Salted Black Beans

mudbug · July 19, 2005

Love these with beef and bittermelon, fried dace, pai gwut (pork ribs), etc.

How about you?

How do you prefer to prep them? How did your elders prepare them and what did they like to cook them with? Do you soak them in water or broth first, rinse them with water, or use them right out of the bag or can? What specific brands do you prefer or dislike?

SuzySushi · July 19, 2005

This "round eyes" usually cheats and uses LKK Black Bean Garlic Sauce. (Gasp!) When I do buy black beans, I get the little plastic baggies repacked by Wing. The beans are pretty much whole (not mushed) and not encrusted with salt, so I don't bother rinsing them at all. Whatever brand I used to use back in NYC I had to rinse off before using, the traditional way.

What I want to know is, once you open a package of black beans, how do you keep the fragrance from permeating everything else in the refrigerator??? (Even a sealed glass jar doesn't work.)

Yuki · July 20, 2005

This "round eyes" usually cheats and uses LKK Black Bean Garlic Sauce. (Gasp!) When I do buy black beans, I get the little plastic baggies repacked by Wing. The beans are pretty much whole (not mushed) and not encrusted with salt, so I don't bother rinsing them at all. Whatever brand I used to use back in NYC I had to rinse off before using, the traditional way.
What I want to know is, once you open a package of black beans, how do you keep the fragrance from permeating everything else in the refrigerator??? (Even a sealed glass jar doesn't work.)
←

Um... I don't store them in the fridge because I live in a really dry place. The black bean shouldn't need to be stored in the fridge since in the humid Hong Kong, they leave them out and nothing seems to happen(maybe I am wrong though :wink: ). I usually just store them in their original cylindrical paper container.

I rinse the black bean under the water and mash it up a bit before mixing it with chopped garlic. Some of my favourite dishes include steamed white eel and steamed spare rib. If I am at a restaurant then I would order a Cantonese style fried noodle dish with a sauce consisting of black bean, pepper, and beef. Most shellfish also taste very good when it is stir fried with black bean, garlic, and a bit of hot pepper.

Black bean is a wonderful thing but you have got to pair it up with garlic to get the best flavour.

Seitch · July 20, 2005

Love these with beef and bittermelon, fried dace, pai gwut (pork ribs), etc.
How about you?
How do you prefer to prep them? How did your elders prepare them and what did they like to cook them with? Do you soak them in water or broth first, rinse them with water, or use them right out of the bag or can? What specific brands do you prefer or dislike?
←

Soak them in water a bit, rub them with your fingers to remove the outer skin. This reduces the mildly astringent taste of the skins. It's not important to get every one just some.

mudbug · July 20, 2005

Thanks Seitch. I know how I do it... was just curious how others did it and preferred to use them.

As described above, it depends on what the original form is of the ingredient that you purchase. I assume you're using dry beans and not canned? What brand?

Tepee · July 20, 2005

My #1 dish with dau si would be with pai guat (pork ribs) and fu gua (bitter gourd). A close second would be steamed fish. Then, I like to take a can of this, fry it with lots more chopped garlic and chillies, breaking up the fish into small pieces to soak in all that flavor. :wub:

Edited July 20, 2005 by Tepee (log)

mudbug · July 20, 2005

Thank you Tepee, would you be so kind as to share your pai guat recipe?

Tepee · July 20, 2005

Sure, Mudbug.

My method of cooking it is really home-style.

Marinate the ribs with 5-spice powder, soy sauce, salt and pepper, for at least 2 hours. Prepare the bitter gourd by cutting it into strips (according to the size you desire).

Soak in salt water for half an hour. Rinse. Drain.

Lightly rinse the salted black beans. Drain. Roughly chop.

Sear ribs in high heat in some oil. Keep aside.

Fry sliced shallots, lots of garlic (can you tell I love garlic?). Add bitter gourd.

Steam-fry till the gourd just turns color/looks cooked.

Add ribs, oyster sauce, black beans, and a pinch of sugar. Oh, and sliced chillies, if you like. Depending on my mood, I sometimes add some Fa Thieu or sesame seed oil.

How do you do yours, Mudbug? Oh, by the way, are you chinese? If you are, you might want to sign in here or here. If you're not chinese, I commend you on your knowledge of chinese food! :smile:

Edited July 20, 2005 by Tepee (log)

Tepee · July 20, 2005

Would like to add:

I don't like the bitter gourd to be over-soft, so I just cook it until it changes color.

Nowadays, I tend to add cornstarch thickener to make more sauce...for the kids. But it also helps to smoothen the dish feel too.

mudbug · July 20, 2005

Teepee,

Thank you. I was actually thinking of just baby ribs with black beans instead of them being combined with bitter melon all together in a dish.

We just follow recipes from any of the numerous Chinese cookbooks we have with everything from The Key to Chinese Cooking by Irene Kuo to the revered Pei Mei series of which I need to acquire more. We used the shrink wrapped type of black bean. Don't have any in the pantry so I dont know the brand... black, white, and red label I believe. We don't mash and use them straight.

Yes, I'm Chinese (Cantonese). My mom once told me a story of how when I was five, I asked her... where does popo get all that food from? At that time I couldn't comprehend it because it was a kitchen "the size of a closet" (I really don't recall the dimensions - but that's how it felt). Every time we sat at the dinner table it was like a Thanksgiving feast and I was always in awe. There's truly nothing like home cookin' in this respect, eh?

Thanks for pointing out the links... I'm going to have to "ask" because I really don't know specifics. I know I can google it but what does "Toysan" mean? Forgive my ignorance... :sad: Once I figure it all out... I'll check in.

As for knowledge, I've done a lot of research on my own and I have spot-on taste buds. I don't live anywhere near a Chinatown so it's necessary to work with what's available, including growing my own Asian vegetables and deciphering what their Botanical/Latin/Scientific and American names are (yard long beans, bitter melon (foo gua), winter melon (doong gua), gai lan, yu choy, ong choy, etc). I have leads on suckling pigs... just haven't taken action yet because I haven't found a definitive recipe that would result in the end product resembling this picture: http://www.webcreationz.co.uk/image-archiv...crispy-duck.htm

from this thread: http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=49705 (Recipes out there, anyone?)

Anyway... I digress...

:wink:

edited for spelling

Edited July 20, 2005 by mudbug (log)

Dejah · July 20, 2005

Poor Mudbug. That suckling pig is haunting your dreams :sad: :laugh: and it's all hzrt's fault!

Tepee: Do you soak the fu gwa in salt water to take away some of the bitterness? Or is there another reason?

I was trying to check the cardboard box of black beans that I buy. Must have thrown it away. It's yellow and black, I think, and has salt encrusted beans with ginger. I just keep 'em in the baggie they come in inside a plastic contain. Doesn't seem to smell in the pantry cupboard.

Before cooking, I rinse them off, and left to soak while I prepare the rest of the ingredients. Then I just mash them with the handle end of my cleaver IN the soaking water. In my restaurant days, the whole bag is dumped into a blender, add double the amount of water, then blend it up for a very short time. This way, there will be solids, not just paste. This is kept in the fridge and scooped out as needed. I like making my own better than the LKK bottled one.

Last week, I steamed basa fillets with black beans, garlic, fresh ginger, scallions. The fillets were rubbed with a little cooking wine, salt, pepper, cornstarch and oil. The rest of the ingredients were spread on top.

I love black bean garlic spareribs with or without fu gwa. :wub:

If I am doing just ribs, I brown seasoned ribs in a cast iron Dutch oven, add black beans, soya sauce, and water to cover. I boil these for about 10 minutes, thicken with a slurry of flour and cornstarch, taste, then cover and put the whole thing into a 350 oven for 45 minutes. We used to make these in full size buffet trays, for the buffet and for individual orders. Can you imagine how tender these would be? The flavour goes right through to the bone. My Mom loves these and requests it often when she comes over for supper. There is always lots of sauce and my kids love this over rice. I have to cook lots of rice on nights like this! :laugh:

Other times, I would make a small dish of fresh ribs, seasoned, topped with mashed black beans and ginger and steam.

Black bean garlic shrimp (chicken, beef, etc) and mixed bell peppers and onion over a hot plate. Incredible aroma...

Black bean gnow yook fu gwa ho fun - my favourite thing to do with ho fun. Kids leave the fu gwa for hubby and me.

Try black bean garlic chili Shanghai noodles, topped with deep fried wonton bits and mint... :wub:

mudbug · July 20, 2005

All right, too early to be reading this and salivating. Sounds delicious - obviously. You are correct Dejah, at this point I'd settle for some good siu yook... or maybe a lot of good siu yook.

If you ever figure out the rand of your black beans, I'd be interested. Ours are not salt encrusted, but there's a good chance you have much more of a selection to choose from.

On the ribs... would it be possible for you to guess measurements/quantities of ingredients? I'm not usually the cook in the house and work much better with specifics. I suppose the biggest questions I have are: what do you use to season the ribs and how much soy sauce before adding water?

I like the initial browning, the cornstarch finish and the oven.

I can taste it already... yes... lots of rice required.

The last suggestion sounds intriguing. Is this with garlic chili paste or fresh minced garlic and red chili peppers?

NancyH · July 20, 2005

I like Barbara Tropp's technique (from "China Moon") of soaking unrinsed black beans in sherry (or rice wine).

Seitch · July 20, 2005

Thanks Seitch. I know how I do it... was just curious how others did it and preferred to use them.
As described above, it depends on what the original form is of the ingredient that you purchase. I assume you're using dry beans and not canned? What brand?
←

The only brand of dried salted blackbeans I've ever seen is the one in a yellow cardboard cylindrical can. I'm not sure what brand it is but it's commonly available. It's so easy to make your own blackbean sauce that I don't think it's worthwhile to buy the canned ones.

Dejah · July 20, 2005

Thanks Seitch. I know how I do it... was just curious how others did it and preferred to use them.
As described above, it depends on what the original form is of the ingredient that you purchase. I assume you're using dry beans and not canned? What brand?
←
The only brand of dried salted blackbeans I've ever seen is the one in a yellow cardboard cylindrical can. I'm not sure what brand it is but it's commonly available. It's so easy to make your own blackbean sauce that I don't think it's worthwhile to buy the canned ones.
←

Well, that sounds like the same brand that I know :laugh: :laugh: ...and neither of us can find the name!

Tepee · July 21, 2005

Tepee: Do you soak the fu gwa in salt water to take away some of the bitterness? Or is there another reason?
←

Yes, Sue-On, it's to take away some of the bitterness.

Thanks, Mudbug, for starting this thread. All the above ways of using dau si sound so good. :wub:

Dejah · July 21, 2005

Tepee: Do you soak the fu gwa in salt water to take away some of the bitterness? Or is there another reason?
←
Yes, Sue-On, it's to take away some of the bitterness.
Thanks, Mudbug, for starting this thread. All the above ways of using dau si sound so good.
←

And yet here I am , wanting to retain all the bitterness.

Tepee · July 21, 2005

Oooo...I love the bitterness too! Problem is 3 out of 5 in the family are between 3 and 11, still having very sensitive taste buds, unlike dinosaur mommy. :sad:

carswell · July 21, 2005

The only brand of dried salted blackbeans I've ever seen is the one in a yellow cardboard cylindrical can. I'm not sure what brand it is but it's commonly available. It's so easy to make your own blackbean sauce that I don't think it's worthwhile to buy the canned ones.
←
Well, that sounds like the same brand that I know ...and neither of us can find the name!
←

Yang Jiang Preserved Beans with Ginger? (There are other brands but this is the one I usually find in Montreal's Chinese stores.)

Dejah · July 21, 2005

The only brand of dried salted blackbeans I've ever seen is the one in a yellow cardboard cylindrical can. I'm not sure what brand it is but it's commonly available. It's so easy to make your own blackbean sauce that I don't think it's worthwhile to buy the canned ones.
←
Well, that sounds like the same brand that I know ...and neither of us can find the name!
←
Yang Jiang Preserved Beans with Ginger? (There are other brands but this is the one I usually find in Montreal's Chinese stores.)
←

BINGO! Thanks carswell. :biggrin:

I know what you mean about others with sensitive taste buds. My kids are older now so they can handle more.

Do you ever make soup with fu gwa? with dried oysters, ginger and pork bones? :wub:

Edited July 21, 2005 by Dejah (log)

hzrt8w · July 21, 2005

What I want to know is, once you open a package of black beans, how do you keep the fragrance from permeating everything else in the refrigerator??? (Even a sealed glass jar doesn't work.)
←

It begs the question: why do you need to refrigerate black beans?

You open up a bag (or a box), just keep the rest in the cupboard. There really is no need to refrigerate them. They are already fermented. :biggrin:

The only thing that would bother me is if you don't use them for a long time while keep them in an open bag, they gradually dry up. I resolve that by keeping them in an air-tight jar. They can be kept for over a year without losing the flavor from my experience.

The traditional Cantonese way of preparing black beans is to rinse them, drain well, and smash them with some garlic or grated/shredded ginger. You need to break the skin so they will release the flavor when stir-fried. I agree with most of what earlier posters said. I want to point one one thing in particular: use a little bit of fresh chili pepper (e.g. jalapeno, serrano, or Thai chili) when you cook with black beans: either in stir-fried dishes or steamed dishes (e.g. pei gwut - spareribs). The chili peppers really bring out the taste of black beans. I usually add a few dashes of dark soy sauce too when stir-frying - just to enrich the taste.

SuzySushi · July 21, 2005

What I want to know is, once you open a package of black beans, how do you keep the fragrance from permeating everything else in the refrigerator??? (Even a sealed glass jar doesn't work.)
←
It begs the question: why do you need to refrigerate black beans?
You open up a bag (or a box), just keep the rest in the cupboard. There really is no need to refrigerate them. They are already fermented.
The only thing that would bother me is if you don't use them for a long time while keep them in an open bag, they gradually dry up. I resolve that by keeping them in an air-tight jar. They can be kept for over a year without losing the flavor from my experience.
←

Well I guess I don't need to! Force of habit! I pretty much refrigerate everything after opening except for dry staples like white rice, wheat flour, and dried mushrooms! (Even my soy sauce goes in the refrigerator as that's what the bottle suggests.)

hzrt8w · July 21, 2005

Yang Jiang Preserved Beans with Ginger? (There are other brands but this is the one I usually find in Montreal's Chinese stores.)
←
BINGO! Thanks carswell.
←

Hey guys... (and ladies...) Try to edit your reply and not overquote a big long post. It will make it easier for readers. :smile:

I used to buy this Yang Jiang [it's Mandarin] brand. But I had bad experience with them... the black beans are too dry and too small. I stopped buying this brand long time ago. I usually just pick up what "looks" about right in the grocery market. When you hold up a plastic bag of fermented black beans, the bag should feel heavy (=> beans are moist). Use your fingers to pinch one of the beans inside the bag. It should be squashed easily (soft). If the beans are dry and hard and have wrinkles, choose a different brand.

Edited July 21, 2005 by hzrt8w (log)

hzrt8w · July 21, 2005

Yes, I'm Chinese (Cantonese). My mom once told me a story of how when I was five, I asked her...
.....Thanks for pointing out the links... I'm going to have to "ask" because I really don't know specifics. I know I can google it but what does "Toysan" mean? Forgive my ignorance... Once I figure it all out... I'll check in.
←

Hey mudbug:

Nay Ho Ma? From one Cantonese to another. Perhaps one Hong Konger to another.

You posted something 2 years ago, then disappeared, and now you came back and stirred up a lot of oldie-old threads? What happened to you? :biggrin: Where were you when they were ganging up against Cantonese food? :wink: We need more fellow Cantonese like you! Cantonese food bland. Ouch, still hurts! :laugh: :laugh:

The forum recently was in the summer doldrum. I thought everybody was at the beach, thinking about margaritas or Coronas than thinking about Joong. Your input has certainly brought a lot of energy to the recent discussions.

Toysan is big village Southwest of GuangZhou (Canton). Famous due to the early Chinese immigration in the 1800's to the USA. I am surprised that you have not heard of it.

Where are you living now? You are not near any China Town? :smile: In Europe?

mudbug · July 21, 2005

Nay Ho Ma?

Ohhh boy, here goes: Gnoh Ho. Ho Yeh... lol... was I even close? :blush:

Where were you when they were ganging up against Cantonese food? We need more fellow Cantonese like you! Cantonese food bland. Ouch, still hurts!

Well heck... I missed all the fun. :sad: Are you referring to the links in post #8 or can you direct me to the battleground?

Cantonese food isn't bland, it's refined. Beautiful compositions of quality ingredients combined to complement each other in flavor, coler, texture, and density - all in balance. Nothing overpowering, pleasantly allowing the ingredients to speak for themselves in harmony.

Besides... how many people have had truly "authentic" (there's a thread on this word floating around) Cantonese dishes which are not altered for restaurants? Personally, I've always had a tough time eating at Asian restaurants because most of the dinner food has been Westernized and I don't care for it. Is it just me? :unsure:

When I got older and started eating more "American" food, I could not for the life of me figure out how anyone could eat the meat in anything because it was always so tough, dry, bland - ick! I grew up with meat that was, as we like to say, "soft". (I love when they say that on Iron Chef. I empathize completely.) So soft in fact - that when cooked properly - you can get chicken breast to be fully cooked and yet literally melt in your mouth. Little did I know the standards had been set when I was young...

There is an interesting description of Chinese cuisines and their differences at this blog from someone who has been teaching Asian cookery for years:

http://tigerberries.blogspot.com/2005_01_0...es_archive.html

Hit [control] + [F] on your keyboard to "Find" and type in: January 26

Then hit return. It will take you to the complete entry.

By contrast, the style of Cantonese cookery is one of restraint and sublime simplicity. The cooking of Canton is the regional style most highly regarded by Chinese gastronomes, in part because of the great respect paid to the quality and freshness of the ingredients used in creating a dish. Pure, fresh meat, seafood and vegetables are skillfully cooked and adorned with a minimum of condiments in order to bring out the natural fragrance, color and flavor inherent to the raw ingredients. There is great emphasis placed upon the aesthetic properties of food in Cantonese cuisine, and there is a lot of attention paid to contrasting colors, textures, tastes and scents of each dish. The Cantonese are particularly known for their stir-fried dishes where brilliantly hued crisp vegetables contrast with meltingly tender meat, which are often enhanced with one or two judiciously applied condiments like light-colored soy sauce or fermented black beans.

I thought everybody was at the beach, thinking about margaritas or Coronas than thinking about Joong. Your input has certainly brought a lot of energy to the recent discussions.

You know... I searched before posting. Thought for sure this place would have had an existing thread on this topic by now. :shock: Was quite surprised none and also to find the small the quantity of threads in this particular niche. I know people are interested in it... Happy to stir the cornstarch and liven things up...

I probably have heard of Toysan and don't realize it. Then again... you never know. What's the phonetic pronounciation? Thanks for the definition. I certainly don't want to feel unworthy of my heritage due to my ignorance, but if you're not around people who talk about it, or otherwise exposed to the information, you don't know. We're all here to learn.... right? :smile:

Where are you living now? You are not near any China Town? In Europe?

Europe, eh? Well... not so much. Try: Missouri. ( :rolleyes: heh) Does that put things in perspective? Don't get me wrong... some of the most unassuming small towns have a surprising selection of Asian ingredients.. but it's never the same without at least having a decent Chinatown where you can get a good dim sum to fill your tummy and satisfy the taste buds. :biggrin:

Edited July 21, 2005 by mudbug (log)

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