up some of the beans in my home green bean stash, I dug out my little 1/2 lb electric Alpenroast drum roaster and did up a batch of Ethiopian Harrar and also some Yemeni Moka Ismaili. I had fully intended to roast some additional varieties and do an espresso blend but when the weekend arrived and I had a rare Saturday morning at home with no obligations attendant... I turned on the espresso machine and settled in with a good book to enjoy a few shots. In another happy accident, I found the only milk on hand to be spoiled but had a full container of fresh half 'n half. Rather than making a short cappuccino as is my wont.... I decided to foam some half 'n half and make a breve machiatto. That is... a double espresso shot topped with a bit of half 'n half foam. Wow. I'm sure that not all varietals will be as appealing in this format but the Ethiopian blew me away. The "blueberry flavor notes" that others describe from this bean but have thus far eluded my less-than-silver-palate were overwhelmingly abundant. Likewise, the sort of winey, spicy wildness of the Yemeni bean was also very distinct. If you have an espresso machine and have been happily pulling shots with blends -try some SOS for a pleasant surprise.

I finally tried it yesterday and more or less agree with ComeUndone. But there was a sort of aftertaste that I noticed after finishing the entire cup. Can't quite place it but I'm guessing it's an artifact from whatever stabilizers they use to keep the texture and consistency stable. I did find it to be excessively sweet - if they would ratchet down the sweetness by about 50% I'd be inclined to get it more often. For now I think it will be an occasional dessert option when I'm stuck in an airport and Starbucks is available.

If you can get about 1.5 oz or so from about 14 - 16 grams of coffee in the double basket with a single pull... I'd just focus on getting grind level consistent enough to get a 25 - 28 second pull time and see what transpires. I have a semi-auto E61 type machine at home but long since gave up on trying to do standard doubles or singles. I just do double ristretto's that are about 1.5 oz not including the crema. When I get them right they're better than any other shots I can get around town - even those I make at work with a Swift grinder and an automatic La Marzocco. The reall challenge is being displined enough to keep doing it regularly - when I go a week or two without using the machine my techniques gets rusty and it takes a half dozen shots of practice before I really get it right again. It's one of the inevitable hazards of working in a commercial espresso environment every day - sometimes it's tough to get inspired to do it at home.

But she did visit Monica's Acca y Alla in Deep Ellum - at least omn the Dallas TV episode she did. I've gone there on a few of my Dallas work related trips (I was always stuck downtown without a car) and had decent food. Not outstanding but okay and a fairly good value for the money. P erhaps she tries to visit places in different parts of a city and therefore did not include Cafe Brazil? (it's always my choice for dessert and iced coffee drinks when in that neighborhood).

Hmmmm. BUt why so few casual eating places that offer something other than onion soup gratinee? My GF prefers soup to most other choices for a light meal and we rarely saw anything other than onion soup on the menu boards we perused at many cafe's i Paris. Even the casual take-away places or food court type establishments seemed to lack soup. Is it like press-pot coffee.... something that is typically prepared and consumed at home but not out?

I only wish I could get coffee or espresso drinks in most restaurants that was actually as good as what is often served in a Peet's or Starbucks cafe. I'm not suggesting that chefs, who admittedly already work long hours, should somehow consider it necessary to become baristas. But does Thomas Keller prepare each and every component of the great meals served in his restaurants or do his peers in other establishments do the same? Of course not. There is a division of labor and delegation based on particular skills. I assume that many chefs do not consider themselves to be expert enough in the intricacies and subtleties of fine wines to do all the sampling, selection and staff training themselves. Do they not rely on hiring an expert sommelier and having a trusted vendor who work with them on such issues? Why should it be any different with coffee or espresso? If an establishment is operating at a rarified enough level that customers routinely spend $150 and up per person for dinner not including alcohol, tax or tip.... is it unreasonable to ask and expect that a few of these places might actually expend the time and make the investment necessary to offer quality coffee and espresso? It's also worth considering that many, many people who are intimately familiar with the nuances of haute cuisine and fine dining are relatively clueless about what comprises a really good espresso, cappuccino etc. because they may not have been exposed to it. What better way to spread the message that this can be an integral part of a fine dining experience than to make a committment to quality? I fail to see how "working sixty hours" can be a justifiable excuse. Any place with a kitchen staff to patron ratio like the FL has should be able to hire a competent barista for far less than what they pay many other food specialists.

I was under the impression that he does so at Per Se and FL but that at Bouchon they use pods for espresso. Have not seen anythign to indicate what they use for drip coffee at Bouchon just as I've heard no feedback on what they do for espresso at FL or Per Se. Perhaps Melkor can weigh in on the espresso situation at FL as he lives in the area and is damn near a regular there (not.... but he's been there a few times recently if I recall correctly).

I was actually down on Ferry Street this past Friday night on an all-too-brief downstate vist. Had dinner at Brasilia - the grileld chicken dish from the "light meals" portion of the menu only had about a pound or so of chicken and a mountain of rice, veggies and potatoes In a place that serves decent rodizio at $18.95 including the hot and cold salad buffet that is considered to be a light meal I wish it hadn't been so late - the stores were closed and I was unable to stock up on cured chorizo

On vacation a few weeks back in Paris (lucky lucky me!) we had dinner one night in a casual bistro (La Boussole - recommended by an eGulleteer - naturally). The dessert I chose was a "trio of creme brulee's". One was citrus, one cinnamon and the third was infused with star anise and had an actual anise star on top. It was by far the most subtle and fascinating of the three - the anise flavor sort of floated beneath the creaminess of the creme and the burnt crunch of the brulee - emerging just enough during each bite to make one aware of its presence. Yet it never dominated or interfered with the appreciation of the traditional creme brulee experience. I've always been leery of creme brulee that tries to deviate from the classic formula but this was really, really good.

You might try calling these folks SEABRA'S SUPERMARKET 574 FERRY ST NEWARK, NJ (973) 491-0399 or try this place for online ordering (but their on-line store does not list decaf in the Delta brand - only in the Sical and Socafé brands) Alcofa Portuguese Foods

I'm not condoning or supporting the use of pod coffee - Illy or any other brand. I'm most especially not condoning the uniformly bad espresso and frequently bad coffee that is typical in most restaurants- even the high end ones. In theory the process of selecting a bean vendor, installing and maintaining the machines and trainign staff is not overly daunting, especially when one considers the level of trainign and attention to detail that goes into almost every other aspect of high end restaurant operation. Yet it still doesn't happen. We still get crappy espresos and quite often average coffee at best. I'm not in a position to understand why but am curious to know if others have insight. Do these chefs/restaurateurs just not "get it"? Is it a cost issue? A lack of space? An assumption that not enough diners actually care? I'm not asking these questions rhetorically - I really am curious and don't know the answers.

I just want a definition of DOV. Can't find squat on Google and am truly mystified.

Adding cayenne or flaked red pepper to increase th ehotness factor is IMHO not that successful. We had a local place that advertised "inferno" wings and that's how they did it. I would try adding some habanero based hot sauce instead. Better yet, take a few habanero's that are split and seeded, cook them in with the sauce and then strain them out before serving.

True but as already pointed out... the decaffienation process does affect taste. Try finding a good quality bean, preferably Swiss Water process or Co2 process, that is fresh roasted. It's worth mentioning that fresh roasted decaf does not hold as well as regular coffee - it hits its peak and starts to decline in about five days, even if properly stored in an airtight lightproof container. There's about a ten day window with regular coffee. I haev done the gradual weaning process a few times and for years I drank "half-caf" by mixing beans. These days I just drink less but I think my switch to almost excusively espresso drinks has been a factor - there's less caffiene. I also find that decaf drip often coffee benefits from using a blend of beans whereas regular coffee seems (to me) to show its attributes best when a straight varietal is consumed. We do a blend of Sulawesi, Sumatran and Colombian decaf - equal parts of each. I made a vac pot of this for my guests at Thanksgiving this year. They tasted it and were skeptical that it could possibly be decaf - it was that good. For those who've menioned that coffee affects their stomach in a negative waay - it's most likely the acidity and not the caffiene. Try finding a medium roast Sulawesi Toroja bean. It's very low acid and often works for folks who can't drink other coffees.