Ordering coffee

[Margaret Pilgrim]

I ran across this list of coffee names that may take some of the guesswork out of ordering. I have no idea if these are traditional or defined by law.

café express: 7cl water for 7gm ground coffee

café allongé: 14cl water for 7gm ground coffee

café américain: 20cl water for 7gm ground coffee

café noir: 14cl water for 14gm ground coffee

café noisette: 7cl café express with a teardrop of millk

café créme: 7cl café espress with 4cl of milk; also called a petit café au lait

grand créme: 14cl café espress with about 7cl of milk; also clled grand café au lait

Of course, none of these explain the vagueries of my ordering café au lait at breakfast and having my tray arrive with anywhere from 25cl to 50cl of both/either coffee and hot milk.

[Bux]

And I've not found a reliable difference between ordering café, café noir, and express.

[FaustianBargain]

And I've not found a reliable difference between ordering café, café noir, and express.

←

We Don't Serve That Here

Customer: A hot coffee, please.

Cashier: Huh?

--Starbucks, 28th & 3rd

[Ptipois]

And I've not found a reliable difference between ordering café, café noir, and express.

←

Whatever you order, you get what their machine churns out

[Bux]

Actually, I wasn't as accurate as I could have been. In a cafe I will get whatever I get, usually an express if they have the proper machine which is common today. At breakfast in a hotel, assuming it's one of some note with a bar or restaurant, "café noir" will get me a pot of strong coffee, but not an espresso. If I want an espresso, I have to order one specifically. Then again most people are having a pot of coffee with a pot of warm milk.

[menton1]

Are we talking about France here? In a cafe, ordering a "café" will ALWAYS get you an espresso-- And most French people order a "Crème" when they want what Americans call a Café au Lait.

[zeitoun]

I ran across this list of coffee names that may take some of the guesswork out of ordering. I have no idea if these are traditional or defined by law.

café express:  7cl water for 7gm ground coffee

café allongé:  14cl water for 7gm ground coffee

café américain:  20cl water for 7gm ground coffee

café noir:  14cl water for 14gm ground coffee

café noisette:  7cl café express with a teardrop of millk

café créme:  7cl café espress with 4cl of milk; also called a petit café au lait

grand créme: 14cl café espress with about 7cl of milk; also clled grand café au lait

←

There is also café serré which is a concentrated version of half the size of an traditional expresso.

I did two or three summer stints while in high school in a popular italian trattoria in Paris. For some reason, Italian tourists always ordered café serré or caffè ristretto as they called it.

It seemed to me that serving a French regular expresso to the average Italian was like serving a café allongé to the average French. Is this true?

[chefzadi]

It seemed to me that serving a French regular expresso to the average Italian was like serving a café allongé to the average French. Is this true?

I see what you mean. But I think the Italian espresso is a bit stronger than a French café serré.

My wife and I had our wedding dinner at an Italian restaurant in Los Angeles. Very nice place. When we were discussing the menu, the manager was very gracious and kind. He very politely and poetically in that round about way that people who's native tongue is a romance langauge told me that Italian presentation wouldn't be as fussy as French and he praised French food liberally. But the French just don't know how to make espresso.

[zeitoun]

Italian presentation wouldn't be as fussy as French and he praised French food liberally. But the French just don't know how to make espresso. 

←

And yes, i forgot to mention that part, I must have heard this a hundred times!!!!

[Margaret Pilgrim]

It seemed to me that serving a French regular expresso to the average Italian was like serving a café allongé to the average French. Is this true?

←

Well, I think so; actually, without a doubt! And then we can consider ordering coffee in Athens or Istanbul. But this thread refered to ordering in France. In fact, the information I posted came from "France" magazine. The descriptions I listed are certainly arbitrary and vary from place to place and form level of service to level of service. Once again, ordering coffee in France is an experience!

[chefzadi]

Once again, ordering coffee in France is an experience! biggrin.gif

I only order cafe. I think most of the other stuff is for tourists.

This is where I will duck and run...

[Margaret Pilgrim]

This is where I will duck and run...

←

No need!

My orders vary thoughout the day. At breakfast in my hotel, I will call for a cafe au lait. Later at a street stand, and before 8am, I will ask for a cafe creme. At a cafe or after lunch I will order a cafe. After dinner, I make sure they will bring me a deca, or decaffeine exprès. Different orders for different times of day.

[Margaret Pilgrim]

And I've not found a reliable difference between ordering café, café noir, and express.

←

Actually, if you read the proportions of grounds to water, and if you agree that a café and an express are the same, your three are the same. A café noir is simply a double express. The difference will be, I'm sure, evident in the check!

[chefzadi]

This is where I will duck and run...

←

No need!

My orders vary thoughout the day. At breakfast in my hotel, I will call for a cafe au lait. Later at a street stand, and before 8am, I will ask for a cafe creme. At a cafe or after lunch I will order a cafe. After dinner, I make sure they will bring me a deca, or decaffeine exprès. Different orders for different times of day.

←

This reminds me of the time my wife orderd coffee in Paris (as she has hundreds of times) . The waiter was trying to be exceedingly polite and he asked her if she wanted American coffee. We both looked at him with confusion. He of course apologized. We of course said no offense was taken.

[bleudauvergne]

Here's a link to some talk about coffee when Owen went to Paris in January 2005. It's got a happy ending too...

I went through a phase when I was ordering cafe alongees every day. And one day I knew I needed a double, so I ordered a double allongee. I watched the lady make it and she only put one espresso in but more water than usual. I said there wasn't enough coffee in the cup, and she topped the existing elongated coffee off with water right in front of me and said "there. satisfied?"

I normally just order a coffee and a glass of water these days.

[chefzadi]

Italian presentation wouldn't be as fussy as French and he praised French food liberally. But the French just don't know how to make espresso. 

←

And yes, i forgot to mention that part, I must have heard this a hundred times!!!!

←

The thing is it's not the French, Italians or the Spanish that make the best coffee.

Arabica beans, everyone knows who makes the best coffee in the world.

I said there wasn't enough coffee in the cup, and she topped the existing elongated coffee off with water right in front of me and said "there. satisfied?"

Sounds like a French thing to do. Actually you could have complained to the manager and by unwritten French "law" they would have had to make it "correctly." That is if you can convince them that they did it wrong...

[Margaret Pilgrim]

That is if you can convince them that they did it wrong...

←

There is something in the French psyche that does not allow for being in the wrong.

[menton1]

The thing is it's not the French, Italians or the Spanish that make the best coffee.

Arabica beans, everyone knows who makes the best coffee in the world. 

The fact is, Arabica beans have not come from Arabia in over 1000 years. The Arabica bean varieties today come from South and Central America, and a smaller quantity from Kenya and Ethiopia.