Q&A: Homebrewing

[cdh]

Congrats MSK! You've made it through everything you'd need to do if you wanted to engage in all-grain brewing. Now that you know your equipment and the technique, the mess should be more easily avoided.

Dealing with the grains and hitting the mash temperature were no big deal, right?

Sounds like you're using one of the White Labs yeasts... which one? I've always been partial to Wyeast, myself, but that's just because my local shop carries Wyeast's full line.

[Msk]

I used the White Labs Pitcable 550 Belgian Ale yeast. I just wazsn't thinking about how much pressure was likely building up in there as the little guys gave off gas. Its what I could find at my brew store.

The temps were not really such a big deal. I basically had all new equipment this time around so I was getting used to it all.

The other thing I failed to realize is that inside the cooler there was alot of pressure building up since I kept the lid close to preserve the temp. So when I opened the spiggot it really shot out the liquid.

You id a great job explaining the process, and I got that fairly easily. For me the issue was new equipment and logistics.

I love that caramel/malty aroma of the grains/wort.

Since I had the recipe put into Beersmith, I also could not help adding some more DME to raise the Alcohol. I'm sure all the new brewers do that in the beginning at some point.

Thanks again Chris.

MSK

[Rombot]

Hey All

Well, I have tried the red ale and it seems that all my beers are flat. I have tried about 3 different bottles and none of them have any fizz that last more that 30 seconds or so. I am not to sure what I have done wrong, but will leave them all for another few weeks and try them, hopefully with more luck.

What temperature are they sitting at? It is winter time down there for you, so the temp may be low enough that the yeast have gone dormant. Warm them up to at least 20C, and agitate the bottles to re-suspend the yeast.

If you're impatient to try them, and have any of the first batch around, you might try blending some of flat batch 2 into fizzy batch 1 and get an idea of what it will be like.. .

Hey all

Well they seem to be getting a bit fizzier, I tried one tonight and it seems be coming along. I think it is the temperature that is causing the problem and making them go slow. I am in no huge rush, so I will let them be for the next few weeks and see how they are then.

Haven’t got round to the next batch yet but I am planning to do it soon, I will keep ya all updated.

For those of you who like gadgets, these things look kinda cool.

http://www.mashmaster.com.au

Anyhow have a good one,

Rom

[cdh]

Rom-

Glad to hear that the carbonation is just slow, and not absent. Low temperatures do slow yeast down a good deal. What is ambient temperature for you in your beer storage facility?

[Rombot]

Rom-

Glad to hear that the carbonation is just slow, and not absent.  Low temperatures do slow yeast down a good deal.  What is ambient temperature for you in your beer storage facility?

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Well tempatures here are about 15 degrees celsius although it has been a bit cooler recently. I must say that my beer is been kept in the gargage so it is not the warmest part of the house.

[Msk]

So I opened my Bucket to test the gravity of my beer. How do you do this and prevent contamination?

I basically sanitized my Beer Thief, cracked open the bucket, took a sample and poured it into the testing jar. I was just so paranoid about infecting it one week into fermentation. How in the world do more experienced brewers do this three consecutive days to check on fermentation?

Is it just that at this point there is significantly less chance of infection? Does oxidation become a big risk as well?

I tasted the beer and it tastes fantastic. When it went into the fermentor it was extremely sweet (duh) and had a weird bite that probably came from the orange peel. That is now gone and its very good.

Looking forward to this one.

MSK

[cdh]

Once the fermentation is mostly done, the beer is acidic and alcoholic enough that most nasties will have a hard time getting started in there. So ordinary sanitization procedures should be enough to keep your beer safe. Oxidation is not something too worrisome either, as the beer makes a CO2 blanket over itself that protects it.

The three days rule is not something you need to use every time you brew... only when you're not sure about whether the beer is done or not. After two weeks in the fermentor at ordinary room temperature, most yeasts are going to be done. Saison yeasts are a little wacky and may decide to take their time, so you need to check up on them, but they're something of an exception.

I had the 3944 around because I'd planned on brewing a wit this summer, and made a batch of the Saison with it, and I know how that yeast operates, so I let it go crazy for a week, clean up after itself for a week, and then just moved the beer over into a keg.

Once you gain some familiarity with how a yeast behaves, all of the sampling becomes more a confirmatory step than vital data points. If the first reading shows the final gravity where you want it after 2 weeks, you're likely to be alright. If there are still signs that fermentation is going on, more readings are probably wise.

You don't want to put a beer that's not done fermenting into bottles, as it will likely overcarbonate and may blow up the bottles and make a (potentially dangerous if you're using glass) mess.

[FoodMan]

Did the Saison last night.  What a disaster!  When I opened the spiggot on the cooler to drain the first run it sprayed everywhere.  In addition the grain bag would continually block the spout, then as I would try to move it the pressure would shoot the beer over the kettle.  It would have made a great comedy sketch (though my wife wasn't laughing"

I used Beeersmith free trial to scale the recipe and was hoping to get 5 gallons.  I probably would have gotten 5 if I didn't spew so much all over the floor.  I ended up with about 3 and a half gallons in the fermentor.

I perservered and got it into the kettle and boiling and from that point things went a bit smoother.  Except the yeast vial exploded when I opened it, so I am praying for no infection from that.

The good news is the fermentor is bubbling away in the garage this morning.  I think I will do this outside next time (at least the mash).  I may look into buying one of those cooking elements for outside use too. 

In the next day or two I'll post shots of the previous two beers

Well I certainly will know what to expect next time.

Msk

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Well, I sure am glad to learn from your mistakes . I have not gotten to try this recipe yet since I still have a lot of beer from my second double batch and I've been pretty busy. Hopefully in the next few weeks I will though.

[Msk]

Foodman, that was certainly the goal. I know I have learned from dozens of mistakes posted here on eGullet. I figured it was time for me to give back.

I've noticed the Red Ale has changed more drastically (in a good way) as it ages in the bottle relative to the Golden Ale. Is this my imagination or is it the more "From Scratch: you make your wort the more it matures over time?

Bottled the Saison last night. I wonder if it is going to be a bit too sweet and concentrated since I had the spillage mishap. It did taste very good.

MSK

[cdh]

I've noticed the Red Ale has changed more drastically (in a good way) as it ages in the bottle relative to the Golden Ale.  Is this my imagination or is it the more "From Scratch: you make your wort the more it matures over time?

I think it is more about the amount of hopping in there than the way you got the fermentables. The Red Ale has a lot more hops than the Golden, so the hops changing with time are what you're tasting. The bitterness and hop flavor balance out and mellow over time.

Bottled the Saison last night.  I wonder if it is going to be a bit too sweet and concentrated since I had the spillage mishap.  It did taste very good.

MSK

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It shouldn't be concentrated... as a matter of fact, it should be about right. If you were losing more wort at the beginning than at the end of the runoff it will be weaker, not stronger. If you were losing evenly throughout the runoff it should be normal. If you lost the most at the end, it will be stronger. The concentration of sugar in the runoff is pretty much even during the first runoff, and even, but lesser during the second runoff. The yeast will make sure that it won't be sweet in any case.

[Rombot]

Hey all

Opened a few of the Red ales last night and all where really good, it has taken a month but the carbonation levels are all perfect even better than the first batch . Patience really is a virtue. Still haven’t got round to the final brew but I will hopefully sooner rather than later.

regards

Rom

[Bill Poster]

Well, I have tried the red ale and it seems that all my beers are flat.

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I read somewhere that you can increase foam by adding a 15 minute simmer 15 minutes into the mash boil..(taking 15 mins off the total length of the boil)

[cdh]

Ummm... not really. Mashing is not a boil. You're thinking of a protein rest at the beginning of the mash... which is inapplicable to a beer that isn't mashed (like the red ale recipe).

A protein rest is letting the big vat of grain sit at a temperature of about 120F to allow certain enzymes to go to work on protein in the grain. This can help with head retention... but if there's no fizz in the beers, there's nothing to make a head to retain.

Edited August 7, 2006 by cdh (log)

[Rombot]

Hi all

I have done my shop so my ingrediants will be arriving in the next day or so. I also tried a bottle of the first batch and it has improved remarkably. I was initially very happy with it but after a few months rest it has got even better, it has cleared up and the flavours have settled down and intergrated really well. I only wish I hadnt drunk 90% of it when it was young.

Regards

Rom

[cdh]

Indeed... a month or two in bottles does let a beer really come together and improve. Luckily for you, batch 1 was really easy to make, so you could make more of it ...

So the red ale is carbonating nicely for you now?

Let us all know how the Saison brew goes for you.

[Rombot]

Indeed... a month or two in bottles does let a beer really come together and improve.  Luckily for you, batch 1 was really easy to make, so you could make more of it  ... 

So the red ale is carbonating nicely for you now? 

Let us all know how the Saison brew goes for you.

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The Red Ale is perfect but after trying the pale ale, at a few months of age, I will try and not to drink much more of it. I have set aside Saturday afternoon for the Saison and will do a 4 gallon batch.

After the Saison I think I may do another experimental batch as I have various amounts of malts left over from each of the brews. Would it be too much of a brain explosion to throw them together and just see what happens?

Oh talking about experimental batches, I bottled the Pilsenerish beer type thing and on tasting it I dont think it will be that bad. I will report further when I try my first bottle.

Regards

rom

[cdh]

My trial run on the Saison was a 4 gallon batch as well... It was fantastic.

Here's the exact recipe I used for the 4 gallons:

2lbs Belgian Pilsner

4 oz Belgian biscuit malt (a more intense munich-like malt)

4 oz flaked oats

8 oz flaked rye

8 oz torrified wheat (puffed wheat that hasn't been rolled into flakes)

Mashed at 143F for 30 minutes, then raised to 152F for 30 minutes... This made for a very fermentable wort and a great light body.

1 lb dutch light malt extract

1 lb cane sugar

1 oz Stryian goldings at 60 minutes

.25 oz Hallertauer at 15 minutes

.25 oz Hallertauer after the boil

Spiced with .5 oz seville orange zest, 1 star anise star, and half of a thumb-sized piece of fresh ginger.

Fermented with Wyeast 3944.

Don't think I'd change a thing about it. OG was 1.046, IBUs were 23.

[Bill Poster]

Cdh, I am itching to get going. I took your advice and will stay 'cheap' with my equipment, but, do you know of a cheap steam powered mash tun? I want to avoid burning the grain.

[cdh]

No need for a mash tun with heating capability when brewing small. A picnic cooler holds enough heat in to accomplish what needs to be done. Get a grain bag and a picnic cooler with a spiggot to let ice melt out and you've got yourself all the mash tun you need.

[Bill Poster]

Thanks Cdh,

hot water urns are available in all sizes and seem a very good and cheap vessel for boiling/mashing. Most have a concealed element and adjustable thermo. you can pick them up on ebay v cheaply

[Bill Poster]

Ok, I finally made my purchases.. ordered some uncrushed malt(pale, munich) and wheat, Goldings and Hallertau hops, plenty of wyeast 3068, a couple of fermenting vessels with taps and airlock plus sythons irish moss, priming sugar, wort cooler etc. I went for a cheap s/hand burco hot water urn $60 for boiling/mashing to offset the expensive mill..$$$ plus two cases of grolsch(bottle supply for first batch if successful) to drink with my buddies..

Edited August 10, 2006 by Bill Poster (log)

[cdh]

Sounds like you're ready with your equipment, so long as you've got sanitizer and siphon tube and racking cane and bottle filler handled too...

Now it sounds like you're getting ready to brew a Hefe-Weizen... what recipe are you planning on using? That's a beer that is ideal for a hot summer. But you've gotta be ready to drink it all up within a month or two... Hefes are beers that don't keep well for very long.

[Bill Poster]

Have good sython and bottle filler on order too plus a small quantity of acid malt. Also got a hop strainer bot not sure if i need it. didn't get racking cane hmm..and i was thinking of ordinary bleach for sanitizing, tho i just read that it can react with s/s

Edited August 11, 2006 by Bill Poster (log)

[Rombot]

Hey all

Could be a little delay with the Saison. I steralised my picnic cooler today to find out that the tap on the bottom is leaking and I feel that it may be worth getting a new one before doing the mash. To be honest it was a cooler that has been idle for a long time and is at least 10 years of age, actually I would say closer to 15 years.

Till the I will let you know Chris that my homebrew shop didn’t have all the exact ingredients but I took their advise in regards to substitutes. I am using Moris Otter as the primary grain, torrified wheat, flaked Barley instead of the oats, I found the rye in a health food shop and am using fuggles instead of goldings. All the other ingredients are the same. Hopefully it will turn out fine they seem to think so.

Rom

[Rombot]

Hey All

Posted a little premature, I fixed the tap with a new rubber washer and it stopped leaking. I have done the mash and have the wart is ready for the boil. I have to go out so I am going to leave it for a while and do the boil latter, Chris will this cause any problems?

Regards

Rom