Paris 1 or 2 stars for great summer family dining

[cassis]

As new member to this board I would like to thank Bux and others for all of the great advice. Wife and I are touring Europe with our 5 kids ages 15-23 in mid July. Looking forward to dining in Paris during our 4 night stay there. Third visit for the older adults who love multi textured and flavor foods although not big on most organ meats. The rest of the group are polite experienced travelers and cruised the med last summer.  Two of the youngsters are a bit limited in their eating but love chicken, onion soup, pasta, potatoes, french bread, apple tarts, souffles, creme brulee kind of stuff.  The rest of us are definitely into the dining experience.  Our French is very basic.  We have booked Jules Verne for lunch (dress code anyone?).  Would like to keep the tab under $700 excluding wine, which we love. Which 1 or 2 stars would offer cooking approaching Astrance but still offer something simpler for the two youngest.  Would Magnolias, Carre de Feuillants, Violon D'Ingres, Muses, Astor, Faugeron, Astrance, Ambassadeurs, Obelisque, Bar Vendome, Bath's, Braisiere, Celadon, Chiberta, Clovis, Vernet, Jamin, Jardin des Cygnes, Osteria, or Bristol work? Which Bistros? Would L'Ami Louis, Benoit, La Regalde, Chez Pauline, Chez Vincent, Bistrot Papillon, Bofinger, Cafe Angel, or Chez Michel work? Any other suggestions would be appreciated. Will be in Geneva for a couple of nights.  Any thoughts for that area?

[Miguel Gierbolini]

I went to the Jules Verne on February 2001.  I did not notice any dress code.  Because it was a cold day, most people, as I was, were wearing sweaters.   Nothing formal.  It was a fun place to go.

[cassis]

Hopefully, no sweater will be needed in July. Still looking for restaurants that offer a combination of fine dining and still have onion soup, chicken, and creme brulee for my teenager.  Any ideas out there?

[dallardice]

Don't think Carre des Feuillants would work - we ate there Monday and the food and ambience wonderful, but a very adult space and sophisticated food.  Very friendly service and fluent in English (but not automatically switching when you want to practice French), so I'm sure they'd be welcoming, but the atmosphere, while friendly, was formal.  Cost for two of us, 4 courses, 2 bottles of middle-priced wine was €350.

I'd recommend La Grande Cascade for location and family-friendliness - there were a few large groups of mixed-age there on Sunday - but would have to mark it down on service (patronising and rushed) and cost (€560 for two).  Might be reasonable for lunch though.

[cassis]

Thanks for the advice.  Too Grande for me :wow: . What were you drinking ? Osteria got a good review in Zagat.  Anyone been there yet?

[dallardice]

I'd have to check my notes to be sure but a Ch. Montus Cuvee Prestige Madiran 95 at €100, and then 50cl of a dessert Pacherenc de Vic Bilh at €60.  And a couple of glasses of fizz as an aperitif - so the food did come to nearly €400.   :wow:

[cassis]

Zagat  pegs it at 96 euros for dinner. Are they that unreliable? Is the prix fix the 96 euro range?

[dallardice]

Yes, I think Zagat is unreliable in this respect (sorry), although we did have four courses, with Cheese and Dessert.  The menu dégustation is €145/head, although they have a menu d'affaires (which is not available at weekends) for €59.  As I said, we found Carré des Feuillants cheaper, which I think Zagat puts at €10/head higher.

[cassis]

Guy Savoy mentions a discovery menu for young people.  May be only at his bistros but not clear.  Anyone seen this menu and it's price range?

[cassis]

Family dining in the UK,Paris, Champagne, Burgundy , Switzerland, and Italy, during our recent three- week vacation in Europe was memorable. Our French is poor and we did carry a menu translator but did not use it very often. In general the menus were explained to us in English either verbally or by a staff person with very good command of english. Our group of seven included a 14 and 17 year old who have limited items they enjoy but still were wowed and welcomed by many of the places we dined. We ordered ala carte and with plenty of Bresse Chicken, bread, and dessert after dessert for them we were all very happy with our "fine dining". We were unable to do any complete menus of the day because this would require pretty much everyone to order the complete multi-course menu, but I never felt this was much of a problem and would not have given up the family experience in exchange for sampling more courses.

Number one on the young people's list was lunch at Jules Verne. A gorgeous July day found us bypassing the lines and marveling at the ride up the Eiffel. With modern decor, eye popping views, and a fair number of other well behaved international families around we felt comfortable and privileged to be sampling the cuisine of Alain Reix. Coke ($7) and champagne ($16) to start, amuse of Salmon, cream, and gelatin to get us interested. First courses included crab bread with cream of shrimp ($36) or shrimp ravioli ($42), mains included Bresse chicken ($45), Veal, Brochettes of Langoustine. Desserts included passion fruit souffle, rhubarb ice cream, choc. mousse with choc. cake with choc. sauce and whipped cream followed by small tarts, macaroons, caramel candy, and then choc. truffles ($15). 1998 Gewurtz V.T. at $122 was the perfect accompaniment. Bill came to $763 for seven. Skipping a first course for most of the teens was still plenty for them to eat and would put their tab at about $75 for a coke, bread, amuse, chicken, dreamy mashed potatoes, and multiple desserts.

We dined at multiple starred restaurants, and in our minds Jules Verne was easily the best 1 star and clearly deserves it's second star back. Our kids are back to school now and life moves on but we are all still carrying fond memories of our lunch at the Eiffel.

I will find time later to share our many extraordinary family dining experiences on this site and United Kingdom. Bottom line with some limited communication to the restaurant ahead of time you can quickly find out if they are interested in slightly modifying their menu so that even your finicky eaters can share in dining in the temples. As long as they are willing to act as young polite people for three hours I recommend giving it a try.

[Bux]

It's no surprise to me that a reasonably sane family with members of widely different ages, could enjoy fine dining in France as a focal point of most days. Leaving aside certain subjective decisions and interests I'm sure it could be done at varying price levels and degrees of formality. I'd be curious to hear about some of the other restaurants on your trip.

[cassis]

Near our hotel lunch at Laduree with tea, sandwiches, macaroons, chocolate croissants, strawberry jam that was yummy, and pastries was a nice introduction to Paris. Nearby Fauchon provided some delicious pastry and bread take out treats for breakfast.

The first night was full of history in the small jewel box dining room of M. Martin at the 3 star Grand Vefour. M. Martin was there in his whites to greet the guests at the door. Nice touch. Our group of seven did not do well at the somewhat small table with legs that seemed to get in the way. The staff was attentive, helpful, and at times funny. Our waiter spoke perfect English and gave us the interesting history of the restaurant and a complete menu rendition in English. Champagne by Taittinger to start ($16). Amusee time 2 including salmon with sour cream, chives, and a puree of celery root (wow). Starters of Lobster salad with truffle vinaigrette ($89), Homard de Bretagne jus au pomelo ($82), fois gras ravioli with truffle sauce ($66). Mains of roast Bresse chicken ($48), fantastic duck with orange citrus ($62), filet of sole au caviar not enjoyed ($84), vegetable sides and puree out of this world with hints of anise, cheese for some, and then a seemingly non-ending parade of mini-pastries, macaroons, jellies, lemon grass cake, tarts, chocolate mousse with caramel sauce, raspberries in pastry, ice cream, pound cake with cream, my what an ending. 1989 Montrose was very good at $240 and 1998 Gewurztraminer 1998 VT Dom. P. Blanck was so delicious ($130). Total Euros $1506 for seven, with most but not all of us having entrees and main. A souvenir menu and information on Grand Vefour was presented upon request at the end of the evening.

A wonderful evening, we will always remember as our first 3 star together as a family. The total experience was two-three stars at Paris three star prices. The history of the surrounds, the service and the handling of vegetable sides here were highlights. We never felt out of place, everyone enjoyed themselves, they all found food they loved, and I now knew my group was in for the time of their life. For someone who loves fine dining and loves his family it was just what I needed to set the table for what was to continue to come for the next two weeks. I spent a lot of time researching the restaurants and being sure to communicate with them my special needs. I had toyed with the idea of dividing up for dinner but I am grateful my wife nixed that idea. I must mention the Concierge at the hotel, who weighed every bit of 220 pounds, warned me my itinerary was to put in mildly was a bit too ambitious. My kids found by avoiding a starter they were fine, I could not bring myself to such a sacrifice. I do not regret the 10 pounds I gained which netted only a +5 pounds after all of the walking. We did have a van, which made driving to Champagne, Versailles, and evening drives around Paris a delight. With a detailed city map showing which way the streets go it is very doable.

The following evening we dined at Le Souffle. This was near the hotel and we had onion soup, beef filet, duck, chicken, and of course chocolate soufflé. Very cheap at about $30 per person.

The following day we drove from Paris to Champagne. We left around 10 AM and drove to Epernay and then to Les Crayeres for the classy wonderful Boyer treatment. Champagne and amusee of tuna and vegetables in pastry dough to start in the bar as opposed to the patio because a bit of rain is in the air. No loss as we gather around the large table surrounded by bay windows overlooking the patio and flowers. The menu is thoroughly explained to us in English and our orders are taken. We are then taken to the same type table in the dining room. Every item on the table was exquisite, the service required virtually no directions, and the whole experience was 3 star. Amusee of shrimp in a truffle cream sauce. Hot breads are served. Starters include an incredible spicy lobster roll and salmon with caviar cream. Mains are lamb over risotto, sea bass, chicken of course, cote de boeuf for two (a bit tough but delicious), great puree of potatoes, 1995 Cos Estournal, and the usually wonderful array of treats and chocolate cake with cream and cherries, crème brulle, and autographed menus and tour of the grounds as the rain ceases. Magical 3 star experience. About $100 per person for food or about the same as Jules Verne lunch and half the cost of the Paris 3 star dinner experience. Not an overly fair comparison but still interesting.

After interesting tours at Taittinger, visiting the cathedral we drive back to Paris to unwind and gather ourselves for dinner at 1 star Il Cortile. Smoking would damper the evening in the rather small dining room. The food was good with cold broccoli puree, tempura shrimp with salad, tuna tartar with tomato puree, macaroni for the kids, John Dori, Veal Piccatta, and risotto with saffron and chicken. About $50 per person.

Our last dinner was at 2 star Michel Rostang. We were welcomed by a gracious staff and M. Rostang. Our waiter smoke perfect English and explained the menu in detail. The room was non-smoking with a view of the kitchen. Presentations, service, quality of food, wine list, were all 3 star status. Sardine puree on toast, artichoke puree, lobster salad prepared tableside twelve ways, escargots, lobster egg roll, duck with cherries and lobster cream sauce, the biggest most delicious grosse sole de ligne epaisse ever, requisite Bresse chicken, shrimp in lobster sauce, pike fish soufflé, veal chop, melon sorbet, caramel ice cream, strawberries, caramel candy to die for, tarts, mint marshmallows, laced cookies, chocolate mouse, chocolate soufflé, Grand Marnier Soufflé, tour of the cellars (Latour from almost every year worth having), 1990 Pichon Barron ($300), 1988 S.G.N Ostertag ($100), the autographed menus, oh my I do not know how it could have been any better. The food was a bit more interesting and modern than Grand Vefour. What a way to say goodbye. An evening drive up to Montmartre and then around the Arc de Triomphe helped put it all away in the memory bank.

The next day we drove to Geneva and stopped off in Burgundy at Lameloise for 3 star lunch. Charming French Country luxury well worth the slight detour. Dress can be casual but my ill advised but comfortable travel shorts did not meet with approving eyes so I changed as I should have to start with. Table is lovely, room is a delight, and everyone is very helpful and friendly for the French. Menu is clearly explained in English. Cheese straws, stuffed tomatoes with cheese and cream, shrimp wrapped in Parmesan, small cups of salmon mouse with crab, ravioli with truffles, and we have not even gotten to starters yet. Lobster in tomato puree vinaigrette, cold lobster wrapped in pastry, lamb in pastry with spinach pate, zucchini and eggplant with tomatoes over potatoes, Bresse chicken, soufflé potatoes and an uncountable number of desserts including small cups of vanilla sauce with whipped cream and raspberries, trays of macaroons, coconut meringue, fruit tarts, candied fruits, and then incredible chocolate concoctions, ice creams, sorbets, apple tart, ending with chocolate truffles. Could not be improved upon and was $100 per person.

Well from there the food could only decline but the scenery certainly did not as we moved on to the French and Swiss Alps. Thanks for all of the advice. I knew there was some risk in taking this trip and planning at this quality level. I worried for naught. Near the end my most rebellious gave me the longest biggest hug and now wants to become a lawyer so someday he can afford to take his family on this kind of trip.