Best Sushi in Philly

[brescd01]

I am setting aside Morimoto because of its cost, but here are three much-discussed places. I was dismayed to read multiple people claiming to be experts, all of whom disagreed where the best sushi is. I consider myself quite knoweldgeable about Chinese, and "the best" is not nearly so ambiguous. So can anyone sort things out for me on the sushi front? The goal is a birthday dinner for a friend who loves sushi.

Option 1:

Sagami

37 W Crescent Blvd

Collingswood, NJ 08108-1003

Option 2:

1225 Raw Sushi & Sake Lounge

1225 Sansom St

Philadelphia, PA 19107

Option 3:

Bluefin

1017 Germantown Pike

Plymouth Meeting, PA 19462

[Vadouvan]

All are simply "acceptable".

Raw is actually the only one I would actively avoid.

Sagami's strength is in cooked food. and BYO.

I Heard raves about Bluefin but it was just OK too.

You really wont get great sushi in philadelphia.

I would avoid anywhere that isnt actually a Japanese restaurant.

Kisso is atleast as good or better than all the places mentioned.

[braindoc1]

I actually enjoy Raw and think that it would be an excellent choice for a birthday dinner. It is clearly not a standard sushi restaurant and if that is what you are looking for, you may be better at Kisso. On the other hand, Raw has a great atmosphere and the fish is fresh and nicely presented. The rolls, though hardly traditional are delicious and inventive. The saki selection is by far the best in Philadelphia. The hot food is also excellent and if you introduce yourself as an egulleter to Chef Greg Ling I suspect he'll send you something special from the kitchen such as a sous vide "bacon and egg" or some fois gras.

Good luck,

Dan Kremens

[Vadouvan]

Greg Ling works at django now......he left raw.

[JasonZ]

... I was dismayed to read multiple people claiming to be experts, all of whom disagreed where the best sushi is. I consider myself quite knoweldgeable about Chinese, and "the best" is not nearly so ambiguous.  ...

←

I hope you find the "best sushi" in PHL, whatever that may be ... and I know your friend will appreciate the effort you've gone to, to find just the right space to celebrate his/her birthday. But I think the search for "best" or "perfect" or "authentic" isn't complicated because individuals aren't expert ... it's because whether the food is conceptually "simple" like sushi (immaculately fresh fish with vinegared, seasoned rice, perhaps wrapped in nori), or more complex, like regional Chinese cuisine, individual tastes and individual understanding of what constitutes "best" can vary -- that's why there are opinions on eGullet. See "Authenticity in Chinese regional variation" for a great discussion in an area where you think there is less ambiguity ...

... enjoy the birthday and remember -- it's the thought and effort that counts ...

[Vadouvan]

and "the best" is not nearly so ambiguous

The reason the best is ambigous is because most who claim to be experts actually havent eaten sushi outside philadelphia, the point isnt to slam philly but fact is until you have experienced really good top end (in terms of quality) sushi, your frame of reference just isnt cutting it.

Sushi Yasuda

Karumazushi

Sushi of Gari

Urasawa

Tsukiji

If sushi were italian food, most "sushi" places in town are like olive gardens.....but definitely not Vetri's or Lupa's or Babbo's.

[Yannii]

This is a good (needed) thread, thank you.

My first reaction is to point out that Morimoto's sushi is not THAT expensive. if you stay away from hot food, wine and cocktails (especially), your bill will be fairly reasonable. ordering pieces and rolls instead of platters is also advised. and as this thread supports I truly believe that Morimoto is a quantum leap better (fish quality, rice quality, etc...) than the rest of the field (which i find uninspiring)

On the other hand, I did have wonderful sushi at Ajihei, all the way out in Princeton, NJ. small intimate place, wonderful quality / freshness. and i bet the trees are in perfect fall colors in Princeton right now, and maybe there is some cool lecture or concert going on at the university? that would make a nice birthday to me....

i have also heard (never been myself) good things about Ota Ya, in lambertville (new hope), which as a destination, probably has more activities than Princeton...

good luck, i would love to hear you short list of Chinese (in a new or existing thread) if you have a chance.... thanks

Edited November 2, 2006 by Yannii (log)

[dagordon]

Agreed 100% with Vadouvan.

JasonZ, you're clearly right that opinions about what is best will always vary. But I think that sushi is one of those areas where consensus is pretty easy to acheive among people who are very widely experienced. There aren't a whole lot of factors that influence quality with sushi, and once one has had extremely high quality sushi it becomes very easy to see in exactly what respects other sushi compares.

I haven't been to Bluefin. But out of all of the places I've been to w/in say a 20 mile radius of Philly, only Fuji is worth returning to, imho. (And, in fact, as I've said in other postings, I've had meals there that compare favorably with places on Yasuda's level.)

I've had one sushi meal around here since Fuji closed -- we were having a craving a couple of weeks ago and went to Sagami. Even apart from the food, there is no way I'd have someone's birthday party there. It was an absolute zoo. Even the sushi chefs were yelling. The food was, as V said, acceptable. We had uni that was excellent, that's it.

As far as Ajihei in Princeton -- I spend a lot of time around Princeton and Ajihei used to be a favorite spot of mine. The sushi was quite good, until I had one of those meals that will permanently turn you off of a sushi place. I expected to get sick from it but, thankfully, didn't. I haven't been back since, but perhaps should give it another try.

As far as Morimoto, the problem as I see it that the quality just isn't at all there. The prices aren't out of line with what top-end places like Yasuda charge, and would be worth it if the fish were nearly as good.

So -- I'd probably think of an idea other than sushi for the party.

[Vadouvan]

As far as Morimoto, the problem as I see it that the quality just isn't at all there. The prices aren't out of line with what top-end places like Yasuda charge, and would be worth it if the fish were nearly as good.

....And most of the hot food isnt even japanese. the danger of threads like these it that it risks alienating people by trying to dictate taste. Clearly people should enjoy what they enjoy but who eats rock shrimp with blue cheese ..........

[HD73]

So -- I'd probably think of an idea other than sushi for the party.

←

Clearly the correct answer is that if one lives in Philly, one simply can't eat sushi. If it's your favorite food, I guess you'd just better move. The snobbery in this thread would be appalling if it wasn't hilarious.

[Vadouvan]

Clearly the correct answer is that if one lives in Philly, one simply can't eat sushi. If it's your favorite food, I guess you'd just better move. The snobbery in this thread would be appalling if it wasn't hilarious.

I know Mr gordon well enough to know what he means.....

It could be percieved as snobbery rather than a factual disagreement which is why I posted the following....

the danger of threads like these it that it risks alienating people by trying to dictate taste. Clearly people should enjoy what they enjoy

However seems those looking for flamewars are not deterred by disclaimers.

There is a place for that kind of behaviour, it's called chowhound.

[HD73]

The site also seems fairly strict about staying on topic. Which is what's so funny about answering an earnest question about where to have a birthday party in Philly with a list of the best places in NY and elsewhere and then a sad face telling us there's no place in Philadelphia worthy of setting foot.

Your initial post was responsive and you're welcome to your opinions. They're certainly more informed than mine and probably correct. I appreciate the lack of flamewars on this site and I think it adds a lot to the discourse. Doesn't mean one has to suffer fools gladly, though, just with civility.

[Vadouvan]

They're certainly more informed than mine and probably correct. I appreciate the lack of flamewars on this site and I think it adds a lot to the discourse. Doesn't mean one has to suffer fools gladly, though, just with civility.

Say what ?

[dagordon]

The site also seems fairly strict about staying on topic.  Which is what's so funny about answering an earnest question about where to have a birthday party in Philly with a list of the best places in NY and elsewhere and then a sad face telling us there's no place in Philadelphia worthy of setting foot. 

←

well 1. the list of top sushi places that V gave wasn't in reponse to the op's question about where to have the birthday party, it was part of an explanation of the 'dismay' he expressed over the wide range of so-called 'expert' opinions on sushi in philly, which JasonZ followed up on.

2. i don't see what's 'so funny' about telling the op that he might want to rethink the idea. the op clearly cares about making his friend's birthday party the best that it can be. he has clearly already done research and is here to solicit more opinions. given that he obviously cares about the quality of the food and that his friend `loves sushi', telling him that he and his friend might be very disappointed with a sushi b-day party in philly (and, by implication, that he might find much better food for the price elsewhere around here) seems to me, well, precisely the purpose of this board.

furthermore: no one said that if one lives in philly, one can't eat sushi, or that one should move. as always, i was merely relaying my personal opinions. one would think that the "imho" and "ymmv" disclaimers are pretty much implicit in every posting on the board that is a reflection of a person's food tastes.

what is funny is that my suggestion was that, up until a couple of months ago, the best sushi to be had in the vicinity was in a run-down area over the bridge right next to a rent by the hour motel in a restaurant whose exterior doesn't exactly scream "eat raw fish here". and the new fuji will probably be the best place around when it opens. that's "snobbery"?

[Buckethead]

Kisso is the best sushi I've had in the city, Morimoto and Hikaru are OK too. Morimoto isn't very expensive if you sit upstairs and just order off the sushi menu. I've never been to Bluefin, Sagami, or Raw. If you're considering places far outside the city, like Plymouth Meeting and Collingswood, the best sushi I've had in the area is at Teikoku, on Rt. 3 a few miles west of Newtown Square. Fuji is moot at the moment. Avoid the Wasabi House on South St., it's not terrible but doesn't hold a candle to Kisso.

[serpentine]

My favorite sushi within city limits, though I haven't been recently, is Shiroi Hana on 15th Street. However, it's not where I would host a birthday dinner, really...it's just a very simple casual spot with a limited menu. Kisso's probably your best bet for a more celebratory atmosphere.

[brescd01]

deleted

Edited November 3, 2006 by brescd01 (log)

[brescd01]

Oh my G-d, I cannot escape the Deconstructionists (AKA starving grad students)!

That said, we will have to agree to disagree JasonZ, because I said that "quality" in Chinese food is generally unambiguous, I did not say "authenticity," which is not the same thing, except at the lowest levels of glop we all know is neither authentic nor good.

I am disturbed that the question of great sushi arouses such passion. I do not have the necessary level of sophistication to draw conclusions, but in my experience, people are most passionate about religious (faith-based) differences, not reality-based ones, for example "Is abortion bad?" as opposed to the cool answer one would get if you asked "Should someone take antibiotics for bacterial meningitis?" or "The IRS sent me a summons, should I answer it?"

Let's add

Option 4

Osaka

8605 Germantown Ave

Philadelphia, PA 19118-2828

Option 5

Kisso Sushi Bar

205 N 4th St

Philadelphia, PA 19106-1801

[Vadouvan]

am disturbed that the question of great sushi arouses such passion. I do not have the necessary level of sophistication to draw conclusions

Bresch....

Dont be so hard on yourself, awareness of what is or isnt the best sushi doesnt require sophistication, its simply about realising the points that make up the quality index.

Type of rice.

Rice holding temperature and texture.

Quality of fish.

Source of fish.

Temperature of service.

Wasabi powder or root.

It is a great Idea at some point in the scope of all the BS people spend money on these days..

Guys going to cigar and single malt "tastings"

For anyone who cares enough to want to know just to set aside 100 bucks and eat in a really good sushi place, it's a revelation.

Here is how it shakesdown...

Best quality sushi BYO

Matt Ito Fuji

Best quality sushi NON BYO

Morimoto at the sushi bar.

Best HOT Japanese food

Sagami

If its just 2 of you go to the sushi bar at morimoto.

Though its a bit disorganized by Yasuda san's standards, its still fun to watch and .....really the sushi isnt that expensive, it's the hot foods and mildly inspired omakases that make it expensive.

The morimoto sashimi plate is very good as are the kumamotos and the chicken soup, thats just about it. But when it comes to the really tasty hot food...hands down Sagami.

For the record without a hint of reluctance, the two consistently best tasting dishes for the last 5 years in philly are both at sagami.

Nasu shigiyaki.

Hamachi Kama.

Edited: to add Sagami is in NJ, I meant the phillly area.

Edited November 3, 2006 by Vadouvan (log)

[Rich Pawlak]

This is a good (needed) thread, thank you.

My first reaction is to point out that Morimoto's sushi is not THAT expensive. if you stay away from hot food, wine and cocktails  (especially), your bill will be fairly reasonable. ordering pieces and rolls instead of platters is also advised. and as this thread supports I truly believe that Morimoto is a quantum leap better (fish quality, rice quality, etc...) than the rest of the field (which i find uninspiring)

On the other hand, I did have wonderful sushi at Ajihei, all the way out in Princeton, NJ. small intimate place, wonderful quality / freshness. and i bet the trees are in perfect fall colors in Princeton right now, and maybe there is some cool lecture or concert going on at the university? that would make a nice birthday to me....

i have also heard (never been myself) good things about Ota Ya, in lambertville (new hope), which as a destination, probably has more activities than Princeton...

good luck, i would love to hear you short list of Chinese (in a new or existing thread) if you have a chance.... thanks

←

I second the recs on Ajihei and Ota Ya, both shockingly good sushi bars. I will also add the brand new Elements Cafe, on Quakerbridge Rd in Mercerville, just south of the Quakerbridge Mall. Truly impressive sushi at alkl three places.

[Greg Ling]

Greg Ling works at django now......he left raw.

←

I did in fact leave RAW but I am not employed at Django,

Ross is a good friend of mine and let me hang around the kitchen because all the asian fusion had corrupted me.

In RAW's defense I think Sam's stuff is excellent, you have to let him know how authentic you want it, because most customers in philly want their food a certain way.

The same goes for French , Italian or Japanese.

I recommend you sit at the sushi bar and introduce yourself to Sam ,let him know that you are a gulleteer and simply ask what is fresh.

They let him order what he wants so he usually has something interesting.

Any Chef like Sam who has a lot of pride in his work would be accommodating.

Edited November 3, 2006 by Greg Ling (log)

[Vadouvan]

I recommend you sit at the sushi bar and introduce yourself to Sam ,let him know that you are a gulleteer and simply ask what is fresh.

Shouldnt everything at a sushi bar be beyond fresh ?

Should you have to ask what is fresh ?

[stephenc]

You could consider Teikoku on route 3 in Newtown Square.

[Greg Ling]

I recommend you sit at the sushi bar and introduce yourself to Sam ,let him know that you are a gulleteer and simply ask what is fresh.

Shouldnt everything at a sushi bar be beyond fresh ?

Should you have to ask what is fresh ?

←

My bizzle, I meant interesting.

I was a little distracted when I typed that.

Edited November 3, 2006 by Greg Ling (log)

[Buckethead]

However seems those looking for flamewars are not deterred by disclaimers.

There is a place for that kind of behaviour, it's called chowhound.

←

Funny you should say that, since there's an identical thread on Chowhound right now, initiated by the same person. That thread is perfectly civil, and provides nearly the same useful information that this one does.

Edited November 3, 2006 by Buckethead (log)