Char Siu

[Ben Hong]

In any language there is a tendency to slur or liaise words together, especially if you have the fluency of a native speaker. That's why it is so pleasurable to listen to someone speak a language the way it is meant to be spoken, without the slurring, in the case of English, eg: Richard Burton, Queen Elizabeth, certain BBC news readers.

Mm ho are two distinct words, or should be although it is very common to hear them slurred into what sounds like one word. A more common sound is mm mo, where the "h" is not distinctly heard, especially in hurried conversation.

[hzrt8w]

That's why it is so pleasurable to listen to someone speak a language the way it is meant to be spoken, without the slurring, in the case of English, eg: Richard Burton, Queen Elizabeth, certain BBC news readers.

The England Queen better speaks clear English.

Speaking the language clearly without slurring is probably a requirement of any news readers. I enjoyed watching the news reported by Beijing TV Station and admired so much the standard Mandarin pronounciations. Likewise I also enjoyed watching Jade TV Station in Hong Kong for the (well, more or less) standard Cantonese pronounciations.

[chengb02]

I enjoyed watching the news reported by Beijing TV Station and admired so much the standard Mandarin pronounciations.

you mean you don't enjoy them for the riveting content like the traditional first 10 minutes about how Chinese government officials met with their counterparts from nations nobody has ever heard of before?

okay, sorry for that...actually watching CCTV is great as I love hearing the very standard pronounciations in rapid fire...but for my money, I'd much prefer the slang and destruction of the language in the hands of your average Beijing taxi driver.

Edited August 9, 2004 by chengb02 (log)

[Jason Perlow]

Who here has made Char Siu at home?

Tonight, I sort of made an improvisational Char Siu inspired dish using center cut pork chops:

I marinated the pork chops in soy sauce (kikkoman type), chopped scallion, grated ginger, sesame oil, chinese rice wine, sherry, and sugar for 3 hours in a vaccum container, and then brushed a commercial Char Siu bbq sauce (LEE KUM KEE) on it, baked for like 30 minutes, and broiled them for a few minutes to caramelize the bbq sauce.

It came out very tasty, pork was juicy, but not really like real Char Siu.

What cut of meat is used in a real char siu? What is the correct marinade? What is a good home made Char Siu glaze?

[chan25]

*puts hand up*

I did, and this recipe worked wonderfully. First time I actually saw food disappear that quickly.

Renee also came up with a slight variation here.

I am planning to try this over Thanksgiving.

Never did manage to find maltose though.

[Jason Perlow]

*puts hand up*

I did, and this recipe worked wonderfully. First time I actually saw food disappear that quickly.

Renee also came up with a slight variation here.

I am planning to try this over Thanksgiving.

Never did manage to find maltose though. 

←

Very cool website. Nice writeup too.

[Yuki]

Pork chop would be too lean and rough for char siu, I use the shoulder butt for this.

Can anyone confirm that 梅頭 is shoulder butt?

My grandma likes to glaze some honey on the pork when it is in the oven at the last minute.

[Jason Perlow]

Actually, the pork chops were good, as Char Siu flavored pork chops. But definitely not the real deal.

I'll buy some shoulder butt and pork loin or perhaps a pork roast to try this again.

[hzrt8w]

Who here has made Char Siu at home?

←

I have posted a recipe for home made Chinese BBQ pork a little while back.

(Recipe here)

Edited November 11, 2004 by hzrt8w (log)

[melonpan]

*puts hand up*

I did, and this recipe worked wonderfully. First time I actually saw food disappear that quickly.

Renee also came up with a slight variation here.

I am planning to try this over Thanksgiving.

Never did manage to find maltose though. 

*raises another hand*

me too!

made july 19, 2004 using <a href="http://www.shiokadelicious.com/shiokadelicious/2004/07/imbb_6_char_sie.html">renee's char siew recipe</a>. used boneless pork shoulder (not tenderloin), maltose (not honey) and did not use food coloring. (did not cook for charred bits.)

very tasty! not obnoxiously sweet, nor too salty.

<center><img src="http://www.rawbw.com/~coconut/temp/charSiew.jpg"> <img src="http://www.rawbw.com/~coconut/temp/charSiew2.jpg"><p></center>

i have made it twice more since then. i have not tried the ribs version, but that may be next up. yums!

id like to add that im a huge fan of <a href="http://www.shiokadelicious.com/shiokadelicious/">renees blog</a>. great schtuff.

[Yuki]

Most people make home style char siu, and buy restaurant style char siu. Home style usually just involves some garlic, ginger, soya sauce, sugar, salt, wine and Lee Kum Kee char siu sauce. I would be interested in knowing how to get restaurant style char siu at home.

[BettyK]

Who here has made Char Siu at home?

←

I have posted a recipe for home made Chinese BBQ pork a little while back.

(Recipe here)

←

Jason, follow hzrt8w's recipe...it's the best. If you don't mind a little fat, use pork butt/shoulder for this. If you like a lot of crunchies I suggest you make a few diagonal cuts in opposite directions, sort of like this ---\---/---\--- but don't cut all the way through. I think it looks more authentic and it helps drain some of the fat. Don't forget the pan of water.

hzrt8w, I just made 2 kgs of char siu following your recipe...delicious. We really enjoy

it and now I have some nicely vacuum packed the freezer. I could eat this everyday.

[itch22]

Who here has made Char Siu at home?

←

I have posted a recipe for home made Chinese BBQ pork a little while back.

(Recipe here)

←

What, exactly, is Chinese Marinade? One could easily make their own, has anyone tried it?

EDIT:

From Lee Kum Kee's site:

Chinese Marinade

Lee Kum Kee Chinese Marinade is a ready-to-use natural cooking sauce made from an exotic blend of selected Chinese spices. Use this marinade to poach chicken, goose or other meat dishes.

Package Size : 14 fl oz, 24 fl oz

Ingredients : Water, Sugar, Soy Sauce ( Water, Salt, Soybean, Wheat Flour ), Salt, Spice Extract, Caramel Color.

Edited November 11, 2004 by itch22 (log)

[Transparent]

I have no idea what LKK's Chinese Marinade is. However, whatever marinading my family does is just soy sauce, rice wine, and cornstarch.

[itch22]

The only ingredient in LKK's marinade that is not listed in the "spice extract", but I wonder if this isn't just 5-spice powder and possibly MSG.

[Dejah]

The only ingredient in LKK's marinade that is not listed in the "spice extract", but I wonder if this isn't just 5-spice powder and possibly MSG.

←

5-spice powder is definitely an essential ingredient for char siu marinate.

As mentioned in another thread, bend poultry skewers into S hooks to hang the pork strips on an oven rack. Be sure to put a tray of water under the meat before roasting, or you will have a major fire in your oven!

[trillium]

I make char siu at home too, I like using the shoulder, not the loin, because it's juicier (ok, fattier). I make my own marinade, and I think one of the essential things is the fermented soya bean paste (I make it from Yeo's soya beans, or use the pre-mashed Thai one), along with the 5-spices and garlic. I cook it very similiarly to what hzrt8w posted. And Dejah has it spot on, you need to hang it, much easier to cook it that way. I use heavy duty paper clips that I've bent into an S shape, and crank up the heat at the end to get browned, charred bits. And I totally agree that the pan of water underneath is pretty important!

regards,

trillium

[itch22]

When cutting up the pork, what dimensions have worked best for you?

(edited for spelling)

Edited November 12, 2004 by itch22 (log)

[Dejah]

When cutting up the prok, what demensions have worked best for you?

←

I like to cut my shoulder butt into at least 2.5 to 3" thick by about 6-8" long. The length depends on how high you can place your rack for hanging. I like the "strips" thick so that the outside can get crispy bits, but the inside stays moist. The pan of water will prevent a fire, as well, it will keep the meat moist.

I used a special cut in my restaurant, but can't think of the name at the moment. It used to come in big chunks in cryovac bags. I need to call my old supplier.

[hzrt8w]

BettyK: glad you like the recipe.

I think the name Chinese Marinade may have been used only by Lee Kum Kee. This English translation is not well known, or not well agreed upon. The Chinese name 卤水 (Lau Shui [Mandarin]), however, is very well known in both Northern and Southern style Chinese cookings. It is basically a mixture of soy sauce, water, five spices and other ingredients. Some cooks may not use the ready-made mix and opt to cook with soy sauce and five spices. The result would be similar.

I agree that there are many different approaches in making Char Siu. They all revolve around using garlic, soy sauce, brown bean paste, five spices, sugar, honey and such. Just go with whichever recipes that fit your taste. There really is no standard. Over the years I had all kinds of Char Siu from restaurants. Some are good ones, some are really really good ones.

As far as the cut of meat... Lean cuts usually turn out a bit dry. Fatty cuts are softer and juicier. My wife and I opt to stay away from fatty pork, so we trade it off in taste. I don't like buying Char Siu from restaurants any more because they use really fatty cuts.

I agree that the S-hook (thanks jo-mel!) and a pan of water in the oven make a world of difference.

As far as dimension... I typically cut mine about 1 inch by 2 inch. You don't want it too thick because you risk not having the meat cooked through. You don't want it too thin because you risk burning the surface too soon (and it dries up).

It is important to remember to bake the pork in low temperature (e.g. 300F) first for 1 to 1.5 hour (don't baste the pork yet). Then turn up the temperature to 400F in the last 0.5 hour after basting. This will achieve the caramelized effect on surface and make the pork shinny.

Edited November 12, 2004 by hzrt8w (log)

[Dejah]

hzrt,

Didn't you revise your cooking time for char sui when we discussed that in another thread?

It still seems like excessive cooking time if the strips are 1"x2".

I do about 6 strips at a time at home, at 400F for 45 minutes. This way, the outside has charred bits but the inside is cooked and moist.

[franktex]

Is it possible that Maltose (malt sugar) is the same as Malt Extract, found in homebrew shops? I could not find it at the asian market, or not too much online either. I have tried to make this many times and gave up, but this recipe looks like it might do.

[hzrt8w]

hzrt,

Didn't you revise your cooking time for char sui when we discussed that in another thread?

It still seems like excessive cooking time if the strips are 1"x2".

←

I think you are right. I was afraid that cooking at 400F would char the outside and leave the inside still raw. Perhaps I should cut the pieces bigger, and experiment with different cooking time.

One thing to mention: making condiment for char siu...

on a small dish, put in 3 tsp of hoisin sauce, 3 tsp of mustard (dissolved in water), and drip in 2-3 tsp of sesame oil on top. And a dish of light soy sauce on the side.

We dropped by Milpitas about 2 months ago on the way to Monterey. We went to a Chinese restaurant called "Won Kee". Their char siu is excellent! Very juicy, soft, has rich BBQ flavor, and sweet (I can taste the honey). The best one I had for a while.

[itch22]

What I find a little confusing, is everyone so far has referred to Char Siu as BBQ but no one has mentioned cooking it over a charcoal grill or a woodfire.

[hzrt8w]

What I find a little confusing, is everyone so far has referred to Char Siu as BBQ but no one has mentioned cooking it over a charcoal grill or a woodfire.

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I think stickly speaking the term "barbeque" is referring to cooking in slow heat in an oven. When you grill something over open fire, it should be called "grilled". A lot of people mis-labelled their dish. (e.g. "Come to my house to do some barbeque!", and they refer to grilling some hamburger patties on a home "BBQ" stove)