Al's Deli Closed

[Hank]

Al's Kosher Deli on Main St. in Fort Lee has closed. It was only a matter of time since very few people went there any more. Between a large Korean population in Fort Lee and surrounding towns(they don't eat deli) and very indifferent food killed their business.

The nearest kosher deli now is Sol and Sol in Englewood on E. Palisades Ave. across the street from Baumgart's.

[dknyc1]

I am not surprised at all.

I live nearby - probably half way between Als in Fort Lee & Sol & Sol in Englewood.

Sorry to say, Als had been really bad over the last few years - quality - service - not clean - out of food etc. I kept trying it & it never got any better - I finally gave up few months ago.

Sol & Sol is consistantly very good - been going about once a week lately. Also, much cleaner, & friendlier.

[menton1]

Wasn't Sol & Sol the former incarnation of Al's?

[Jason Perlow]

There's also the Tenafly Kosher Deli, and also another Kosher deli in Bergenfield in the shopping center on Washington Ave across from the Wallgreens.

[menton1]

It seems that these "Kosher" style delis in New Jersey think that the word Kosher is their license for exorbitant prices and low quality. Oh, if only they could emulate the NY Second Ave Deli... (I think that closed as well)

The ironic part of the whole thing, is, that anyone observant of Kosher would NEVER go near any of these places, because they are open Saturday. But I suppose they satisfy the "semi-observant" in the population, whatever semi-observant means.

[Jason Perlow]

Well, you got all those places in Teaneck as well.

[menton1]

No, the ones in Teaneck are closed Saturday. Their audience would not patronize them otherwise.

[Jason Perlow]

No, I meant that if you really want the hardcore orthodox glatt kosher outlets that aren't open on Shabbat, they are there.

[Hank]

It seems that these "Kosher" style delis in New Jersey think that the word Kosher is their license for exorbitant prices and low quality.  Oh, if only they could emulate the NY Second Ave Deli... (I think that closed as well)

The ironic part of the whole thing, is, that anyone observant of Kosher would NEVER go near any of these places, because they are open Saturday.  But I suppose they satisfy the "semi-observant" in the population, whatever semi-observant means.

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First of all these are not kosher "style" deli's but are kosher deli's. The difference is that a kosher deli must serve only kosher food while a kosher style deli does not serve kosher food. Ofcourse they sell corn beef, pastrami, dairy products,etc. so it becomes "style" which IMHO means nothing.

So, Jews who do observe kosher laws do in fact go to kosher deli's and restaurants, even on Saturdays unless they are very religous.

There are ultra observant Jews though who will go only to "glatt" kosher deli's and restaurants who are closed on Saturdays and all Jewish holidays but I believe that that should be a thread of its own.

In all fairness it is wrong to label a deli or rest. as kosher style if it advertises itself as and is kosher. In fact they would have every reason to be quite angry with you unless you can prove that they sell non-kosher products.

Edited February 8, 2006 by Hank (log)

[menton1]

We had a lot of back and forth on this "Kosher style" subject last year on a thread. One of the regular NY posters, Bloviatrix, chimed in as an expert on the subject and explained the matter definitively and seemed to be very knowledgeable on this topic. She concluded, as I had previously said, that no one observant at all would ever patronize a place open on Saturday, and that these places even calling themselves "Kosher" is very questionable.

Edited to add the definition of Kashrut, from Jewish Virtual Library:

Kashrut (the Jewish dietary laws) restrictions forbid eating meat and dairy products together. Therefore, as a rule, Kosher restaurants are classified as either meat or dairy. Fish, eggs, and vegetable foods are "neutral" (parve), and usually available at both. Pork and shellfish are strictly forbidden by Jewish law. Chicken and turkey are the staple meats, although beef is almost always on the menu in meat restaurants. Kosher restaurants must be closed on Shabbat (the Jewish Sabbath, which runs from sundown on Friday night until after sundown on Saturday), and on Jewish holidays.

Edited February 8, 2006 by menton1 (log)

[Hank]

We had a lot of back and forth on this "Kosher style" subject last year on a thread.  One of the regular NY posters, Bloviatrix, chimed in as an expert on the subject and explained the matter definitively and seemed to be very knowledgeable on this topic.  She concluded, as I had previously said, that no one observant at all would ever patronize a place open on Saturday, and that these places even calling themselves "Kosher" is very questionable.

Edited to add the definition of Kashrut, from Jewish Virtual Library:

Kashrut (the Jewish dietary laws) restrictions forbid eating meat and dairy products together. Therefore, as a rule, Kosher restaurants are classified as either meat or dairy. Fish, eggs, and vegetable foods are "neutral" (parve), and usually available at both. Pork and shellfish are strictly forbidden by Jewish law. Chicken and turkey are the staple meats, although beef is almost always on the menu in meat restaurants. Kosher restaurants must be closed on Shabbat (the Jewish Sabbath, which runs from sundown on Friday night until after sundown on Saturday), and on Jewish holidays.

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That is all very good but the bottom line and the law is still that if a restaurant or deli sells only kosher products they can call themselves a kosher establishment and it is up to the individual customers to decide for themselves if they want to eat or purchase food there because they are open on Saturday. Your insinuation is that they are doing something illegal by calling themselves kosher instead of kosher style but I respectfully disagree. They are within the law.

[menton1]

I think its very cute of you to say that breaking the Kashrut laws would be "illegal". However, you need to take up your gripes with the folks that decide what goes into this law. But according to what is clearly stated above, and verified by some "in the know" folks here on Eg the last time we discussed this, "Kosher" establishments MUST close on the Sabbath. Easy to understand. No shading there. Cut and dried. They just cannot open on the Sabbath and be Kosher. (Something like "Partially pregnant". ?)

[Jason Perlow]

I think the definition of legal depends entirely upon if you are using the Orthodox Rabbinate of Bergen County's definition or if you are using another certificate issuer's definition.

[markk]

To lighten the thread just a tad... I was recently told that I "had" to go to Steve's Kosher Style Deli, in Bayonne, for their pastrami. When I called first, I learned that it was Hebrew National pastrami, of which I am not all that fond. But in my neck of the woods (Hoboken area) we take what we can get.

The pastrami was neither terrible, nor great. It was tender instead of stringy (which is my usual objection to Hewbrew National, so I take it that it was steamed a sufficient amount of time), but it was incredibly, incredibly salty, with not many other flavors coming through.

And so a few days later I had to trek to Tabatchnick's in Livingston Mall to re-sample the pastrami which comes from Empire National in Brooklyn who made it for Second Avenue Deli before it indeed closed. This pastrami was crumbly, moist, flavorful, and utterly delicious, as always!